Thinker Posted September 3, 2003 Posted September 3, 2003 I was fondling my rack Sunday after an outing on Total Soul and found a biner with some sharp grooves gouged in it, presumably by bolt hangars, some of which were sharp enough to damage a rope. A closer inspection of my rack showed 7 biners with enough damage that I wanted take a small jeweler's file to....which I did. The photos below were taken after a small amount of filing...kind of an afterthought. My questions are: 1. Is there anything else that could cause such damage? 2. How many of you (other than sprot climbers) have biners dedicated to bolts? (i.e. once you clip them to a bolt you'll never clip them to a rope or sling.) 3. How long has it been since you've fondled (inspected) YOUR biners? Quote
erik Posted September 3, 2003 Posted September 3, 2003 i have sport spefic draws. and i fondle all my gear all the time, as i have no friends! good question!?!?! i wonder what does cause that? are you whipping on them? Quote
bunglehead Posted September 3, 2003 Posted September 3, 2003 Those might be trouble. I don't have specific bolt biners, but I do have a set o' draws for sporto stuff. I'm gonna check my biners out tonight. Quote
iain Posted September 3, 2003 Posted September 3, 2003 what's weird is that those grooves are on the narrow end of the biner (looks like a bd enduro?). Unusual to be hanging from a bolt at that end. Quote
Thinker Posted September 3, 2003 Author Posted September 3, 2003 A couple of them were definitely lockers I've used for toproping (clipped to bolts.) Others are non-lockers that, I'm assuming, I've fallen on or lowered off of. I don't take many whippers...I'm too much of a wuss to put myself in that situation very often. Quote
Coopah Posted September 3, 2003 Posted September 3, 2003 Maybe I am being overly cautious but if those were my biners I would immediately retire them to another purpose besides climbing. That is some fairly significant deformity... Quote
lummox Posted September 4, 2003 Posted September 4, 2003 i got top and bottom designated on my draws for just the reason you found. i wont say anything more about the top gettin the groove. Quote
allthumbs Posted September 4, 2003 Posted September 4, 2003 erik said: i fondle all my gear all the time, as i have no friends! I'm fondling my Gold Combat .45 right now. Quote
Alpinfox Posted September 4, 2003 Posted September 4, 2003 Those look like snaffle tooth marks to me. Have you been coating your biners in peanut butter? Quote
Cpt.Caveman Posted September 4, 2003 Posted September 4, 2003 IF it's a big groove get a new one and - throw away any suspect gear. If you think that's suspect climb on edelweiss ropes. Just kidding. I dont know dude- I bet I have some markings like those. I dont think I have replaced most of my shit in at least 5 years. I have some as old as 9 years. Filing the shit down is probably a good idea. I usually have more worries than that but not being elitist since I leave biners around once in a while so my rack rotates but not a lot. Maybe the best spot for this is a climbing magazine. My guess is that they will pan to the manufactuer with the comments like buy new gear. For me if I see weird shit I throw it away. But those look pretty miniscule to me- an opinion that you may disagree with. -RB Quote
leejams Posted September 4, 2003 Posted September 4, 2003 Yeah and fiddle with that jammed little cam while yer at it. Story:slight finger locked off, found the perfect cam on thinker's rack to get in first try. Pulled the trigger and the thing went boing and pretty much folded up on itself??? Tried a few more times and no way. Tried another piece,wrong fit and nothing else. Had to suck it up and go. It's all good and made it interesting. Quote
Thinker Posted September 4, 2003 Author Posted September 4, 2003 The grooves are really quite small, and the only ones I really worry about are the ones with sharp edges or snags that could damage nylon fibers. I've just touched them up enough with a file that so they're not sharp. LeeJams gunned the 10b sections of Total Soul Sunday. It was a pleasure to watch after seeing him on his very first rock climbs just a few short years ago. Anyone else have problems with the trigger wires slipping thru the trigger and becoming 'unequalized' on Metolius TCUs ? My yellow one does it at the worst times, as Lee found out. Quote
richard_noggin Posted September 4, 2003 Posted September 4, 2003 Stop hang dog'n the hard sport routes and that won't happen to your biners! It's all bout cracks sport climbing is neither! Quote
RuMR Posted September 4, 2003 Posted September 4, 2003 erik said: i have sport spefic draws. and i fondle all my gear all the time, as i have no friends! good question!?!?! i wonder what does cause that? are you whipping on them? It looks like hanger gouges...definitely caused by metal on metal...I wouldn't sweat them, but as Ray said, if you're even a little concerned, pitch 'em for peace of mind...biners are cheap Quote
leejams Posted September 4, 2003 Posted September 4, 2003 Got thinking about those biners last night. I think I would wing and fling em. Reflecting on the big guy that took a fatal fall at vantage last year. If I remember correctly there was some suspect biner or something at the top. Could be wrong??? Quote
Off_White Posted September 4, 2003 Posted September 4, 2003 I thought the Goran accident involved possibly cross-loaded or gate open load on the biner. I doubt those grooves would cause a failure, but as others have noted, if it makes you worry, retire it. Quote
Thinker Posted September 4, 2003 Author Posted September 4, 2003 I really don't have any worries about the biners after I file the burrs off. Just wondering if anyone else ever sees the same thing on their biners, and if anyone goes so far as to have dedicated biners for bolt hangars... Quote
Dru Posted September 4, 2003 Posted September 4, 2003 Thinker said: I really don't have any worries about the biners after I file the burrs off. Just wondering if anyone else ever sees the same thing on their biners, and if anyone goes so far as to have dedicated biners for bolt hangars... i saw some discussion about this with some cheap home made hangars in spain damaging bolts, in a british climbing mag last year i suggest you sue whoever bolted the route for using substandard hardware and endangering your life Quote
lummox Posted September 4, 2003 Posted September 4, 2003 Thinker said: I really don't have any worries about the biners after I file the burrs off. Just wondering if anyone else ever sees the same thing on their biners, and if anyone goes so far as to have dedicated biners for bolt hangars... yes. and yes. i posted that shit already fool. Quote
Thinker Posted September 4, 2003 Author Posted September 4, 2003 lummox said: Thinker said: I really don't have any worries about the biners after I file the burrs off. Just wondering if anyone else ever sees the same thing on their biners, and if anyone goes so far as to have dedicated biners for bolt hangars... yes. and yes. i posted that shit already fool. Thanks for contributing, Lummox. If this were the Spray section I'd say you and your sproty dogbone quick draws don't really count. But since it's not, I won't. Quote
Dr_Flash_Amazing Posted September 5, 2003 Posted September 5, 2003 Couple years ago DFA replaced all his draws due to similar wear. Most of the top biners had gouges ranging in severity from about what Thinker is showing to rather disconcerting rectangular trenches which were as deep as or deeper than the radius on the bottom of the biner stock. Similar wear on the bent gates, but instead it was big round grooves from rope running over them. When you've worn a third of the way through something like a BD Quicksilver, y'ain't got much aluminum left to keep you from forcefully interacting with terra firma. DFA always clips his draws the same way (i.e. one end bolts, one end rope), mostly 'cause there's wiregates on the rope end (used to be bent gates) and straight gates on the bolt end. But due to the hanger-induced chunkage Thinker is discussing, the Doctor wouldn't clip the rope thru the bolt end (depending on the severity of the burrs). The proverbial dos centavos. Quote
Smoker Posted September 5, 2003 Posted September 5, 2003 I have dedicated draws as well and always clip the same biner to hanger. It's always a good idea to inspect your biners for those grove marks as once in a while ya end up clipping slings to extend. I like to use emery cloth instead of a file since it conforms nice to the radius and doesn't load up your file. A good bur will shred soft goods. That being said, last year I bailed off a route in a down pour. The rope picked up lots of grit in the rain and acted like 80 grit sand paper on my rap biner. It put a rope sized groove into the biner. Quote
chucK Posted September 5, 2003 Posted September 5, 2003 How often do you guys replace your rap/belay biners? Those things seem to get a groove worn in 'em fairly quickly. Quote
babnik Posted September 5, 2003 Posted September 5, 2003 chucK said: How often do you guys replace your rap/belay biners? Those things seem to get a groove worn in 'em fairly quickly. depends how clean your rope is. i replace as soon as i get two fairly pronounced grooves. when i can run my fingers over and feel it pretty well. that is when i get kinda iffyon em. Quote
Smoker Posted September 5, 2003 Posted September 5, 2003 babnik said: chucK said: How often do you guys replace your rap/belay biners? Those things seem to get a groove worn in 'em fairly quickly. depends how clean your rope is. i replace as soon as i get two fairly pronounced grooves. when i can run my fingers over and feel it pretty well. that is when i get kinda iffyon em. Ya depends on how clean your rope is. When I can see/feel a groove it becomes suspect and gets tossed Quote
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