JosephH Posted January 3, 2008 Posted January 3, 2008 Just a new year's reminder if you've had them more than two years of hard use or three years of moderate use you should serious consider tossing them. The testing I had done on them over three years showed them down in the 7-10k range by that time. Quote
Sherri Posted January 3, 2008 Posted January 3, 2008 Thanks, Joseph. That's a great new-year heads up. Kind of like changing the smoke detector batteries w/the time change. Quote
JosephH Posted January 3, 2008 Author Posted January 3, 2008 http://www.google.com/products?q=dyneema+sling+8mm&hl=en&show=dd  http://www.google.com/products?q=dyneema+sling+6mm&hl=en&show=dd  And though I still have to test my 12mm's, I suspect it isn't a matter of width, but rather just of the material so I'm not really expecting them or even bigger dyneema slings to perform much better over time, but I'll post those results up later in the spring when they get tested. Quote
underworld Posted January 3, 2008 Posted January 3, 2008 What the hell is a skinny dyneema sling? Â bad new waver band in the 80's Quote
G-spotter Posted January 3, 2008 Posted January 3, 2008 Send me your retired skinny dyneema slings. I'll dispose of them safely! Quote
JosephH Posted January 3, 2008 Author Posted January 3, 2008 Well, if you want 7k slings that are headed even further south you're welcome to mine. Hell, I lead on old used ropes from ebay and even I don't trust these babies past year two... Quote
John Frieh Posted January 3, 2008 Posted January 3, 2008 Various pull test breaking strengths... Â Metolius UL power cam: 5 - 10 kN BD camalots: 6 - 14 kN CCH Aliens: 1.8 - 3.5 kN Metolius Astro Nuts: 7 - 10 kN BD stoppers: 2 - 10 kN Â Joe: even @ 7 - 10 kN slings are not the weakest link in the chain. Do you secretly work for Mammut? Or have a bunch of Dyneema stock? Â Anyone retiring their skinny slings shoot me a PM... Ill give them a good home. Quote
RuMR Posted January 3, 2008 Posted January 3, 2008 i think he's more pointing out the rate of degradation...if you extrapolate it out eventually, they'd be worthless... Quote
billcoe Posted January 3, 2008 Posted January 3, 2008 What the hell is a skinny dyneema sling? Â Picture. Right there on the ground. Hey look, isn't that you there? Â Thanks for the reminder JH, I have some...man this is gonna be painful to let them go. I always mark my slings with dates in black felt tip. I have 5 brand new ones, and 9 that are marked '04 and I've been using. I think maybe they'll be relagated to TR duty for a while, and I'm going back to mostly slightly larger slings again. Â But they do make great draws when you double a full strength sling. Â I'd recommend the date thing for others, it always surprises me how fast time flies. Probably time to retire some TR slings that date to 1992. Wuz zat, uhhhmmm, almost 10, no 15 years. Can't be, I just bought them. Quote
crackers Posted January 3, 2008 Posted January 3, 2008 And though I still have to test my 12mm's, I suspect it isn't a matter of width, but rather just of the material so I'm not really expecting them or even bigger dyneema slings to perform much better over time, but I'll post those results up later in the spring when they get tested. Â As many of you know, I work with the stuff on a daily basis. Â I think that Joseph is not far off, but not for the reasons he believes. I would be willing to bet that it is a matter of width and weave. The nature of most of the skinny weaves combined with the care they get in my rack results in diminished strength in our applications. Quote
John Frieh Posted January 3, 2008 Posted January 3, 2008 i think he's more pointing out the rate of degradation...if you extrapolate it out eventually, they'd be worthless...  I think we are all aware of the entropy concept  I retire all my gear as it degrades... just not my mammut runners after 2 years. Quote
billcoe Posted January 3, 2008 Posted January 3, 2008 And though I still have to test my 12mm's, I suspect it isn't a matter of width, but rather just of the material so I'm not really expecting them or even bigger dyneema slings to perform much better over time, but I'll post those results up later in the spring when they get tested. Â As many of you know, I work with the stuff on a daily basis. Â I think that Joseph is not far off, but not for the reasons he believes. I would be willing to bet that it is a matter of width and weave. The nature of most of the skinny weaves combined with the care they get in my rack results in diminished strength in our applications. Â The shocker was the testing done on skinny ropes suggesting they have a very very short live. ie, highly recommend to pay attention to the Mfg advice on retiring those 9.1 and 9.4mm ropes, rather than do what we all do on our 10-11mils and just ignore it. Quote
JosephH Posted January 3, 2008 Author Posted January 3, 2008 Crackers, I could be wrong, but my understanding of it as explained to me was that it's more about just the individual fibers breaking as dyneema fiber is so stiff. So, just from handling and the rolling over biners over time the fibers break. Â I sent the test results from both years to Mammut and their response was basically that in the ultimate push to shave weight (and more specifically for alpine) sometimes a line gets deliberately crossed where gear needs to be treated as a consumable good versus the normal hard and software we're accustomed to. In other words, use for what it is and then toss it - these slings were never designed to function like their nylon brethren which keep their strength year after year. The skinny dyneema slings have a pretty linear curve relative to their average loss of strength which goes roughly 22k > 14k > 8k > ?. Do you really want to find out what's next? Â So John, keep using them, but I have to say this is probably one of those deals I've seen more in the NW than anywhere else where alpine, as opposed to rock, climbers tend to be a quite bit more cavalier about both gear and pro. I'd certainly think twice about using them full length after a couple of solid years. But hey, it's your deal... Quote
111 Posted January 4, 2008 Posted January 4, 2008 Various pull test breaking strengths...  CCH Aliens: 1.8 - 3.5 kN  Is that the "bad swage" ? Quote
denalidave Posted January 4, 2008 Posted January 4, 2008 Got me thinking about my vintage harnesses. Although they have been stored indoors, inside heavy dark plastic/rubbermaid tubs, they are pushing 20 years old. We all remember what happened to Todd Skinner not to long ago. I suppose I should step up to a harness at least from this century. None of them are even faded though. Any thoughts or data on this? Quote
denalidave Posted January 4, 2008 Posted January 4, 2008 It's not so much the $, it' the idea of throwing away gear that does not need to be tossed. If it is worn out, I don't want it. If it is not, then I do want it. Just wondering if anyone has any data on the durability of harnesses? Quote
korup Posted January 4, 2008 Posted January 4, 2008 Jesus fekkin H Christus, what's your life worth? Quote
denalidave Posted January 4, 2008 Posted January 4, 2008 I dunno, let's see what I can find on the clearance rack at the thrift store... OK already I'll get a new one. What about all this reduce, re-use, re-cycle crapp? Sure worked fine on a few whippers I took last summer. Â Quote
kurthicks Posted January 4, 2008 Posted January 4, 2008 Got me thinking about my vintage harnesses. Â I made a resolution this year to replace my harness annually. Given that a some manufacturers say that circa 100 use-days is the lifespan of soft goods (I use mine about 150 days/year), I think it is a prudent decision. Quote
denalidave Posted January 4, 2008 Posted January 4, 2008 Got me thinking about my vintage harnesses. Â I made a resolution this year to replace my harness annually. Given that a some manufacturers say that circa 100 use-days is the lifespan of soft goods (I use mine about 150 days/year), I think it is a prudent decision. Thanks, that makes sense. I'm pretty sure I got my $2 worth out of my main harness. Prolly should have retired it some time ago but never gave it much thought, like I always do with runners and ropes. Of course, I give all the harness and other gear a good visual inspection on a regular basis. Quote
lizard_brain Posted January 4, 2008 Posted January 4, 2008 (edited) Got me thinking about my vintage harnesses. Although they have been stored indoors, inside heavy dark plastic/rubbermaid tubs, they are pushing 20 years old. We all remember what happened to Todd Skinner not to long ago. I suppose I should step up to a harness at least from this century. None of them are even faded though. Any thoughts or data on this? Â Yeah - Is your life worth 40 bucks? Â Can I be in your will? Â PM me for personal info. Edited January 4, 2008 by lizard_brain Quote
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