Cardio

[sketchfest]

I run 3-4 times a week, roughly 3.5 miles at a time. The circuit is mostly flat, with the final mile turning up hill and the last 1/2 mile could actually be considered uphill. Due to time constraints: wife, two children, one high strung dog, the only time I have to run is between 4:30-5:00AM.

 

With all that said, when I go to the mountains, I do not feel like my cardio is in very good shape, as soon as I start hiking up hill, I feel like I'm under a huge load and working very hard even at an easy pace. I don't drink during the week and not much more on the weekends and I don't smoke, so I'm wondering what other exercises I can do to improve my cardio response. Thanks for any input.

[Highlander]

In order to improve cardio-endurance, workouts need to last at least 45 minutes.

Do hill workouts to condition your legs. Do 1 long run of 10-12 miles on a hilly course a week. Find a hill about a 1/4 to 1/2 mile long and run up it about 8 to 10 times at 75-80% effort, take it easy on the downhills. If you live close to a trail that goes up a steep hill for a 1000-3000ft, carry a heavy pack, loaded with water, dump the water at the top and cruise back down. Workouts that simulate what your objectives are seem to work best, but good overall fitness is helpful.

Edited December 17, 2002 by Highlander

[mbcracken]

I would mostly agree with everything said so far. The only difference is that one does not need to carry a heavy pack for training. Just getting out is the key. If one carries a heavy pack one will gain extra muscle weight and the key is to stay light.

 

The other item I would add to your gear pouch is a heart rate monitor. It is the only way to truly track your efforts. I like the Polar brands because of thier reliability and compatability with treadmills and stair masters in the gym.

 

For my training, I have found success in lowering the effort to 60-75% for my long runs but bumping the effort up for the shorter runs. Everyone has their own definition of long and short running lengths and will change with ones fitness level. I also throw in a Wed Afterwork/afternoon/night hike up some trail along I-90 after. This is normally done early spring to late fall. We try to limit the trails to ones we can get off of in daylight.

 

Hope this helps in defining you workout regime. Email or PM me if you want to chat about any other training issues.

 

-Mike

[COL._Von_Spanker]

Run wind sprints on hills (Run up walk down). I was in the same place as you, running 3.5 to 4 miles on flat, and I realized that it really didn't get my cardio goin' all that much, so I decided to run wind sprints up 65th to greenwood/phinney and for the same duration I got a much better cardio workout. For endurance cardio and leg strength I just ride the fixed gear around town, which is sort of like one of those "spinning" classes that they offer at health clubs cause you can't stop pedaling and going down can be work than going up.

 

For more detailed info swing by the library called barnes and noble and check out the mountaineers book "Climbing: Training for peak performance". It seems to have really well rounded climbing specific training and nutrition info, and is written in an easy to digest style.

 

I have never used a heart rate monitor, though I see it's benifits, but I'm just not that techy. My theory, if I feel like i'm about to barf than I'm doin' just the right amount of work.

[sketchfest]

Thanks all! I try to alternate my runs between intervals one day, anarobic threshold on other days (mainly just to keep things mixed up a little) Guess I'm gonna need to squeeze more time outta the weekend to train on the hills. Maybe I would do best just to cut out all the & since I don't have time to train like I'd like....Naaaaaaa!

[Bronco]

as soon as I start hiking up hill, I feel like I'm under a huge load and working very hard even at an easy pace

 

Sounds like you might be a good cantidate for some weight trainng if you don't already. Squats, lunges and deadlifts are all good for getting your body ready for hauling ass up the trail.

[Stefan]

For all that I have seen I don't think running helps in the mountains. Really. The best people I have seen perform in the mountains are people who use bicycles are their main source of cardio. Runners just don't seem to have the "power" that is needed. And becuase climbing takes a beating on your knees why make it worse with running???? Go bicycling. Or better yet, do mountain biking, and replace it with all your running.

[RobBob]

Due to time constraints: wife, two children, one high strung dog, the only time I have to run is between 4:30-5:00AM.

 

sketchfest, I'm in the same boat. I run, but a month or two before mtns I do reps on stadium steps. Push hard going up, easy coming down for knees' sake.

 

I second the heart-rate monitor. I'm not usually a techie, but an HRM is easy to use, and you can tailor your training.

[sketchfest]

After reading all this I'm coming to rapid conclusion that

1) I'm getting older and face the facts

2) I suck and need to just suffer in silence.

Probably a combo of the two

 

I wish I had time to bike (I HATE running), I used to race bike, both mtn and road, but at the time didn't climb much, so never saw the difference between the two when I did go climb. I suppose that as my schedule heats up I need to get more organized and make the most of the time and training I do have. Back when I raced, I always trained with a HRM and only saw the benefit when I trained within targets (cat 3 on road bike) Anyway, thanks again, read some new ideas that I'm sure I'll be able to incorporate.

[Smoker]

I would simply add that .5 hr is simply not enough time.

You'll need to be a bit more selfish with your time to see improvement.

 

Good luck

[Stefan]

The circuit is mostly flat, with the final mile turning up hill and the last 1/2 mile could actually be considered uphill. Due to time constraints: wife, two children, one high strung dog, the only time I have to run is between 4:30-5:00AM.

 

What about lunchtime at work? Riding your bike to work? Running with your children while they are on bikes to make it a family outing instead of watching tv or playing video games?

[Fairweather]

I've had extremely good results using a "stair-mill" machine at the gym near my house. Kind of like climbing an escalator. I always swore I would never join a gym, but it has paid off. Very low impact on the knees. I still mix in a 5k run 3 or 4 times per week, but I don't push it very hard. (23+min) Lately, I've tried to do a longer run every other week. About 8 miles with hills. The jury is still out on this practice.

 

Someone here thought cycling was a good substitute for running. For me, this has not been the case. Too easy to just cruise. Too cold on the downhills in the off-season. Everyone is different though.

I think the best workout would be a 1000' vert hill behind your house to walk/run up daily. I envy folks in Enumclaw who have Mount Peak right in their backyard.

[sketchfest]

The problem with exercise at work is there are no showers, I work in Wilsonville (very flat) and becasue I hold a position of authority, I rarely get a chance to do my own thing at lunch. I've tried biking to work, which is only about 15 miles from home, but again, I'm into work around 6-6:30AM and leave around 5:00. so that forces me to cram my work outs into a brief session in the wee hours of the day and then outings to the hills on the weekends. What I'm reading, is confirming that if I want more gain, I'll have to get up earlier and be more organized.

[COL._Von_Spanker]

Someone here thought cycling was a good substitute for running. For me, this has not been the case. Too easy to just cruise. Too cold on the downhills in the off-season

 

This problem is common, I can see how it's easy to cruise, and many do the same thing in the weight room, it's up to you to push your limits. The difference between cycling and running is that you can simulate multiple hours of physical exertion and it is extremely low impact, whereas running isn't. Of course this means that you have to make more time. cruising is fine, if you plan on riding for 4 hours or more.

 

I prefer the bike just cause I can ride when I go anywhere and get a workout at the same time, and running too much makes my knees hurt.

 

How about swimming for cardio? I seem to remember that getting the heartrate goin' pretty good.

[thelawgoddess]

yeah, but swimming is cold and it's too easy to flip over and just float on your back.

 

heh, heh. i mostly like running because you get the most bang for your buck. biking is awesome for the legs, but it doesn't do much for your upper body and is too weather-dependent for most people with "normal" bikes. swimming is cool, but doesn't do as much for your legs. of course, if you want to do all three you'll get an awesome all-around spanking ... and you could start training for the next ironman.

[Greg_W]

How I read tlg's post: "blah, blah, blah,.......spanking......blah, blah.

[Toast]

How I read tlg's post: "blah, blah, blah,.......spanking......blah, blah.

 

ha ha ha!!!

[jon]

I think the reason cyclists might do better then runners is because of the muscle use around the knees and strength and endurance required when hill climbing. Cycling is poor for the hip muscles though, but you can build the muscle endurance required for carrying a heavy pack up the steeps.

 

I took up swimming about 3 years ago in hopes of curing a chronic back problem and now I swim almost every day, partly because of triathlon. Once you learn to deal with breathing, getting water in your mouth and up your nose, get confortable in the water, you can do absolutely mind blowing excruciatingly painful workouts. And strangly when you are done you feel great. You will build a little muscle swimming and if you want to build more you can get some paddles to increase the resistance, but the main benefit is the cardio which can be huge. What is great is you can put incredible amounts of stress on your cardiovascular system without putting much stress on your muscles or joints, so you don't get very sore and your system isn't so taxed that you recover quite quickly.

[jon]

I would second the heart rate monitor. If you are going running or whatever 3+ days a week and are pretty serious about exercise it is a good investment. You can get a decent Polar for $100 and it is compatible with most gym equipment. Go get a book about HR training and periodization training schemes. You can take a few fitness tests, mainly what you max heart rate is and where you lactic threshold is. LT is where lactic acid is neither accumulating or declining, so it's kind of your endurance breaking point, most people don't survive very long above their LT. Once you learn how to use it a HR monitor will tell you how you are improving and more importantly when you need a rest. Some people think HR monitors are some stupid techy item and that they aren't important, but seriously you can save yourself a lot of time on the road and in the gym by maximizing you workouts.

 

[Bill_Simpkins]

Longer workouts. I'l trail run for a couple hours at a time. Or go on a long hike. Rock climbing has helped too. Just get your body used to working hard and being active all day.

[glen]

There are some really good deals on hrm's at supergo. They have a wireless one coupled with a cycle computer for $30 and a few watch models for slightly more. My brother has the bike one and is pretty happy with it's performance and features. Use the other $60 to buy exercise food.

[Pencil_Pusher]

Holy frijoles, swimming is friggin hard! Moreso because I can't get enough frickin air. But I'm two weeks into it now, so hopefully what you say will come true. What's up with the kick? I move like an old lady when I use a kickboard.

Heart rate monitors: Walmart.com sells a few Timex Heart Rate Monitors that vary, $56, $71, and $I forgot.

[jon]

Ditch the kickboard, it's pointless, if you want to work your legs do your kicking during balancing drills. Go to the library and check out a video called "Fishlike Freestyle". Do those drills for at least half your work out until you get your balance down, at which point you will no longer need to kick.

[Pencil_Pusher]

Okay... once I get my balance down I will no longer need to kick? So why do all the swimmers kick? Granted, when I just stroke, I move quick (insert Beavis and Butthead joke here). But I've seen gals and guys frickin cruise with those kickboards so I think either my style is off or I'm not used to putting that much effort into kicking... or a combination of both. Either way, I'm tired of being hunted down and passed by old, hairy-backed men with shit-eating grins on their faces as I'm about ready to holler for the oxygen bottle.

[jon]

You should check out cascadeswimmers.com for more swimming information.

 

Seriously though when you get the whole balance thing down, you will have to kick very little. Less kick equals less work. Swimming fast and far is all about being as efficient as possible. Concentrate on your technique right now until your muscles adapt to swimming lots of laps.

 

Here are my tips for new swimmers.

1. Check out "Fishlike Freestyle" from the library. Watch it and do the drills. It will make you much better. If you have to get some lessons.

2. Ditch the big bathing suite, way too much drag and makes swimming hard. Buy a speedo and a drag suite to go over it if you aren't confortable walking around in your underware.

3. Do intervals! Build up as time goes on, more reps, more sets, harder effort.

4. After a month start going for longer continous swims, find a stroke that is a good rest for you (I like resting with breast stroke), and just keep swimming until you are really fucking tired.

5. Be patient. It takes a while for your upper body adapt, getting confortable breathing and getting water up your nose.

 

I was never a competative swimmer, in fact a year ago I had to take some lesson because I just bashed the water and didn't go anywhere. I originally started swimming to rehab my back but I found out the benefits of swimming. Increased cardio capacity, increased endurance in my arms and shoulders. IMHO I think for rock or ice climbers it might be more advantageous then lifting weights.