The Ant and the Grasshopper

[tvashtarkatena]

(much needed) THREAD DRIFT::::!!!!!!

 

Anyone ever seen a column of army ants? I have. One of the coolest things Ah ever did see.

 

You can smell the formic acid from hundreds of yards.

 

They consume every animate thing in their path and so must keep moving to survive. Now THERE's an analogy.

[Doug]

Just remember bitches, Fair is the place where your grandma's took their pies and pickles to try to win ribbons. Everything est is subjective and relative.

[Rad]

Anyone ever seen a column of army ants?

 

Nope, but I've seen lots of leaf cutter ant colonies. They are really cool too.

 

BTW, one defn of civilization is division of labor - and ants qualify! But humans are still better because we have middle managers, and even micromanagers...

[JayB]

There was a guy at my high school who inherited good looks, height, intelligence, a charming disposition, and lots of athletic talent - but his family seemed to be on the very low end of middle-class, at least income wise. There were also rich dweebs that inherited none of these attributes from their parents.

 

Methinks the rich dweebs would have traded places with the other guy in a heartbeat, but perhaps if they spent enough time with academic sociologists they'd succeed in convincing them that they got the better deal from the birth-lottery.

[prole]

...perhaps if they spent enough time with academic sociologists they'd succeed in convincing them that they got the better deal from the birth-lottery.

 

Or with Tom Vu...

 

[video:youtube]

 

"You think these girls like me? NO! They like my money!"

[Doug]

There was a guy at my high school who inherited good looks, height, intelligence, a charming disposition, and lots of athletic talent - but his family seemed to be on the very low end of middle-class, at least income wise. There were also rich dweebs that inherited none of these attributes from their parents.

 

Methinks the rich dweebs would have traded places with the other guy in a heartbeat, but perhaps if they spent enough time with academic sociologists they'd succeed in convincing them that they got the better deal from the birth-lottery.

 

[video:youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7OjEPRKOck

[tvashtarkatena]

Yeah, but none of those women actually like him.

 

An army ant column, which is about a meter wide, is preceded by panicked insects of all kinds trying to flee. Now, you may not think insects can display panic...trust me, they can. You can practically see the horror in their little segmented eyes. Unfortunately for them, there is also a cloud of predatory flies and wasps picking them off.

 

It's really quite a show.

[ivan]

anyone see the naked jungle?

 

man, charlton heston managed to fuck up the greatest ant story ever told too!

[Mal_Con]

[video:youtube]

[Fairweather]

 

Here's me, on the other hand. I make decent money as an economist. I was born into a family with two educated parents who pushed me to exceed academically and work hard, and footed the bill for me to get an undergrad degree at an in-state institution. Coming out debt free made it easier for me to go to grad school, which in turn opened career and earning doors.

 

Relatively speaking, I had a leg up in terms of my gender, skin color, neighborhood, and parents. I call that luck of the draw.

My personal view is that, as someone who's gotten a better than average deal in this society, I owe it back to society to not be as miserly with my money. If that means higher marginal tax rates if I ever make huge enough bucks to be in the top tax bracket, so be it.

 

Does that mean that lazy people should get a free ride? No. But maybe you highly financially successful people (I'm assuming Fairweather must be uber successful since he is so concerned about marginal tax rates on the high income bracket) should show a little gratitude for your success.

 

Cue "I'm a self-made man biographical spiel" now.

 

 

Thanks for sharing your unsolicited personal story and laying bare your baseless guilt. Now that your ego is satisfied with the telling of your marginally impressive bio I should tell you that your assumptions about me are entirely incorrect. My wife and I don't make a lot of money, but we've made good financial decisions and have put 2 kids through college. I will say that, if anything, my effective federal income tax is too low. It's the State, local burden that's becoming excessive for chumps like me. Regarding the 46% who pay nothing; don't you think that everyone (who is physically able) should contribute--if for no other reason than a vested stake in the dream? And what, exactly, do you think those uber-rich are doing with that big stash they "took" from the rest of us? Creating jobs, perhaps?

 

I suspect you work for the state or some other government agency, no?

[Fairweather]

If you took away 65% of my income I'd *still* make more than I made in NYC in the early 90s when I first got out of college ($19K a year). And you better believe I paid taxes on that -- federal, state, city, and something they called "other" and just took. I also managed to make student loan payments and save enough in a year to take a six-week trip to Europe on that salary, so -- I dunno. I simultaneously think that 65% is an awful lot to pay, AND that if you can't manage to live on $350K a year you're an idiot and I have no sympathy for you.

 

I also have a hard time believing that 46% of Americans really make less than $20K a year, but if they do, sure, let them keep every penny of it.

 

 

You understand the difference between gross income and taxable income, eh?

[Nitrox]

 

Here's me, on the other hand. I make decent money as an economist. I was born into a family with two educated parents who pushed me to exceed academically and work hard, and footed the bill for me to get an undergrad degree at an in-state institution. Coming out debt free made it easier for me to go to grad school, which in turn opened career and earning doors.

 

Relatively speaking, I had a leg up in terms of my gender, skin color, neighborhood, and parents. I call that luck of the draw.

My personal view is that, as someone who's gotten a better than average deal in this society, I owe it back to society to not be as miserly with my money. If that means higher marginal tax rates if I ever make huge enough bucks to be in the top tax bracket, so be it.

 

Does that mean that lazy people should get a free ride? No. But maybe you highly financially successful people (I'm assuming Fairweather must be uber successful since he is so concerned about marginal tax rates on the high income bracket) should show a little gratitude for your success.

 

Cue "I'm a self-made man biographical spiel" now.

 

 

Thanks for sharing your unsolicited personal story and laying bare your baseless guilt. Now that your ego is satisfied with the telling of your marginally impressive bio I should tell you that your assumptions about me are entirely incorrect. My wife and I don't make a lot of money, but we've made good financial decisions and have put 2 kids through college. I will say that, if anything, my effective federal income tax is too low. It's the State, local burden that's becoming excessive for chumps like me. Regarding the 46% who pay nothing; don't you think that everyone (who is physically able) should contribute--if for no other reason than a vested stake in the dream? And what, exactly, do you think those uber-rich are doing with that big stash they "took" from the rest of us? Creating jobs, perhaps?

 

I suspect you work for the state or some other government agency, no?

 

The great white guilt. It seams to come most from those who suckle from the government teat.

 

For the life of me I can't understand how someone can think they are owed anything, especially because they have less than their neighbor. Quite honestly, I'd be embarrassed to be treated as this nation's "baby". But, some will never get it and will always be in line with an out stretched hand.

 

 

 

[olyclimber]

Yes, just as others are incapable of empathy. But fuck them, they're assholes.

[prole]

Fuck empathy, these people don't even understand their self interest as extending any further than the front bumpers of their cars!

[Nitrox]

Yes, just as others are incapable of empathy. But fuck them, they're assholes.

 

I'm not your mother, if you need empathy (and maybe some sympathy too) call her. I'm sure she'd love to hear from you anyway. (and I don't me you specifically, Oly)

 

FREE FREE FREE...MORE FREE! And if there ain't more free then we're all a bunch of greedy racist hicks.

 

Its a tired song and dance. I've had enough.

 

 

 

[Doug]

Yes, just as others are incapable of empathy. But fuck them, they're assholes.

 

I'm not your mother, if you need empathy (and maybe some sympathy too) call her. I'm sure she'd love to hear from you anyway. (and I don't me you specifically, Oly)

 

FREE FREE FREE...MORE FREE! And if there ain't more free then we're all a bunch of greedy racist hicks.

 

Its a tired song and dance. I've had enough.

 

 

 

I call bullshit. The majority of folks in this nation are not looking for a free handout or any other sort of entitlement. Part of the purpose of a government is to provide services to the people that live and serve under it. The majority of people in this country don't have a problem with that. But every single god damn time a democrat suggests that we have some kind of social service program, he or she is a fucking socialist. I have an equal bitch every time a republican says something against entitlement or social services someone from the left calls them a racist or some shit like that. What a fucking joke we've become as a nation. Can't even engage in civil discourse.

[prole]

Its a tired song and dance. I've had enough.

 

OMG, IT'S HOWARD BEALE!! DO SOMETHING DRASTIC!! YOU HAVE OUR SUPPORT!!!

[olyclimber]

i don't know who these FREE FREE FREE people are that you're talking about...there are people out there that want to take advantage of the system in an immoral way, but that happens in both a full capitalist system (see WaMu) and a socialist system (see people who take advantage of welfare). in both of these example the parties taking advantage are actually doing work! its just work to deceive the system. how is one better than the other?

 

 

[billcoe]

Before you biches get all serious like, how is it that one didn't get posted yet? From here: http://thepeoplescube.com/red/viewtopic.php?p=45197

 

 

"Once upon a time, there was an ant and a grasshopper. The ant was a wealthy capitalist who owned a chain of "big box" stores, and spent all summer counting his money, while the grasshopper labored very hard making money for the ant.

 

In short, the ant exploited the grasshopper.

~

All summer long, the ant would smoke cigars, drink martinis, and see prostitutes. The grasshopper would simply work as a slave for the ant and turn over his meager pay to A.N.S.W.E.R., The Rachel Corrie Memorial Fund, and the Barack Obama campaign.

 

Then the winter came. It was a cold and dark winter, and the grasshopper had nothing to eat. The bitter temperatures were caused by global warming, as the ant-made pollutants created heat pockets that actually lowered temperatures.

 

The grasshopper was hungry, for he had no money left. And so, he approached the ant: "Ant, my dear dear ant, please find it in your heart to spare just a tiny morsel of food so that I and my family might survive to see one more day."

 

The ant thought about this humble request. After several days of contemplation, the ant went to the grasshopper's house and approached the grasshopper's family. And then, without any hesitation, the ant raped the grasshopper's daughter so violently that she would have preferred death instead. However, the ant realized what the consequences of his actions might be, and so went from abortion clinic to abortion clinic, tossing gasoline bombs, dismembering doctors, and raping nurses. All in the name of Jesus, he would say. It is what the bible told him to do.

 

And so, without abortions, the grasshopper population multiplied far beyond its scientifically-calculated sustainable optimality. And all these new grasshoppers were hungry.

 

By the spring, half the grasshopper population died from either starvation or from the ant's insistence on sending grasshoppers to far-off lands to launch wars against innocent Islamic grasshoppers.

 

However, that summer, the grasshopper got himself a different job -- at The United States Department of Housing and Urban Development. His job was "Assistant Deputy Analyst" in the HOPE program, which mandates that ants pay the mortgages of those home-owning grasshoppers who have more pressing needs than to pay fort heir own homes. The grasshopper's responsibilities included "being able to analyze and prepare official HOPE documents while demonstrating proficiency in equivalent tasks and programs". In practice, this required the demands of attending many meetings and learning how to use "email".

 

Much of the HOPE time was spent making contributions to United for Peace and Justice and The Nation of Islam from the grasshopper's desk.

 

And once again, hunger arrived in the winter.

 

And the grasshopper approached the ant: "Hey ant, I'm gettin' in your face this year, know what I'm sayin? You owe me, unnerstan'? I got demands and you better respec' them."

 

The ant returned to his guarded estate, and a few days later, received a visit from someone unfamiliar. It was a grasshopper, but one whom he had never before met.

 

This new grasshopper said, "Ant...I am here to collect your money, which I will then give to the other grasshoppers, and will keep some for myself. If you do not agree, I will, at gunpoint, drag you to a prison cell where you will be anally violated while your life rots away in isolation."

 

The new grasshopper had a badge. It said "I.R.S."

 

And the ant turned over his plundered wealth to the I.R.S. grasshopper.

 

Forevermore, for the rest of his life, the ant, with his bottomless pit of money, would give and give to the grasshoppers -- providing for their food, their health care, their housing, their homes, and everything else that the grasshoppers could ever want or need, as determined by their educated leaders.

 

Moral: Rich capitalist ants have an endless supply of wealth that was stolen from the working class. It can never be depleted and it will always be there for taking -- by any means. It is not theirs, it belongs to the people, and shall be controlled by the people's leaders.

 

Kids: Let's educate your parents, kill the capitalists, and live in a Socialist Paradise!

 

God DAMN Amerikkka!"

____________________________________________________________

 

I think the moral of that story is that we all should be careful of what we're smokin.

[j_b]

FREE FREE FREE...MORE FREE! And if there ain't more free then we're all a bunch of greedy racist hicks.

 

It's really not the fault of progressives if most of you are greedy racist hicks that keep falling for the propaganda about "welfare queens".

[Nitrox]

Yes, just as others are incapable of empathy. But fuck them, they're assholes.

 

I'm not your mother, if you need empathy (and maybe some sympathy too) call her. I'm sure she'd love to hear from you anyway. (and I don't me you specifically, Oly)

 

FREE FREE FREE...MORE FREE! And if there ain't more free then we're all a bunch of greedy racist hicks.

 

Its a tired song and dance. I've had enough.

 

 

 

I call bullshit. The majority of folks in this nation are not looking for a free handout or any other sort of entitlement. Part of the purpose of a government is to provide services to the people that live and serve under it. The majority of people in this country don't have a problem with that. But every single god damn time a democrat suggests that we have some kind of social service program, he or she is a fucking socialist. I have an equal bitch every time a republican says something against entitlement or social services someone from the left calls them a racist or some shit like that. What a fucking joke we've become as a nation. Can't even engage in civil discourse.

 

I call bullshit on you calling bullshit. Of course there is people who take advantage of the system but thats not what I'm referring to. We've created this wonderful utopia where nothing bad can happen because we've wrapped our nation in cuddles and fluffy pillows.

 

Can't find the job you think you deserve? No problem, have some extended unemployment!

Can't make your mortgage cause you signed a variable rate loan and your payment jumped $700/mo? No problem, we'll pay to write down your loan.

Can't get healthcare because you're a life long smoker who is morbidly obese (and on welfare?) No problem, have some free medical "insurance".

 

Its not like I'm making this shit up, there is no personal responsibility anymore. My empathy well has run dry.

[j_b]

I didn't know there were close to 50 millions morbidly obese life long smokers who can't afford health insurance in America. It'd be really pathetic if you actually believed your own drivel. Please tell us you aren't for real.

[billcoe]

It's really not the fault of progressives if most of you are greedy racist hicks that keep falling for the propaganda about "welfare queens".

 

Are the "progressives" the ants or the grasshoppers in your world jb?

[olyclimber]

I could be wrong, but it seems like people who support a fully open deregulated market/minimal tax/privatized world have the following view:

 

the most effective engine for managing any resource is the unfettered marketplace. kill or be killed. if you help your neighbor, the end goal isn't to actually help him, but to better your own position in the end. empathy is just a tool for use in the same end game: bettering your own position.

 

I totally appreciate this point of view...it is just stone cold realism. It is social Darwinism and evolution of the human animal. Anything else is just cancer.

 

Its funny to see the ant used as a parable in this thread. Ants are proof that communism is an effective evolutionary force. After all, they survive by working together. And I'm pretty sure they have death panels.

 

 

 

 

 

[billcoe]

Its not like I'm making this shit up, there is no personal responsibility anymore.

 

It's sure as hell drying up one bit at a time. The government is grabbing it when they can. The lawyers and we the people are letting or assisting them in taking it away one piece at a time.