McCain speech

[mattp]

Didn't he come out of the Keating thing tarnished, but not really taken down? I think they found he was only tangentially involved though there could be more to the story than we were ever told.

 

I think these notions of "character" are important but also quite tenuous and our perceptions are easily manipulated. Do we really change everything we think about the man if, in August, we find out that McCain cheated on his income taxes in 2005 or had an affair with his housekeeper?

 

Clearly these are important concerns but they too easily become the beginning and end of the analysis - like "experience" or "vision."

[KaskadskyjKozak]

The investigation concluded that 3 of the "Keating 5" had "substantially and improperly interfered with the FHLBB in its investigation of Lincoln Savings"....John McCain was not one of them. Also, the special investigator at the time recommended that the Senate Ethics Committee not pursue charges against McCain because of "no evidence against him". Please note, not a lack of substantial evidence, but rather NO evidence.

 

don't confuse Hugh's alcohol-soaked brain with facts, Eric.

[Jim]

I just watched this speech for the first time. Oh God that was painful. Obama in a landslide for sure.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

I just watched this speech for the first time. Oh God that was painful. Obama in a landslide for sure.

 

yeah, a landslide. called on june 6th.

 

the polling shows a statistical dead heat. that doesn't bode well for Obamalamadingdong

 

[wfinley]

CHANGE

I thought the blink tag had been banned. Thanks for bringing it to our attention. How'd you do that?

[Hugh Conway]

The investigation concluded that 3 of the "Keating 5" had "substantially and improperly interfered with the FHLBB in its investigation of Lincoln Savings"....John McCain was not one of them. Also, the special investigator at the time recommended that the Senate Ethics Committee not pursue charges against McCain because of "no evidence against him". Please note, not a lack of substantial evidence, but rather NO evidence.

 

And yet the Senate ethics committee rebuked him for "poor judgement"

[Jim]

I have a bet with PP on this. How about you? I could always use more food and

[olyclimber]

I just watched this speech for the first time. Oh God that was painful. Obama in a landslide for sure.

 

yeah, a landslide. called on june 6th.

 

the polling shows a statistical dead heat. that doesn't bode well for Obamalamadingdong

 

QUIT IT WITH YOUR NAME CALLING. IT HURTS ME PERSONALLY. lol.

 

but perhaps you did not cringe watching mccain's kickoff to the general election (i.e. the subject of this thread)? that would appear to support the reverse of your statement...but i'm sure mccain will stop using the green backdrop and saying "change" all the time.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

I just watched this speech for the first time. Oh God that was painful. Obama in a landslide for sure.

 

yeah, a landslide. called on june 6th.

 

the polling shows a statistical dead heat. that doesn't bode well for Obamalamadingdong

 

QUIT IT WITH YOUR NAME CALLING. IT HURTS ME PERSONALLY. lol.

 

but perhaps you did not cringe watching mccain's kickoff to the general election (i.e. the subject of this thread)? that would appear to support the reverse of your statement...but i'm sure mccain will stop using the green backdrop and saying "change" all the time.

 

all I saw was some sound bytes of McCain's fucking evil grimacing. didn't look good, I agree.

 

 

 

[Hugh Conway]

all I saw was some sound bytes of McCain's fucking evil grimacing. didn't look good, I agree.

 

WHY ARE YOU PREJUDICED AGAINST THE CONSTIPATED?

[rob]

the polling shows a statistical dead heat. that doesn't bode well for Obamalamadingdong

 

It doesn't? If it's a "statistical dead heat" then couldn't you reverse the argument and say it doesn't bode well for McChange?

[KaskadskyjKozak]

the polling shows a statistical dead heat. that doesn't bode well for Obamalamadingdong

 

It doesn't? If it's a "statistical dead heat" then couldn't you reverse the argument and say it doesn't bode well for McChange?

 

No, because R's should lose big time this year, Obama is a rock star and he's still up only 47 to 45? WTF?

 

[Bug]

He's black.

 

I think it is ironic that whe GW was running, the Republican party went to great lengths to suggest that actions from twenty or more years ago were not relevant to a presidential campaign.

Now they are looking back 30.

[underworld]

He's black.

 

he is??? what's that matter?

 

[sirwoofalot]

I just watched this speech for the first time. Oh God that was painful. Obama in a landslide for sure.

 

It would be terrible if Obama were to die in a landslide.

[Bug]

He's black.

 

he is??? what's that matter?

Yeah.

We're over that right?

 

 

You aren't black are you?

[KaskadskyjKozak]

He's black.

 

he is??? what's that matter?

 

it's called hedging your bets. declare a landslide, but if you lose, you've got a ready excuse

[scott_harpell]

McCain too was a pretty solid guy in captivity 35 years ago really has a lot to do with his "character" in a manner that is relevant to whether he'll make a good president now?

 

Oh yes it does. When a man can endure torture to save his buddies, and is offered a free pass to get out and instead volunteers for more torture to save his fellow soldiers' morale. That speaks volumes to me.

 

It says that he will take a personal hit for the good of his people and will do what is right in the most dire of times. We are in the most dire of times and we need someone who WILL do what is right.

[Hugh Conway]

Oh yes it does. When a man can endure torture to save his buddies, and is offered a free pass to get out and instead volunteers for more torture to save his fellow soldiers' morale. That speaks volumes to me.

 

It says that he will take a personal hit for the good of his people and will do what is right in the most dire of times. We are in the most dire of times and we need someone who WILL do what is right.

 

Not making the leap between "torture victim" and "can implement good fiscal policy"

[mattp]

We are in the most dire of times and we need someone who WILL do what is right.

 

True that, and in the case of Iraq I think that will include showing a willingness to speak truthfully about what is and has taken place there rather than putting a whitewash on the whole thing and offering cheerleader stuff like saying it was a good idea and still is a good idea and we gotta honor the fallen; it will include a willingness to talk to other parties, whether they are for or against us; and it will take a commitment NOT to allow our military to torture prisoners any more -- among other things.

 

I don't see any great proposal coming from either McCain or Obama, at this point, but I wouldn't expect one. I also don't think going on a politically motivated tour over there gives one all that much special or accurate perception of the behind-the-scenes reality or a crystal ball on the future, or that saying "I support the troops" means much without actual support being offered.

 

McCain had a month to prepare his speech, and he could have offered some kind of vision or inspiration even if it might have been offered in a clumsy manner. He did not.

[builder206]

willingness to speak truthfully about what is and has taken place there rather than putting a whitewash on the whole thing and offering cheerleader stuff like saying it was a good idea and still is a good idea and we gotta honor the fallen; it will include a willingness to talk to other parties, whether they are for or against us; and it will take a commitment NOT to allow our military to torture prisoners any more

 

Now, that's just crazy talk.

[TREETOAD]

Perhaps you should be looking at some of the gitmo prisoners as a presidential hopeful then.

[mattp]

Its crazy talk, I know, but Scott Harpel is the one who brought up the idea of doing the right thing.

[scott_harpell]

I think that will include showing a willingness to speak truthfully about what is and has taken place there rather than putting a whitewash on the whole thing

 

I agree. On the same token, we cannot have a leader paint a black picture on every facet of something just because it is not in line with his beliefs.

[mattp]

Though it has to be said that the American people seem to want just that: black or white. That is why we're seeing these campaigns built on slogans and cartoon characters. It'll be interesting to see if anything comes of the town meeting thing proposed by the McCain campaign - would either of them really subject themselves to unscripted pubic real-time debate?