Blackwater

[olyclimber]

Take it for what its worth to you, this is a rather "progressive" source, but interesting topic none the less:

 

http://www.truthdig.com/interview/item/20070330_jeremy_scahill_on_soldiers_of_fortune/

[Off_White]

Get paid while you're trained by the US military, then get out and make the big bucks off your publicly funded education, sweet deal. Of course, your next job might be for Sony or Daimler-Chrysler, it's a little harder to wave the flag for that corporate stuff, but here's your future.

[archenemy]

I haven't read the article, but don't we all go out and make money off our publicly funded (to one degree or another-no pun intended) education?

[drater]

Yes, my high school diploma has proved invaluable.

[Dechristo]

Does it matter whether your education is extensively formal? Doesn't much of it come from the public anyway?

[archenemy]

Yes, my high school diploma has proved invaluable.

Indeed.

And many a person has appreciated attending their:

Community College

State College

University of (insert state)

Or Non Profit Private University (tax break= public supported)

[olyclimber]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070917/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq;_ylt=Aql4IIFirYmFfQkXWBWHmZWs0NUE

[tvashtarkatena]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070917/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq;_ylt=Aql4IIFirYmFfQkXWBWHmZWs0NUE

 

It's about fucking time.

[Serenity]

That article is a fluff piece. BW does not work under license beholden to the Iraqi government. It will affect nothing whatsoever. I see all the usual suspects getting gleefully (and ignorantly) wrapped around the axles again.

[tvashtarkatena]

Well, at least the media is doing its job exposing the cockroaches to the light of day. Just one more much needed nail in the coffin of foriegn policy disaster.

[Serenity]

I'd love to take a few hours of my evening one of these days to discuss all this with you in person. What say you Patty Cake?

[tvashtarkatena]

Only if you spring for dinner.

[gt5816v]

Get paid while you're trained by the US military, then get out and make the big bucks off your publicly funded education, sweet deal. Of course, your next job might be for Sony or Daimler-Chrysler, it's a little harder to wave the flag for that corporate stuff, but here's your future.

 

The military turns out all kinds of technically trained people; doctors, lawyers, pilots etc..

[ScottP]

Yes, my high school diploma has proved invaluable.

 

A diploma isn't an education...

 

 

[olyclimber]

That article is a fluff piece. BW does not work under license beholden to the Iraqi government. It will affect nothing whatsoever. I see all the usual suspects getting gleefully (and ignorantly) wrapped around the axles again.

 

 

Serenity, I'm curious what you mean when you say this is a "fluff piece". Is it because you don't think the Iraqi government has the right to pull the agreement? Is it not their own country,to prosecute in as they see fit? Or is it because you don't think they will prosecute for whatever reason?

 

And could you shed some light on this:

 

"The question of whether they could face prosecution is a gray legal area. Unlike soldiers, they are not bound by the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Under a special provision secured by American-occupying forces, they are exempt from prosecution by Iraqis for crimes committed there."

 

I know what some here would say they believe what the reason for this special provision is for...but I'm curious as your take on why this provision was necessary. I'm not asking as one who is digging for conspiracy information...I just don't understand why that special provision was necessary.

 

 

[lI1|1!]

I'm curious what you mean when you say this is a "fluff piece".

 

 

 

i'm having a Marcel Proust moment.

[Serenity]

Hey Porter,

 

Everything in Iraq revolves around their greed during this unstable period. BW is the de facto paramilitary arm of the DoS, providing important protective services to dignitaries and politicians. No amount of Iraqi posturing or rhetoric is going to alter our stance to rightfully protect our personnel and our interests. The thought of Iraqi's prosecuting Americans involved in combat operations over there is completely inane. The government under Maliki is so incredibly corrupt that it is difficult to take anything they say with any amount of belief or conviction.

 

I guarantee you there is some kind of financial reason or deep seated personal vendetta that is driving those idiots to make a proclamation of this magnitude. BW probably refused to pay some kick backs to those sorry a$$ jag-offs and now the spin doctors are going to turn it into a sideline circus sideshow.

 

Eric Prince is actually a very good person, conscientious of the role his company is providing, and directs them to do everything they can to assist the military effort, working closely with civilian and military authorities to provide a much needed service in a difficult period. I do not work for BW, so I have no incentive to talk them up. The guys who get on with BW bring a lot of experience to the situation, and bring the same mentality and professionalism they carried with them through the SEAL teams, SWAT teams, or whatever operation they came from. The organization has become a target for low level journalists looking to bring attention to themselves by writing sensational pieces they know will catch certain groups attentions.

[Doug]

Interesting. I thought of you when I read the article today. So these guys and other security firms work under contract to the US Govt' and have to be licensed or otherwise blessed by the Iraqi Govt to operate in country?

 

Just out of curiosity, if they are under contract to the US Govt' and an incident occurs like the one in the article at what point does Iraqi Law allow the victims families to go after either BW or the US Govt'? What kind of law is there in Iraq right now?

 

My curiosity comes from working in Government contracting and some liability issues we've been looking at.

[Serenity]

I haven't worked in Iraq since 2005, and things change there. US Code is what they would be prosecuted under, if there were evidence of criminal activity. No one is going to throw an American under the bus for that corrupt piece of useless shit government to score some brownie points with whatever tribe is in fashion for the week.

 

"Like the incident that occurred in the article?" You mean the one where they were attacked by what the US terms "enemy combatants" and defended themselves and their motorcade against annihilation? Where they lawfully defended themselves, according to SOP written by State Department attorneys specifically for these types of situations? You mean the one where they dusted 8 of those sumbitches for trying to kill them? You mean the incident where all the AMERICANS came home safe with no casualties? I call that winning, and here's a pat on the back boys. I'm not sure what you call that.

 

Liability in war? BWAHAHAHAHA! I could TOTALLY understand that if we were talking about systematic murder of Iraqi's in a camp, but all that's going on is young Americans from all walks of life are over there trying to help those imbeciles out, and all that garbage over there wants to do is play little games, hell bent on murder, and theft.

 

And all the while far lefties with no connection cry foul everytime something like this comes out, when they have no firsthand knowledge, and the media gets it all wrong.

[dan_forester]

from this it sounds like there's been building resentment of private security contractors in Iraq:

 

...Iraqis have long complained about high-profile, heavily armed security vehicles careering through the streets, with guards pointing weapons at civilians and sometimes firing warning shots at anyone deemed too close.

 

from your experience over there does this sound like standard operating procedure?

[G-spotter]

What is the current exchange rate for Iraqi lives vs. American lives? Obviously an American life is worth much more but HOW much more? Maybe the statisticians at the Economist can produce a chart showing how much this has fluctuated since 2002.

[Mal_Con]

Obviously Iraqi lives are given a value close to 0 as they were not until recently even counted.

[Serenity]

Dan,

 

Keep in mind that Iraq is a violent place. For every incident you hear or read about, whatever the nature of the incident, there are perhaps hundreds more that go unnoticed. It is the nature of reporting to try and sensationalize the events that a particular reporter might find themselves privy to.

 

The ROE dictates the level of force permissible. This ranges from alert behavior to the right to repel deadly force. The force continuum is similar to your rights as a civilian. Force may be met with force as necessary.

 

SOP varies from team to team, and depends on the environment, threat level, specific threat, etc. There are hard and fast rules, but in war, Mr. Murphy tends to intrude frequently.

 

Some people tend to see this whole issue with such a jaded perspective that they are almost totally unable to see past their preconceived notions. Dru, you are one of those people, and therefore you tend to not get listened to much. Your spew is tired, tired, tired.

[foraker]

Dru, you are one of those people, and therefore you tend to not get listened to much.

 

Have you asked him about the bio-genic origin of petroleum yet? That shit never gets old.

[Serenity]

If that will give him a forum to fixate on, I'd be thrilled to start a thread right now.