Efficient trad. racking?

[yakimuchacho]

I want to hear some suggestions for organizing a trad rack. I waste a lot of time and energy fumbling with gear . What have you found to be helpful or not? I have a set of heuvos, 4-10 Metolius cams, red yellow green alien, pink red tri-cam, and #8-11 hexes.

 

I carry most of the gear on lead in case I need to build an anchor. Should I just treat each climb individually and rack according to the route? By size/range? By type of pro.?

 

I think I just answered my question: try it all and see what works. Duh!

What do you do for organizing a trad rack (pro, biners, slings, all of it)?

[Dru]

Some people will tell you to rack it all on your harness. Fuck 'em they probably sport climb too.

Put the GEAR on your harness. Rack nuts, hexes and tRicams on your "off" hand and cams on your "on" hand side. For instance if you are right handed put cams on your right hand side. Reason being if you are pumped you are going to quickly throw in a cam and its easier to use your main hand to do it. Whereas to fiddle in a nut or hex you are probably going to be at some sort of rest so you can use your less dextrous off hand.

 

Put the draws on a shoulder sling around your neck, or a gear sling (better). This way you can grab draws with either hand.

 

Don't do it the other way around (ie gear on a sling and draws on the harness). People will tell you to, but they are not adherents of the "system". The big advantage is thjat when you are familiar with this system you always know which hand to reach for what piece of gear with. With gear on the shoulder sling the gear gets mixed up.

 

The one time you vary from this system is leading a dihedral, with liebacking. Don't rack any gear on the side thats pushed against the dihedral wall as it will be hard to get at.

 

Oh yes - only take the gear you need up the climb. Why would you take big hexes and a #4 camalot up a finger crack?

[Dane]

I use a sling and rack small to large, front to back. I'll rack specifically for a difficult climb where I know or can easily guess the order they will be needed. Free biners and QDs in the back of the gear. Long slings...if you use/need them over the shoulder. Take a look at each pitch and put the gear sling on the side that makes the most sense as Dru noted. Never been a big fan of racking on the harness unless it is a bolted sport route where you just clip and go, no need to decide which piece to grab.

 

Too much gear makes it hard to climb at your potential. Too little can make for some long run outs. If you are still figuring it all out take "enough", don't be shy.

 

One of the things that makes a good trad climber is plugging in the right stuff with little effort. Finding what you need quickly is a BIG part of that. I like color coded slings on my cams. Wires by size, one or two sizes to a biner.

 

For good practice try leading a crack of moderate difficulty for your ability with lots of different size placements and lace it up on lead a few times. Never use the same piece of gear in the same spot. You'll be amazed how quickly you get at choosing the right piece on your rack if you have the time and energy to look for the right piece of gear and not worry about winging off.

 

Try both a sling and your harness and decide which you like best. I like a sling to get the gear high and away from my feet and being able to see everything with little effort right in front of me. Others like the lower center of gravity from a harness rack an have no problem finding where they put each piece just by feel.

 

Play with both styles on easy leads and decide for yourself what works best for you.

[chucK]

Dru's system will work really well as long as all your gear placing happens at no-hands stances .

 

I place draws on the back loops of the harness. You can reach them with either hand there too. Gear goes on a sling, in some organized fashion (one biner to each cam BTW) that can be remembered. Except when climbing slabs. In that case an around the shoulder sling is a PiTA because it hangs down and interferes with your view of your foot placements.

[Dru]

Don't listen to chucK

 

With his system you will run out of draws on one side first.

 

The back gear loops are for big gear like #4 camalots to kep them out of the way

The front gear loops are for smaller gear like yellow TCUs. Grab and go.

 

"No hands rests only" whatever chucK You sound like a sprotclimbre

[Nick]

I've tried a lot of systems. What I like now for alpine trad routes is to put biners, cordelettes, etc. on the harness and gear on a sling. I use a short sling and clip two or three cams each to a single large wire gate biner (grouped by size and type). All the nuts go on one keylock biner. A few hexes go on another biner (hexes slung on webbing with the webbing pulled halfway through the hex and doubled so the hex stays close to the biner and does not tangle other gear). I organize the gear this way so that it stays easy to find and does not tangle. I clip aliens and DMM cams to their biners by the loop in the cam's stem cable(s) instead of letting cams dangle by their slings. Cams and hexes clipped short this way stay high up on my rib cage and do not get in the way of climbing, and do not block the view of my feet. As I am used to the system, my fingers can quickly ferret out the right bunch of cams (big in back, small in front) and then it's easy to find the right one by feel, slide it up the biner gate and push it through the gate. This has turned out to be the fastest, cleanest, most compact and tangle free system for me. I usually carry about 5 aliens and 4 to 8 larger cams, two or three hexes, and 9 or so nuts, so this is a very compact rack with the aliens all on two biners and the larger cams bunched two to a biner.

 

I like the flexibility built in to placing gear this way:

1) find the right peice

2)place the peice

3)choose the right length draw

4)clip the draw

 

This system is biased toward alpine routes where you use a variety of long draws and seldom clip the rope directly to the biner on the cam's short sling.

 

I often climb with a pack on and this has a strong influence on racking methods as the pack tends to push a bulky shoulder slung rack around in front of your body.

[genepires]

There is no one perfect way (or "system") to rack all the gear. Best to get used to many different ways, each appropriate for different situation.

 

For multi-pitch were swapping leads, a gear sling is very handy to swapping gear and getting out of the belay quickly. Why waste time racking onto the harness at every belay? (and risk dropping gear) So I usually rack nuts to #2 camalot on gear sling and anything bigger on the back of the harness. Draws evenly distributed on both sides of harness.

 

For craggin - all rock pro on front gear loop on both sides. small (front) to large (back). Passive and small cams on one side, large cams on the other. Draws on back on both sides.

 

My own personal feeling is that I don't like that metolious multi-loop gear rack as I find it hard to see my feet. I have a hard time moving the whole mess to the side unlike the standard type gear sling. Maybe due to that I learned on the standard rack and therefore lack the skills. People who always had a multi loop type don't seem to have issues.

 

enjoy the rock climbing were ever you can! seems wet everywhere.

 

 

"I have the body of a god........buddha"

[chelle]

I do not use a gear harness unless I am aid climbing. Gear on a harness ALWAYS is in my way and frustrates me. I also feel more inbalance with the weight at my center of gravity. Developing a system for racking gear, especially when you are a newer trad leader is important. Organization will help you be more efficient, and you need it since you are likely carrying more gear than a leader who is more experienced. There is no "right" way to do it. Develop your own system and ignore people's suggestions that don't work for you. When you're on lead it is your ass on the line and whatever works for you to keep you safe is what matters. A good climbing partner would understand that you may have a different way of doing things and respect that without flipping you too much shit. With my partners who prefer a harness, they either have one to rack gear on during their leads or they use one of the slings. At swaps we are careful to make sure the other person has the pieces (usually with a verbal "got it") so nothing gets dropped. If you are efficient this take no more time than using a gear sling and having to reorder the cams and other gear so it is organized. IMO what makes climbers very slow at belay swaps is poor rope management and creating a cluster with a big pile of rope that has to be cleaned up.

 

Dru- I learned this way from a very good trad climber who is about the same height as me and agrees that gear harnesses SUCK!

 

Here is my system. If I take 2 sets of cams then I rack them from smallest to biggest on the front loops of my harness, one set on each side (camelots on the R and metolius on the L). Nuts in the back. I always know where to grab to get the right size cam, since I always rack the same.

 

If I don't take 2 sets of cams then one full set goes on the front loop on my right side (since I am right handed) and the doubles and nuts go on the other side. The exception is when I am climbing a pitch where I know I will be eithier R-side in or L-side in then gear goes on opposite side.

 

I split the draws evenly between R & L and they go on the back gear loops. With a couple extra slings around my neck incase I need to extend a draw further.

 

Have fun climbing on gear. Try a few different approaches on single pitch climbs tofigure out what works for you.

[Dru]

Your systems are all inferior. Mine is the best. I am the prophet. My way is the only way. Follow me.

 

Try my way for 3 days and you will never go back

[cman]

I am going along with genepires, there is no one way. i use a gear sling a lot. at index some of the climbs are long and i place a lot of gear, so the sling is handy. on harder climbs or slabs, no gear sling is best.

i mostly rack up tripled up slings for draws and rack them on my harness. for alpine i add longer slings over the shoulder as necessary.

 

you best bet is just to know your gear and get better at placing it, then a variety of systems will work.

[scott]

for harder trad leads near my limit, i often rack symmetrically -- if i have a double rack i rack on my harness, say #2 and #1 and 4 draws in the back loop, and smaller cams in the front loop with the smallest in the front. the same on both sides, and each cam with a biner. i rack nuts and a few extra draws on the sling. this way, no matter which hand you have free, you are more likely to find the gear you need on this side of your body.

i don't see many people racking this way, but it works well for short trad climbs (less than 5 pitches where time spent reracking at the belay is not an issue)

[JackY]

 

The one thing that I'm always thankful for is having everything racked on key-lock biners (no hook on the nose). It's saves a lot of energy getting gear off the sling or harness.

[JosephH]

I use a Metolius "Big Wall" double sling with a very small pouch on the back - the single vs. multi-loop one:

 

Metolius Big Wall Gear Sling

 

I rack protection small to large, front to back on the right sling with stoppers sorted by size on the four biners in the front, cams are after that one to a biner. [Trad] draws on the left sling, free biners on the two shoulder strap loops, long slings over my shoulder.

 

This is a very, very comfortable and balanced rack and you can either put wallet, keys, food bar or a water bladder in the pouch. Wouldn't go back to another way of racking for any reason.

 

P.S. I also never liked racking on my harness - gives me the willies for some reason...

[ScottP]

Your systems are all inferior. Mine is the best. I am the prophet. My way is the only way. Follow me.

 

Try my way for 3 days and you will never go back

 

Are you right-handed or left-handed?

[Blake]

Some people will tell you to rack it all on your harness. Fuck 'em they probably sport climb too.

Put the GEAR on your harness. Rack nuts, hexes and tRicams on your "off" hand and cams on your "on" hand side. For instance if you are right handed put cams on your right hand side. Reason being if you are pumped you are going to quickly throw in a cam and its easier to use your main hand to do it. Whereas to fiddle in a nut or hex you are probably going to be at some sort of rest so you can use your less dextrous off hand.

 

Put the draws on a shoulder sling around your neck, or a gear sling (better). This way you can grab draws with either hand.

 

Don't do it the other way around (ie gear on a sling and draws on the harness). People will tell you to, but they are not adherents of the "system". The big advantage is thjat when you are familiar with this system you always know which hand to reach for what piece of gear with. With gear on the shoulder sling the gear gets mixed up.

 

The one time you vary from this system is leading a dihedral, with liebacking. Don't rack any gear on the side thats pushed against the dihedral wall as it will be hard to get at.

 

Oh yes - only take the gear you need up the climb. Why would you take big hexes and a #4 camalot up a finger crack?

 

 

Wouldn't the draws be dangling down from your gear sling, and tangle up with your pro which is placed on your harness?

[Dru]

Your systems are all inferior. Mine is the best. I am the prophet. My way is the only way. Follow me.

 

Try my way for 3 days and you will never go back

 

Are you right-handed or left-handed?

 

if you have the opposite handedness just rack up in the miror image position

[Kevin_Matlock]

[Trad] draws on the left sling, free biners on the two shoulder strap loops, long slings over my shoulder.

 

What's a trad draw compared to a normal draw? Is this just a couple of biners and a runner made to whatever length you might need at the moment?

[Dru]

Trad draws are placed from the ground up

[RuMR]

...and hand stitched as opposed to powerstitched...

[JosephH]

 

What's a trad draw compared to a normal draw? Is this just a couple of biners and a runner made to whatever length you might need at the moment?

 

Yep, most are double looped, but I'm going through replacing them with dyneema which makes for triple looped which I'm not sure I like compared with doubled, but oh well...

 

[Real trad draws are hemp and hand tied with one hand as you need them...]

[RuMR]

[Real trad draws are hemp and hand tied with one hand as you need them...]

 

...and then you can smoke 'em at the end of the daze...

[selkirk]

[Trad] draws on the left sling, free biners on the two shoulder strap loops, long slings over my shoulder.

 

What's a trad draw compared to a normal draw? Is this just a couple of biners and a runner made to whatever length you might need at the moment?

 

since this is a valid question and were not in spray....

 

trad draws are typically made from a single length runner (24 in long roughly?) Clip both biners into opposite ends, pass one biner through the other biner and then clip the loops. Ends up tripled I think? Nice, short compact, then if you need to extend it, you unclip one of the biners, clip one of the strands and give it a tug, should return to full length

[ken4ord]

Here's my opinion, oh yeah Dru I already know it sux, so whats your point?

 

I hate gear slings so I almost always rack on my harness. I can reach the gear with either hand and I don't have a mess of gear swinging in front of me every time I go to make a move. Cams on the left side (I am left handed, but I can still reach them with my right) organized on single biners small cams up front to big towards the back, followed by draws. Very large cams 3.5 Camelots and up I will put in the back loops unless I know I will definitely need them. For that matter if I have gear that I know I won't need I will leave it with my partner or put it on the back loops of my harness. On the right I have nuts and tri cams if I am carrying them, followed by draws. Usually I only have nuts unless I know there is pockets, then tri-cams can be useful. You say hexs, yeah there light, I'll give them that, but why use them when cams are so easy to use and you already have them on ya. In the back loops of my harness are spare biners, cordelettes, nut tool, knife, locker, belay device, sometimes a windshirt. I will usually shoulder several slings with a single biner attached.

 

With all that said though I can climb with any system that my partner uses. Being flexible, predicting placement stance, gear selection efficency and learning how to make do with what you have and don't have, is way more important than where you put all the crap.

[texplorer]

My System -its gotten me up .12 cracks and all the way up the Nose in a day

 

1. Slings, Quickdraws -on harness (slings doubled up in a way in which you unclip a biner and reclip any one strand to extend)

 

2. Metolious gear sling

-aliens in front to larger camalots toward the back

-nuts can go in the very front or on harness

 

3. Rack every cam on its own biner/all nuts on one or two biners

 

4. Take only sizes that you think you will place plus one size bigger and smaller (sometimes you misjudge from the ground)

 

Problems with my system

1. stuff can swing around when you don't want it to.

2. it can sometimes be hard to reach the back cams

3. may need to switch loop to other side if in a dihedral

 

Problems with racking on harness

1. hard to reach cams on opposite side if in desperate situation where only one hand is good

2. weighs down harness

3. less room to rack

4. gear gets in way of "thrutching" and "scooting" on wall

5. you look like a sport climber or worse (canadian)

[Dru]

i dunno tex. sport climbers, when redpointing and not pinkpointing, have draws on the harness. so when you throw a rack of gear around your neck and leave draws on the harness, you look like.... a sportclimber in trad drag. whereas with gear on the harness you look properly trad, like maybe you should have a pin hammer on there too with a pint of stout in your chalk bag, crack scarred hands and a helmet with slash marks from a peregrine's beak.