genepires

I felt that solitude was standard fare for even 3 oclock rock. (when compared to the other usual suspect climbing areas) Now it will be practically deserted and become another static point. Road to spring mtn has issues too. Road to squire is unknown also. Could be a long walk to anything with slabs for a while.

Scary.

Well D, he is held to a different standard maybe because history has a way of repeating itself. As you said earlier, it is unlikely that he will be able to pull off the ascent as he described it. (weather windows) Therefore, the assumption is that he will need to resort to the same BS as last year in order to create his route and appease the sponsors. My opinion really means nothing and I doubt that I ever had or while have the skill base to climb in patagonia. But I like to think that there are places in the world where real men (and women) can climb a mountain on the mountains terms, without any more man-made aid than what they bring to ascent. Pure man vs mountain. These places can stand as a model of pure adventure that lesser men can strive towards at their own home mountain ranges. When Cerro torre becomes a place where sport climbers go to get their groove on, where else can one look at for that purity? (not that Lama is creating pure sport route, but is pushing it in that direction) there are no pure ranges left in the world. It is not about norms and accepted practices of the climbing world.

I AM BROKE BUT I GOT ENOUGH TO WRITE IN all caps. Quit yelling at me.

Except that what is acceptable in one part of the world may not be acceptable in other parts of the world. It is all about local ethics. If the local ethic (which may be the ethics not of actual locals only but locals and the foreign climbers who visit there) states that there is a certain way of doing things, then as a community, others should respect those ethics. I would assume that Rolando is a good representative of the local ethics. If your thinking were true, then I could go to that eastern bloc climbing area that doesn't allow chalk or metal protection, (I forget the name) and do as I want and claim a moral superiority due to the ethics of yosemite and the rest of the climbing world.

that is what god created the internet for!

sounds like rather typical pandome conditions. Pure terror.

Portabands cut through all kinds of metal. It would give a straight cut but you might be able to make a couple cuts to make is kinda round. No clue about temperature though. Dane has more knowledge about metals.

not about owning the mountain but rather respecting the mountain, the sport, and the other members of the climbing culture. I think that sport climbing does not have to exist on every rock face. There should be places where adventure rules. (even if most of us have no possibility of getting up it)

got those days free and looking to get out in the alpine in snoq pass. maybe tooth or chair for a rad "winter" ascent. Should be very spring like. or rock climbing for that matter.

comparing cerro torre to garfield? While I am not an expert on this whole problem in either torre or garfield, it seems the major problem with the cerro torre bolting issue is that the bolting is going on near cracks. While there are a few places that natural gear could have gone into infinite bliss, this place is fairly devoid of natural protection.

great trip! thanks for the granite stoke.

I know somewhere on this site shows how to post photos. Maybe the newbie section?

nice looking snow conditions. thanks for the TR. there must be an easy way to post the pictures from another website like you tried. Prolly just a couple of commands needed. I usually download to the photo library.

I was with Alex when he activated the screamer. He wasn't very far above the screamer, maybe a couple of feet. It was weird that the screamer was fully activated. All the stitching was pulled. Makes me wonder about the utility of a screamer. Seems like a couple of stitches should have pulled but not them all. If this is how they usually work, then any fall over 5 feet would always rip all the stitching and land full onto the extended webbing. My vision of a screamer was that on a big fall, stitching pulls limiting the force over the course of the fall. There would be a couple stitches left and the full peak force of a fall would never be felt by the ice screw. Am I wrong with this concept?

depends how many you have. If you only got a couple then you should place them on the suspect pieces. If you got 10, then put them everywhere. The screamers are not that expensive though, so it would be a good idea to load up on them load limiters.

If you are 100 feet up at a belay. Leader goes out 10 feet from belay with no gear in between him and the anchor, falls, then you got a fall factor 2. If the ground is steep enough and the belayer does not let go of the rope, you will walk away.

sorry, it was just a hypothesis that most likely is wrong like most hypothesises. No research was done before my proposition.

there is a chance that cynicalwoodsman = summitchaser. no proof of it but the timing is there. Only the gods of the digital information know the real identities.

I can't figure out to laugh or be scared.

Just because you can't spell a word doesn't mean you are not that. Besides you spelled egomaniacal and douchebag in your posting. A real douchebag pays money to look at used panties without a girl attached it them.

there is probably as many reasons as there are climbers who leave them. One that I can think of- for extremely overhanging terrain, it is too hard to clean the draws while being lowered. Others have said it was a convenience for other sport climbers. This is just conjecture as I have never been on ground where it wasn't easy to clean the gear off. Hard sport is not my bag.

those are costco racks in the background

Thanks for sharing your perspective. I look forward to discussing it with you at the crag sometime. Cheers, Orion You won't be seeing Raindawg or any of the whiners at Little Si or Smith Rock. They don't climb anymore. or if they do, doubtful if it reaches the 5.6 scale but they certainly like to judge people, thats their thing, not climbing. What are you thinking Orion trying to climb a route that may be to diffcult for you? You should be like these guys, and participate in "Assured Outcome" climbing. There are valid points on both sides of the arguement. But claiming that because someone can only climb 5.6 and therefore his point of view is invalid is a lame one. Ones skill level (wether true or not) is irrelevant to the validity of a point of view. Raindawg's may be extreme but his points are more valid than the majority of the stuff written here. These attacks on his personality only strengthen Raindawg's arguements about the character of sport climbers. Orion is an example of a reasonable guy with cool character. Thanks for the work you and others did up there.

Maybe if we decorated the fixed draws with festive colors it would be appealing to hikers. Maybe coordinate them with the seasons. Halloween the draws could be orange and black and maybe hang pumpkins from them. Xmas could all be red and green with tree decorations on every bolt. Hell, we could string up pretty lights all over the wall too. The hikers would think it is some art and religous thing and say good things to the land managers. For the fourth of july, we could have fireworks shooting out of climbers asses.