KaskadskyjKozak Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 this thread is worse than a Kiss concert. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Sums it up pretty well, IMO: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/15/cheney-dont-blame-bush-administration-economic-woes/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JosephH Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Sums it up pretty well, IMO: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/15/cheney-dont-blame-bush-administration-economic-woes/ The only way Cheney could "sum it up" is if he were speaking from behind bars for treason... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serenity Posted March 16, 2009 Author Share Posted March 16, 2009 Sums it up pretty well, IMO: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/15/cheney-dont-blame-bush-administration-economic-woes/ The only way Cheney could "sum it up" is if he were speaking from behind bars for treason... Your words could easily be labeled 'sedition'. Just saying... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 this thread is worse than a Kiss concert. Someone come. White man come. White man with black eye and monster shoes come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JosephH Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Sums it up pretty well, IMO: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/15/cheney-dont-blame-bush-administration-economic-woes/ The only way Cheney could "sum it up" is if he were speaking from behind bars for treason... Your words could easily be labeled 'sedition'. Just saying... It is a funny world when treason becomes diplomacy and patriotism becomes sedition - happened often enough, though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Sounds like it was a reasonable approach for the time. But this in no way bolsters your claim that Iraq was a "puppet regime" of the United States. so, not suprisingly, it's your view that it's reasonable for an administration to conceal and outright lie to the masses regarding its actions in foreign lands, even in cases where such behavior could bring the whole house down on top of everyone's head? as for the semantic game regarding "puppet regime" - the original topic of the thread was gitmo. an argument was called to justify the stain it made on our name. none was provided, but it was suggested that, hey, it ain't so bad, and we've built up such good credit on our name that we can be a little naughty for awhile and it'll be okay. to contradict that, a general pattern of our nation acting like an asshole was constructed, including our behavior towards iran and use of iraq. does it matter what exactly the defintion of "puppet regime" is between us and wether iraq fit it at the time? the bottomline was we took the country under our wing, so to speak, and in the process assumed for our national shame the crimes of that regime, including the one that today marks the anniversary of, the massive use of chemical/nerve agents on a civilian population in halabja, which killed thousands (and which we did not let us distract from our "special relationship") pix speak a thousand words, here's some to make the fruit of our foreign policy, and the need for improving it by not building future gitmos, clearer: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akhalteke Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 "pix speak a thousand words, here's some to make the fruit of our foreign policy, and the need for improving it by not building future gitmos, clearer:" These were taken 20 years before gitmo; correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 One of the problems in discussing an issue such as this on this forum, is that the style lends itself more to sound bites and partial explanations. This is a complex issue not easily resolved or explained this way. So folks anger rises, however: I suspect if you all sat down around a campfire and talked this over, something close to agreement would form, or lacking such, certainly clarity on others views and emotions over this issue. I said my piece, and although it was a lengthy diatribe, it wasn't even the half of it. Regards to all bill PS, Scott, I've been thinking about your comment about having sworn an oath to uphold and protect the constitution. I think that having done that myself, it has influenced how I think on many subjects. I suspect that one of the largest issues not dealt with in schools these days is the lack of discussing how our country was formed, and the sacrifices those early gentlemen took or the break in values their core beliefs really were at the time. It seems to be an acceptable cliche on the left hand side of the isle to diss and slam them for slavery and greed, but not acknowledge the real and true risks they took in the belief that they were making a better brighter future for all mankind. My kids were deeply and intimately schooled on and about Martin Luther King and the Civil rights movement yet had not even heard of George Washington. Really. This is perhaps a failing which is a bad thing for all of us as a country, and we end up with each of us eventually having self-centered viewpoints and truths, and unable to see others viewpoints and truths via a shared deeply held value system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 That you would declare American responsibility for the Halabja attack--with only the flimsiest of connections to back your assertion--says more about your own sense of self-loathing and your own deep seated desire to bring down the house than it does about any declared 'concern' for said house. Very dark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bug Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 My kids were deeply and intimately schooled on and about Martin Luther King and the Civil rights movement yet had not even heard of George Washington. Really. This is perhaps a failing which is a bad thing for all of us as a country, and we end up with each of us eventually having self-centered viewpoints and truths, and unable to see others viewpoints and truths via a shared deeply held value system. That's why I volunteer in my kids' classrooms. I make sure the teachers have the time to cover what they need to. I always see about a dozen other parents volunteering also. It's a great way to improve your kids' education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 That you would declare American responsibility for the Halabja attack--with only the flimsiest of connections to back your assertion--says more about your own sense of self-loathing and your own deep seated desire to bring down the house than it does about any declared 'concern' for said house. Very dark. so, you and i living in the same neighborhood, were i to give you a gun and say, hey, neither of us like the guy across the street very much, now, if you were to go and do whatever you liked to him, i'd have no problem with it, in fact would be sure to continue making presents to you - you'd say in this situation i'd have no responsibility for the grisly scene that followed? you like to pull the self-loathing tack - is it loathing your wife to notice she's got a big fat zit on her face? that her breath stinks in the morning? or are you actually capable of making honest observations like those and still loving her? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akhalteke Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Good for you Bug. The only way to ensure your kids are being taught properly is to be a part of their education. I wish all parents were as concerned for their children's education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Good for you Bug. The only way to ensure your kids are being taught properly is to be a part of their education. I wish all parents were as concerned for their children's education. x3 relying on teachers to educate your kids is like trusting only to a doctor to keep you healthy - they're of great assistance to be certain, but much of the responsibilty remains your own Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 My kids were deeply and intimately schooled on and about Martin Luther King and the Civil rights movement yet had not even heard of George Washington. Really. This is perhaps a failing which is a bad thing for all of us as a country, and we end up with each of us eventually having self-centered viewpoints and truths, and unable to see others viewpoints and truths via a shared deeply held value system. Perhaps, all schoolchildren should be required to pass the Naturalization citizen test. Current USCIS Test Questions (Click on the question to see the answer.) 1. What are the colors of our flag? 2. How many stars are there in our flag? 3. What color are the stars on our flag? 4. What do the stars on the flag mean? 5. How many stripes are there in the flag? 6. What color are the stripes? 7. What do the stripes on the flag mean? 8. How many states are there in the Union? 9. What is the 4th of July? 10. What is the date of Independence Day? 11. Independence from whom? 12. What country did we fight during the Revolutionary War? 13. Who was the first President of the United States? 14. Who is the President of the United States today? 15. Who is the vice-president of the United States today? 16. Who elects the President of the United States? 17. Who becomes President of the United States if the President should die? 18. For how long do we elect the President? 19. What is the Constitution? 20. Can the Constitution be changed? 21. What do we call a change to the Constitution? 22. How many changes or amendments are there to the Constitution? 23. How many branches are there in our government? 24. What are the three branches of our government? 25. What is the legislative branch of our government? 26. Who makes the laws in the United States? 27. What is the Congress? 28. What are the duties of Congress? 29. Who elects the Congress? 30. How many senators are there in Congress? 31. Can you name the two senators from your state? 32. For how long do we elect each senator? 33. How many representatives are there in Congress? 34. For how long do we elect the representatives? 35. What is the executive branch of our government? 36. What is the judiciary branch of our government? 37. What are the duties of the Supreme Court? 38. What is the supreme court law of the United States? 39. What is the Bill of Rights? 40. What is the capital of your state? 41. Who is the current governor of your state? 42. Who becomes President of the United States if the President and the vice-president should die? 43. Who is the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court? 44. Can you name thirteen original states? 45. Who said, "Give me liberty or give me death."? 46. Which countries were our enemies during World War II? 47. What are the 49th and 50th states of the Union? 48. How many terms can the President serve? 49. Who was Martin Luther King, Jr.? 50. Who is the head of your local government? 51. According to the Constitution, a person must meet certain requirements in order to be eligible to become President. Name one of these requirements. 52. Why are there 100 Senators in the Senate? 53. Who selects the Supreme Court justice? 54. How many Supreme Court justice are there? 55. Why did the Pilgrims come to America? 56. What is the head executive of a state government called? 57. What is the head executive of a city government called? 58. What holiday was celebrated for the first time by the Americans colonists? 59. Who was the main writer of the Declaration of Independence? 60. When was the Declaration of Independence adopted? 61. What is the basic belief of the Declaration of Independence? 62. What is the national anthem of the United States? 63. Who wrote the Star-Spangled Banner? 64. Where does freedom of speech come from? 65. What is a minimum voting age in the United States? 66. Who signs bills into law? 67. What is the highest court in the United States? 68. Who was the President during the Civil War? 69. What did the Emancipation Declaration do? 70. What special group advises the President? 71. Which President is called the "Father of our country"? 72. What Immigration and Naturalization Service form is used to apply to become a naturalized citizen? 73. Who helped the Pilgrims in America? 74. What is the name of the ship that brought the Pilgrims to America? 75. What are the 13 original states of the U.S. called? 76. Name 3 rights of freedom guaranteed by the Bill of Rights. 77. Who has the power to declare the war? 78. What kind of government does the United States have? 79. Which President freed the slaves? 80. In what year was the Constitution written? 81. What are the first 10 amendments to the Constitution called? 82. Name one purpose of the United Nations? 83. Where does Congress meet? 84. Whose rights are guaranteed by the Constitution and the Bill of Rights? 85. What is the introduction to the Constitution called? 86. Name one benefit of being citizen of the United States. 87. What is the most important right granted to U.S. citizens? 88. What is the United States Capitol? 89. What is the White House? 90. Where is the White House located? 91. What is the name of the President's official home? 92. Name the right guaranteed by the first amendment. 93. Who is the Commander in Chief of the U.S. military? 94. Which President was the first Commander in Chief of the U.S. military? 95. In what month do we vote for the President? 96. In what month is the new President inaugurated? 97. How many times may a Senator be re-elected? 98. How many times may a Congressman be re-elected? 99. What are the 2 major political parties in the U.S. today? 100. How many states are there in the United States today? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 My kids were deeply and intimately schooled on and about Martin Luther King and the Civil rights movement yet had not even heard of George Washington. Really. This is perhaps a failing which is a bad thing for all of us as a country, and we end up with each of us eventually having self-centered viewpoints and truths, and unable to see others viewpoints and truths via a shared deeply held value system. Perhaps, all schoolchildren should be required to pass the Naturalization citizen test. Current USCIS Test Questions (Click on the question to see the answer.) 1. What are the colors of our flag? 2. How many stars are there in our flag? 3. What color are the stars on our flag? 4. What do the stars on the flag mean? 5. How many stripes are there in the flag? 6. What color are the stripes? 7. What do the stripes on the flag mean? 8. How many states are there in the Union? 9. What is the 4th of July? 10. What is the date of Independence Day? 11. Independence from whom? 12. What country did we fight during the Revolutionary War? 13. Who was the first President of the United States? 14. Who is the President of the United States today? 15. Who is the vice-president of the United States today? 16. Who elects the President of the United States? 17. Who becomes President of the United States if the President should die? 18. For how long do we elect the President? 19. What is the Constitution? 20. Can the Constitution be changed? 21. What do we call a change to the Constitution? 22. How many changes or amendments are there to the Constitution? 23. How many branches are there in our government? 24. What are the three branches of our government? 25. What is the legislative branch of our government? 26. Who makes the laws in the United States? 27. What is the Congress? 28. What are the duties of Congress? 29. Who elects the Congress? 30. How many senators are there in Congress? 31. Can you name the two senators from your state? 32. For how long do we elect each senator? 33. How many representatives are there in Congress? 34. For how long do we elect the representatives? 35. What is the executive branch of our government? 36. What is the judiciary branch of our government? 37. What are the duties of the Supreme Court? 38. What is the supreme court law of the United States? 39. What is the Bill of Rights? 40. What is the capital of your state? 41. Who is the current governor of your state? 42. Who becomes President of the United States if the President and the vice-president should die? 43. Who is the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court? 44. Can you name thirteen original states? 45. Who said, "Give me liberty or give me death."? 46. Which countries were our enemies during World War II? 47. What are the 49th and 50th states of the Union? 48. How many terms can the President serve? 49. Who was Martin Luther King, Jr.? 50. Who is the head of your local government? 51. According to the Constitution, a person must meet certain requirements in order to be eligible to become President. Name one of these requirements. 52. Why are there 100 Senators in the Senate? 53. Who selects the Supreme Court justice? 54. How many Supreme Court justice are there? 55. Why did the Pilgrims come to America? 56. What is the head executive of a state government called? 57. What is the head executive of a city government called? 58. What holiday was celebrated for the first time by the Americans colonists? 59. Who was the main writer of the Declaration of Independence? 60. When was the Declaration of Independence adopted? 61. What is the basic belief of the Declaration of Independence? 62. What is the national anthem of the United States? 63. Who wrote the Star-Spangled Banner? 64. Where does freedom of speech come from? 65. What is a minimum voting age in the United States? 66. Who signs bills into law? 67. What is the highest court in the United States? 68. Who was the President during the Civil War? 69. What did the Emancipation Declaration do? 70. What special group advises the President? 71. Which President is called the "Father of our country"? 72. What Immigration and Naturalization Service form is used to apply to become a naturalized citizen? 73. Who helped the Pilgrims in America? 74. What is the name of the ship that brought the Pilgrims to America? 75. What are the 13 original states of the U.S. called? 76. Name 3 rights of freedom guaranteed by the Bill of Rights. 77. Who has the power to declare the war? 78. What kind of government does the United States have? 79. Which President freed the slaves? 80. In what year was the Constitution written? 81. What are the first 10 amendments to the Constitution called? 82. Name one purpose of the United Nations? 83. Where does Congress meet? 84. Whose rights are guaranteed by the Constitution and the Bill of Rights? 85. What is the introduction to the Constitution called? 86. Name one benefit of being citizen of the United States. 87. What is the most important right granted to U.S. citizens? 88. What is the United States Capitol? 89. What is the White House? 90. Where is the White House located? 91. What is the name of the President's official home? 92. Name the right guaranteed by the first amendment. 93. Who is the Commander in Chief of the U.S. military? 94. Which President was the first Commander in Chief of the U.S. military? 95. In what month do we vote for the President? 96. In what month is the new President inaugurated? 97. How many times may a Senator be re-elected? 98. How many times may a Congressman be re-elected? 99. What are the 2 major political parties in the U.S. today? 100. How many states are there in the United States today? i give an (abbreviated) version of that test every year! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 why abbreviated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 why abbreviated? b/c i don't like being distracted from drinking my coffee and reading the sports page for that long? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akhalteke Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 "Name the purpose of the UN" Still haven't figured out that one... Pass meaningless resolutions perhaps? Did I get it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 "Name the purpose of the UN" Still haven't figured out that one... Pass meaningless resolutions perhaps? Did I get it? i always get that one confused w/: "name the purpose of star fleet and the united federation of planets" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Good morning, detainees! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serenity Posted March 16, 2009 Author Share Posted March 16, 2009 Welcome to my troll thread. So how about those AIG bonuses eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akhalteke Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 They deserve it. How else would they fund the opulent lifestyles that we yearn for and thus work for; stimulating the national economy through taxes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 You all should hike up to Willis Wall today and discuss the Gitmo detainees up there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akhalteke Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Lets hold our discussion 1/2 way up the wall. I might be a little late. Fee free to start without me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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