pakistan

[akhalteke]

Why don't you enlighten us?

 

Fuck politics, got anymore cool pictures/movies from that neck of the woods?

 

Inshallah

 

Yeah, I watch that before my morning PT today and... shit just a well put together video. Exactly what it is all about.

[Serenity]

Thanks for taking a peek.

 

It Takes a School, Not Missiles

 

By NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF

 

July 13, 2008

 

Since 9/11, Westerners have tried two approaches to fight terrorism in Pakistan, President Bush’s and Greg Mortenson’s.

 

Mr. Bush has focused on military force and provided more than $10 billion — an extraordinary sum in the foreign-aid world — to the highly unpopular government of President Pervez Musharraf. This approach has failed: the backlash has radicalized Pakistan’s tribal areas so that they now nurture terrorists in ways that they never did before 9/11.

 

Mr. Mortenson, a frumpy, genial man from Montana, takes a diametrically opposite approach, and he has spent less than one-ten-thousandth as much as the Bush administration. He builds schools in isolated parts of Pakistan and Afghanistan, working closely with Muslim clerics and even praying with them at times.

 

The only thing that Mr. Mortenson blows up are boulders that fall onto remote roads and block access to his schools.

 

Mr. Mortenson has become a legend in the region, his picture sometimes dangling like a talisman from rearview mirrors, and his work has struck a chord in America as well. His superb book about his schools, “Three Cups of Tea,” came out in 2006 and initially wasn’t reviewed by most major newspapers. Yet propelled by word of mouth, the book became a publishing sensation: it has spent the last 74 weeks on the paperback best-seller list, regularly in the No. 1 spot.

 

Now Mr. Mortenson is fending off several dozen film offers. “My concern is that a movie might endanger the well-being of our students,” he explains.

 

Mr. Mortenson found his calling in 1993 after he failed in an attempt to climb K2, a Himalayan peak, and stumbled weakly into a poor Muslim village. The peasants nursed him back to health, and he promised to repay them by building the village a school.

 

Scrounging the money was a nightmare — his 580 fund-raising letters to prominent people generated one check, from Tom Brokaw — and Mr. Mortenson ended up selling his beloved climbing equipment and car. But when the school was built, he kept going. Now his aid group, the Central Asia Institute, has 74 schools in operation. His focus is educating girls.

 

To get a school, villagers must provide the land and the labor to assure a local “buy-in,” and so far the Taliban have not bothered his schools. One anti-American mob rampaged through Baharak, Afghanistan, attacking aid groups — but stopped at the school that local people had just built with Mr. Mortenson. “This is our school,” the mob leaders decided, and they left it intact.

 

Mr. Mortenson has had setbacks, including being kidnapped for eight days in Pakistan’s wild Waziristan region. It would be naïve to think that a few dozen schools will turn the tide in Afghanistan or Pakistan.

 

Still, he notes that the Taliban recruits the poor and illiterate, and he also argues that when women are educated they are more likely to restrain their sons. Five of his teachers are former Taliban, and he says it was their mothers who persuaded them to leave the Taliban; that is one reason he is passionate about educating girls.

 

So I have this fantasy: Suppose that the United States focused less on blowing things up in Pakistan’s tribal areas and more on working through local aid groups to build schools, simultaneously cutting tariffs on Pakistani and Afghan manufactured exports. There would be no immediate payback, but a better-educated and more economically vibrant Pakistan would probably be more resistant to extremism.

 

“Schools are a much more effective bang for the buck than missiles or chasing some Taliban around the country,” says Mr. Mortenson, who is an Army veteran.

 

Each Tomahawk missile that the United States fires in Afghanistan costs at least $500,000. That’s enough for local aid groups to build more than 20 schools, and in the long run those schools probably do more to destroy the Taliban.

 

The Pentagon, which has a much better appreciation for the limits of military power than the Bush administration as a whole, placed large orders for “Three Cups of Tea” and invited Mr. Mortenson to speak.

 

“I am convinced that the long-term solution to terrorism in general, and Afghanistan specifically, is education,” Lt. Col. Christopher Kolenda, who works on the Afghan front lines, said in an e-mail in which he raved about Mr. Mortenson’s work. “The conflict here will not be won with bombs but with books. ... The thirst for education here is palpable.”

 

Military force is essential in Afghanistan to combat the Taliban. But over time, in Pakistan and Afghanistan alike, the best tonic against militant fundamentalism will be education and economic opportunity.

 

So a lone Montanan staying at the cheapest guest houses has done more to advance U.S. interests in the region than the entire military and foreign policy apparatus of the Bush administration.

[minx]

the book was a decent read.

[AlpineK]

Nice stuff Mike.

 

Yeah, I like that Ratpatrol2 one as well.

[Serenity]

Knowing your love for skiing, I know you'd get a good buzz from Dh mountain biking.

[akhalteke]

Hearts and Minds.

[Serenity]

It's basically a green side SOF wet dream, but conventional side came in, along with NATO (useless), and dicked it all up. As usual...

[akhalteke]

Par for the course I am afraid.

[olyclimber]

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/09/03/terror/main4409288.shtml

[prole]

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/09/03/terror/main4409288.shtml

 

It's Osama. Bush ordered the hit, it's the only thing that can save the Republicans.

[akhalteke]

Save? This is icing on the cake my dear boy.

[olyclimber]

uhhh no.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/09/10/pakistan.troops/index.html

[sobo]

the (Greg Mortenson) book (Three Cups of Tea) was a decent read.

I'd give it a few stars more than that. I'd say a very good read. Was tough to put down.

[akhalteke]

uhhh no.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/09/10/pakistan.troops/index.html

 

Officially, yes. In actuality, no.

[olyclimber]

has this be communicated to the lowest echelons?

[prole]

You mean FW?

[tvashtarkatena]

Are we drifting into the subcellular biology thread?

[danhelmstadter]

I just read that book Three Cups Of Tea -- this is probally gonna make a hard time harder for that dude Greg Mortenson to keep on building schools for little girls over there.

 

edit -- opps just saw one of the above posts already referenced the book / gotta start reading the second page before i post

Edited September 11, 2008 by danhelmstadter

[sobo]

you're forgiven

[akhalteke]

has this be communicated to the lowest echelons?

 

Common sense; if you have been reading up on Pakistan over the last couple years or so.

[tvashtarkatena]

I just read the first 10 pages of "Three Cups of Tea", then quietly placed it in the Goodwill bin.

[olyclimber]

I have been.

 

given that success in Afghanistan is clearly tied to Pakistan, I don't see how they can stop crossing the border for targets.

 

I don't think it is "unofficial" access that is granted. It would be more like they don't want to risk engaging the US militarily, so they would just complain loudly to the rest of the world.

 

 

[akhalteke]

...or they need the military support, but fear the ramifications of pissing off the religious in the country by fraternizinf with the Great White Satan and feign indignation while doing nothing.

[billcoe]

I have been.

 

given that success in Afghanistan is clearly tied to Pakistan, I don't see how they can stop crossing the border for targets.

 

I don't think it is "unofficial" access that is granted. It would be more like they don't want to risk engaging the US militarily, so they would just complain loudly to the rest of the world.

 

Nope, plot thickens. Link

 

"Pakistan orders troops to open fire if US raids

By STEPHEN GRAHAM – 12 hours ago

 

ISLAMABAD, Pakistan (AP) — Pakistan's military has ordered its forces to open fire if U.S. troops launch another air or ground raid across the Afghan border, an army spokesman said Tuesday.

 

The orders, which come in response to a highly unusual Sept. 3 ground attack by U.S. commandos, are certain to heighten tensions between Washington and a key ally against terrorism. Although the ground attack was rare, there have been repeated reports of U.S. drone aircraft striking militant targets, most recently on Sept. 12.

 

Pakistani officials warn that stepped-up cross-border raids will accomplish little while fueling violent religious extremism in nuclear-armed Pakistan. Some complain that the country is a scapegoat for the failure to stabilize Afghanistan.

 

Pakistan's civilian leaders, who have taken a hard line against Islamic militants since forcing Pervez Musharraf to resign as president last month, have insisted that Pakistan must resolve the dispute with Washington through diplomatic channels.

 

However, army spokesman Maj. Gen. Athar Abbas told The Associated Press that after U.S. helicopters ferried troops into a militant stronghold in the South Waziristan tribal region, the military told field commanders to prevent any similar raids.

 

"The orders are clear," Abbas said in an interview. "In case it happens again in this form, that there is a very significant detection, which is very definite, no ambiguity, across the border, on ground or in the air: open fire."

 

U.S. military commanders accuse Islamabad of doing too little to prevent the Taliban and other militant groups from recruiting, training and resupplying in Pakistan's wild tribal belt.

 

Pakistan acknowledges the presence of al-Qaida fugitives and its difficulties in preventing militants from seeping through the mountainous border into Afghanistan.

 

However, it insists it is doing what it can and paying a heavy price, pointing to its deployment of more then 100,000 troops in its increasingly restive northwest and a wave of suicide bombings across the country.

 

After talks Tuesday with British officials in London, Pakistani President Asif Ali Zardari said he did not "think there will be any more" cross-border raids by the U.S. He declined to comment on the order to use lethal force against American troops.

 

Instead, he and British Prime Minister Gordon Brown issued a joint statement saying Afghanistan and Pakistan should lead the efforts to battle border militancy. The joint statement left out any mention of the United States.

 

American officials have confirmed their forces carried out the Sept. 3 raid near the town of Angoor Ada but given few details of what happened.

 

Abbas said that Pakistan's military had asked for an explanation but received only a "half-page" of "very vague" information that failed to identify the intended target.

 

Pakistani officials have said the raid killed about 15 people, and Abbas said they all appeared to be civilians.

 

"These were truck drivers, local traders and their families," he said.

 

How to reverse a surge in Taliban violence in Afghanistan has become a major issue in the U.S. presidential campaign and refocused attention on the porous border with Pakistan.

 

Pakistan's military has won American praise for a six-week offensive against militants in the Bajur tribal region that officials here say has killed 700 suspected insurgents and about 40 troops. Troops backed by warplanes killed eight more alleged militants Tuesday, officials said.

 

In the same timeframe, there has been a surge in missile strikes apparently carried out by unmanned U.S. drones. Such attacks killed at least two senior al-Qaida commanders earlier this year.

 

Abbas did not say when exactly the orders for Pakistani troops to open fire to prevent cross-border raids by U.S. troops were issued. He wouldn't discuss whether Gen. Ashfaq Parvez Kayani, who replaced Musharraf as army chief last year, personally took the decision or if the orders had been discussed with American officials.

 

The spokesman also played down suggestions that the instructions had been put into practice before dawn on Monday, when U.S. helicopters reportedly landed near Angoor Ada only to fly away after troops fired warning shots.

 

Abbas insisted no foreign troops had crossed the border and that "trigger-happy tribesmen" had fired the shots. Pakistani troops based nearby fired flares to see what was going on, he said.

 

The U.S. military in Afghanistan said none of its troops were involved.

 

In a rare public statement last week, Kayani said Pakistan's sovereignty would be defended "at all cost." Abbas said Pakistani officials had to consider public opinion, which is skeptical of American goals in the region and harbors sympathy for rebels fighting in the name of Islam.

 

"Please look at the public reaction to this kind of adventure or incursion," Abbas said. "The army is also an extension of the public and you can only satisfy the public when you match your words with your actions.""

 

[Jens]

Does that mean I don't get to go next summer?