JayB Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 No, and protectionism by another name. Partial yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 I am not so sure Milton "invented" the negative income tax. Any way here is an interesting article by a well respected economist that pretty much sums up why Ven ( and Iraq by the way) is screwed. There is a more updated version available here but it costs $5.00. Looks like a good article. Thanks for sharing. Who should get credit for the neg-income tax idea? I must have mistaken popularization for invention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 No, and protectionism by another name. Partial yes. I wouldn't want to assume anything, but it seems as though you favor some state intervention in the economy, yes, with the degree of that intervention being the only thing in question? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 Yes, there is a difference between liberal economics and anarchism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 Yes, there is a difference between liberal economics and anarchism Liberal economics' (assuming you mean socialism) goal is to trasfer wealth more equalably (and hasn't worked well) while capitalism's (as practiced in the US)goal is to concentrate wealth, and the power to maintain it, in the hands of the pluracracy, and meets that goal very efficiently. The government that governs best is the one that governs least, except where is comes to subsidies, tax incentives, and great tax giveaways. There's a long list of current examples. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 Liberal economics' (assuming you mean socialism) goal is to trasfer wealth more equalably (and hasn't worked well) while capitalism's (as practiced in the US)goal is to concentrate wealth, and the power to maintain it, in the hands of the pluracracy, and meets that goal very efficiently. The government that governs best is the one that governs least, except where is comes to subsidies, tax incentives, and great tax giveaways. There's a long list of current examples. I am reminded about your comments relative to Randy Leavitt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joblo7 Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 Time for Chavez to get slapped. ????????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 Hey - Jimbo's back. Not the kind of liberalism I was referring to, but that was a nice summary of your worldview, complete with custom neologisms. Thanks for the testimonial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 Peter_PugetI am reminded about your comments relative to Randy Leavitt. Touche! But seriously. While capitalism is likely the model that is the lesser of evils, it's not benign. And given the results of how it's practiced in the US, arguably the pinnacle of the model, it's not difficult to see how the rich and powerful protect their interests. I don't think Socailism is a viable option as it removes incentives and as practiced in the past there's a weathly elite at the top. More compassionate capitalism is in order. Possible? I don't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 Whoah. Pardon me while I snap a photo of the pig flying past my window..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 what does this say about your allegience to democratic values and the voice of the majority? A leader - elected or not - who incrementally supplants democracy with his own cult of personality and shreds a nations guiding documents is no longer legitimate. I'm not sure he's there yet, but I remain convinced it's where he'll be soon enough. And of course you already know that democracy and "the voice of the majority" are not necessarily the same. Do you really support mob rules? sounds like bushie ala patriot act... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Whoah. Pardon me while I snap a photo of the pig flying past my window..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZimZam Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Mr Chavez said he would ask Venezuela's parliament to grant him additional powers to legislate by presidential decree. Mugabe in sheep's clothing. Like Bush, who was incapable of learning a lesson from Indochine. Chavez will fail to learn from the Soviets. In both instances history is doomed to repeat itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted January 10, 2007 Author Share Posted January 10, 2007 Looks like things are moving downhill in a hurry: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/6245995.stm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 hey fairweather, if you were one of the impoverished in venezuela, do you think there might be a chance you would feel differently about hugo and the role of government? Hey, SC, I know someone who was born and raised in Venezuela, and still has family living there. His feeling is that Chavez is NOT helping the impoverished in a meaningful, positive way, and he is quite concerned for his family as the government becomes Marxist and totalitarian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 hey fairweather, if you were one of the impoverished in venezuela, do you think there might be a chance you would feel differently about hugo and the role of government? Hey, SC, I know someone who was born and raised in Venezuela, and still has family living there. His feeling is that Chavez is NOT helping the impoverished in a meaningful, positive way, and he is quite concerned for his family as the government becomes Marxist and totalitarian. Oh wow kaskadhsdhhfks, you are fairweather now? thanks for that terrifically meaningful and insightful input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underworld Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 so you would rather have speculation than second hand story. makes sense - you can argue w/ speculation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 hey fairweather, if you were one of the impoverished in venezuela, do you think there might be a chance you would feel differently about hugo and the role of government? Hey, SC, I know someone who was born and raised in Venezuela, and still has family living there. His feeling is that Chavez is NOT helping the impoverished in a meaningful, positive way, and he is quite concerned for his family as the government becomes Marxist and totalitarian. Oh wow kaskadhsdhhfks, you are fairweather now? thanks for that terrifically meaningful and insightful input. More meaningful than a sanctimonious f***, analyzing his belly-button lint in the comfort of his yacht while he hypothesizes the hypotheticals of other people's lives across the world, myopically ignoring the historical and modern-day realities of oppressive regimes and opting instead to swallow the kool-aid of the propagandistic rhetoric of said regimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 More meaningful than a sanctimonious f***, analyzing his belly-button lint in the comfort of his yacht while he hypothesizes the hypotheticals of other people's lives across the world, myopically ignoring the historical and modern-day realities of oppressive regimes and opting instead to swallow the kool-aid of the propagandistic rhetoric of said regimes. You know, if you ever need a job, I'm sure there's a speechwriters position waiting for you in the Chavez regime. You kind of sound like him... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 More meaningful than a sanctimonious f***, analyzing his belly-button lint in the comfort of his yacht while he hypothesizes the hypotheticals of other people's lives across the world, myopically ignoring the historical and modern-day realities of oppressive regimes and opting instead to swallow the kool-aid of the propagandistic rhetoric of said regimes. You know, if you ever need a job, I'm sure there's a speechwriters position waiting for you in the Chavez regime. You kind of sound like him... Ёб твою мать Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 At least Chavez didn't pull the bait and switch like GW did. Remember how he was the guy who could reach accross the aisle and who was not into nation building? All of that fell aside prety quickly after he was elected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 At least Chavez didn't pull the bait and switch like GW did. Remember how he was the guy who could reach accross the aisle and who was not into nation building? All of that fell aside prety quickly after he was elected. Fuck Yeah!! More from the Hate America First crowd! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 so you would rather have speculation than second hand story. makes sense - you can argue w/ speculation priceless. yeah i'll really base my opinions on some second-hand story relayed by the most reactive and reactionary humanoid around these parts, yeah that makes great goddamn sense it does, ah gee some dude who lived there says chavez is bad so gee i guess that settles it! fucking priceless! the fact is the fucker got over 60% of the goddamn vote ok without misleading the public in any way i can tell. he said he'd nationalize, he said he was a leftist socialist-marxist-etc etc., he said he'd lead a "revolution"; what the fuck don't you understand about that? what the fuck are all you right-wingers whining about? HE'S DOING EXACTLY WHAT HE SAID HE WOULD!!!! fuck'n a man, it's their fucking country not yours you fucking shit for brainers get a fucking clue. they voted him in and now he's doing what he said he would. get over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underworld Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 geezz.. have a ruff commute home? well you were asking an opinion/speculation of someone that, i am assuming, hasn't been there and might not know anyone there. just wondering why you were asking for the speculation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 geezz.. well you were asking an opinion/speculation of someone that, i am assuming, hasn't been there and might not know anyone there. i was asking a SPECIFIC person to IMAGINE having grown up in a different set of circumstances, and asked them if they could in any possible way see themselves having a different set of beliefs if they had been exposed to a different set of circumstances; is this question really that hard to understand? I wasn't asking for any friggin' opinions about conditions or chavez's allegiance to the devil or somesuch nonsense; it was a question meant as an attempt to reveal the potentially nebulous nature of political beliefs- how those beliefs CAN be the result of simple circumstance. do you not see this, or perhaps not agree? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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