Dark Ages

[pope]

Dwayner confirmed to me that the movers, the shakers.....the keyboard wankers of cc.com have banned him from participating here. LAME. Now, we don't know whether Dwayner will be temporarily banned (a "time out" was what MattP suggested) or something more drastic. What we do know is that with this development, the chatter on this site is accelerating in an even duller direction.

 

Gone are the days of Dwayner's rants about excessive bolting, his thoughtful essays promoting bold, low-impact climbing. No longer will Dwayner be able to "prevent others from participating in the bolting debate". In fact, it seems likely that there won't be a real debate. Instead, you guys can go back to making comments that insult religious groups, to threatening violence and trading vulgar insults, to posting little whistle-pig icons on page tops. In short, you can put an amazing amount of effort into being really dull. Then, you can try to convince one another that loading a bat cave with 400 bolts had nothing to do with getting your wilderness-trashing butts kicked out.

[Sphinx]

WAAAAAHHHHHHH! Pope feels left out! WAAAAAHHHH!

[jon]

Listen......

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Do you hear it?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's a violin....playing a song for you and your friend. It's a sad tune, but I'm sure you'll get over it before you get over yourselves.

[Sphinx]

I couldn't find a wambulance.

[erik]

i saw dywaner lurking today.

 

[AlpineK]

erik said:

i saw dywaner lurking today.

 

 

I've seen Dwayner in the who's online section a bunch recently

[iain]

so when you are banned you can still log in, just not post?

[RobBob]

Obviously, Iain, you need to get a little more rad, and find out how this works yourself!

[rbw1966]

See attachment

[sk]

poor D_man pass along a hug from Muffin, would ya Pope??? Thanks, your a Doll

 

Banning is so sad

[erik]

um he is not banned?

 

u people dense!

 

[Cpt.Caveman]

u people dense!

 

Some might call that an attack. See word of the month.

[pope]

iain said:

so when you are banned you can still log in, just not post?

 

Dwayner can't post or send private messages. And trust me, there's a rather large number of little ladies out there who is just waiting to hear back from Dwayner.

 

Let this be a lesson to you. No contrarian opinions will be tolerated! If you're not sure about what you want to say, just run it by one of the moderators first via PM. Within 24 hours, they'll let you know whether they approved it for the "open forum". Of course, it might be edited a little.

 

That is the safe way, or you can take your chances and just post your opinion "from the hip". Of course, if you don't have any opinions, your venerable and highly esteemed moderatorial staff will GLADLY help you formulate one that is in line with acceptable thinking.

[jon]

Pope and Dwayner. Educated Idiots.

 

Seriously get real. If everything all you guys said was true, would there be threads littering this message board from the past three weeks, the last three years, saying how much I suck or we suck or how the mods suck or how cc.com suck. We obviously have the power to remove those. We have the power to remove the people posting those things. Are the people who say the above still posting here? Yes they are, some even posted in this thread. So if I think this place rocks I disagree with them, I should ban them, yes? So as I argued with Dru, yes some people were banned because we didn't agree with them, but the issue wasn't bolts or whatever it was what we disagree about what is appropriate around here and what isn't.

[Cpt.Caveman]

I just believe that if you advocate bolts in heaven you will be a moderator.

 

I am sorry to insult.

[jon]

None taken.

 

Maybe I should add that to the application for becoming a moderator.

[pope]

jon said:

Pope and Dwayner. Educated Idiots.

 

Seriously get real. If everything all you guys said was true, would there be threads littering this message board from the past three weeks, the last three years, saying how much I suck or we suck or how the mods suck or how cc.com suck. We obviously have the power to remove those. We have the power to remove the people posting those things. Are the people who say the above still posting here? Yes they are, some even posted in this thread. So if I think this place rocks I disagree with them, I should ban them, yes? So as I argued with Dru, yes some people were banned because we didn't agree with them, but the issue wasn't bolts or whatever it was what we disagree about what is appropriate around here and what isn't.

 

You're absolutely right. There is some stuff that defines the word GARBAGE that survives your editing. And then Dwayner gets banned? For........"preventing people from expressing their opinions by intellectually intimidating and manipulating them" (I think that's the way MattP explained it)? Dwayner gets banned for being too clever? I know his opinions are less than popular with those of you who make the decisions at this site, but I think you guys should reconsider the responsibility that comes with your leadership. It is a private forum and you can suppress any opinions that you want. The question is, if you're trying to encourage healthy and meaningful discourse, why can't you tolerate a well-stated minority opinion (considering all of the crap that you DO tolerate)?

 

[chucK]

Sorry guys, I have tried to stay out of this, but banning Dwayner is lame.

 

I guess banning Dwayner is analogous to throwing some drunk out of your party who just won't shut up. It's obviously the host's right, and it makes all the people inside feel more comfortable, but there's still something unseemly about it.

 

[AlpineK]

The question is, if you're trying to encourage healthy and meaningful discourse, why can't you tolerate a well-stated minority opinion (considering all of the crap that you DO tolerate)?

 

Crap topics with idiotic posts are just that. nobody but you and D cares

 

Serious topics that have no bearing on climbing don't deserve much if any moderating by a climbers board.

 

However Bolting is a serious issue that effects climbers. Dwayner does not have a well thought out oppinion, or if he did he stated it three years ago and since then he just repeats himself. All Dwayner has is a lot of verbiage.

 

As I said earlier Eric, I would think that a guy with an advanced degree in Math could recognize and produce logical arguments.

[mattp]

Pope has no interest in logic or even in presenting his case. Here, as in the bolting threads, he seeks only to grandstand and cause trouble. Pope knows full well that Dwayner was not banned for his position on the issue but that he was banned for refusing to stop spraying his obnoxious banter -- and that he refused to give it a rest for even one day. Pope proclaims that we are entering the Dark Ages because he fears that he may not be allowed to carry on like a clown-bully in the bolting threads. Rather than the Dark Ages, I'd say we may enter the Renaissance if all of the sudden we might be able to look at things in perspective instead of resorting to demagoguery. Who knows, if he elects to participate in some actual discussion of the issue instead of simply recycling the same two or three clever insults for three years, Pope might even find that he can express himself in an artful manner.

[pope]

mattp said:

Pope knows full well that Dwayner was not banned for his position on the issue but that he was banned for refusing to stop spraying his obnoxious banter --

 

Clarification! Please! Was Dwayner banned for "spraying his obnoxious banter " or was it merely for "spraying obnoxious banter "? I would suggest it is the former, and I would also suggest that Dwayner's obnoxious banter is many degrees less obnoxious than that to which we are routinely exposed every time we read even the most tame contributions of Sphinx and his equals.

 

I would also suggest that you, MattyP, have only only a juvenile understanding of the word "logic". Afterall, what's so logical about applying a double standard to "obnoxious" contributors?

[Sphinx]

pope said:

mattp said:

Pope knows full well that Dwayner was not banned for his position on the issue but that he was banned for refusing to stop spraying his obnoxious banter --

 

Clarification! Please! Was Dwayner banned for "spraying his obnoxious banter " or was it merely for "spraying obnoxious banter "? I would suggest it is the former, and I would also suggest that Dwayner's obnoxious banter is many degrees less obnoxious than that to which we are routinely exposed every time we read even the most tame contributions of Sphinx and his equals.

 

I would also suggest that you, MattyP, have only only a juvenile understanding of the word "logic". Afterall, what's so logical about applying a double standard to "obnoxious" contributors?

Awww, thanx Pope. You're so sweet.

 

But I don't understand how an attorney would have a 'juvenile understanding' of logic. Clarification, please?

 

Oh, and when did I become the poster child of cc.com spray? I thought Dru and Trask were the ringleaders.

[mattp]

Pope-

 

You know full well the difference: Sphinx and his equals have not dominated and destroyed every single thread that ever had anything even tangentially to do with the bolting issue for three years. You also know that at least one of "Sphinx equals" has been shut down recently.

 

To be sure, there are a lot of double standards and contradictions about how this board is operated -- but that is not one of them.

 

And, by the way, I think you are right that it was the former. Dwayner was banned for spraying "his" obnoxious banter - not for spraying somebody else's. Also, by the way, I think you completely miss the boat in one small bit of your argument here: in carrying on like an idiot, Dwayner did not intellectually intimidate anybody. To do so, he would have had to discuss real issues in much more of an honest and clearly thought-out manner.

[Al_Pine]

Pope,

First let me say that I agree with you that there continue to be a large number of posters who have and still do post things more obnoxious and more disruptive than Dwayner ever did. However, I don't think this fact logically implies that Dwayner's banning was wrong.

 

And BTW, just to confirm a fact that might inform this discussion,

 

is or is not Dwayner currently banned?

 

 

[catbirdseat]

I think the important issue is not just whether the banter is obnoxious, but WHERE it is posted. The Spray forum has a very high tolerance level for obnoxiousness. That tolerance falls off somewhat in Climbers forum and then to its very lowest level in Route Reports. Although Trask, Sphinx, and Dru can be obnoxious at times, I have observed that they are (usually) more careful what they do outside of Spray forum.