dmuja

thread drift to 'nuther qwestion: Most of us learned (or practice) to self arrest on moderate angled snow. As Nathan pointed out above, arresting a fall on steep snow (the only place you really need the skill) is another story. My experience is that the way self arrest is generally taught or shown in vids is ridiculous and unrealistic. The few times I have had to self arrest I had a few inches or maybe a foot at most to stop the fall or I would have hit light speed in about 2 seconds and been completely out of control. I think showing someone sliding tens or hundreds of feet on a hard steep snow slop, and THEN digging in the pick to a stop is not how self arrest should be portrayed. When I have shown people this I tell them that you have about 1 foot to stop or your a gonner. Thoughts or disagreeances?

more like bukhakha

According to this bill, the pool of "suspect DNA" would be limited to people who have been *ARRESTED*. I was once arrested at a traffic stop because I resembled a guy who that robbed a nearby hotel, I was released, but now they would have my DNA in their data base forever. I would from that moment on be part of the "suspect DNA pool". Why should I be in that pool? That in itself is fucked up. If were gonna allow this, then EVERYONES DNA should be in the pool, not single out people who have been arrested (or even convicted of petty crime imo). Lets see how we like it if everyones DNA is in this pool.

These are the words of the guy pushing the bill: In other words, its so infallible that you would probably be convicted based on nothing else except DNA evidence (just imagine the efficiency!). But wait a second, cant your DNA be planted somewhere? Cant labs be broken into or could there ever be mishandling of the sample? Do you trust that the police and or prosecutor are perfectly ethical? OR, will someday someone knock on your door and arrest/convict you simply because some computer program singled you out as a "match"? I mean, its infallible right, the perfect system? We all know that only bad guys end up in jail right? So what do we got to worry about?

finger prints are not DNA. Think of all the shit that can be derived from your DNA..

STFU you boring ignorant fat little sissy boy punk ass beyotch. Isn't it bible reading time for you your fucking dork? Oh, I forgot, you can't read very well yet, maybe you can just look at the pictures you stupid puss head. Now THAT is some spray dude!

So if I ever get pulled over, and the fine upstanding officer decides he thinks he smells some type of illegal substance in the air, and then decides to arrest me based on a suspicious seed he finds on the floor of my vehicle, maybe I will be faced with a choice. Do I blow his fucking stupid ass away, or do I give up my DNA to some registry somewhere that will forever be accessible and cross checked for every possible crime known to man from now until my death? What the fuck have we come to? What the fuck happened to the ideal "innocent until proven guilty"? Welcome to 1984.. http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/301091_crimebills25.html

This is how I think of class 3,4,5 - sorry, I know this has probably been sprayed to death before. -- Class 3 = Scrambling (generally less than vertical but perhaps with short vertical steps) with frequent hand and foot holds and some exposure to an injurious fall. Fear is surmounted by alot of confidence in ones ability to grab the easy and numerous holds. No rope is used ala the phrase "lets third class this bitch". Class 4 = Simple climbing (maybe even vertical) with fatal exposure, but with large easy holds for hands and feet. Fear can be very present along with occasional thought of how easy it would be to slip off one of the "easy" holds. In Class 4 climbing, a rope and pro might be used by some (certainly not all) climbers, mostly however a rope would be used ONLY for the followers and not for belaying the leader. Generally this means no pro is used as well. Class 5 = Technical climbing (up to or beyond vertical) requiring strength and calculated body positioning or "technique" with absolute exposure to deadly falls and generally smallish or difficult holds. Fear is surmounted by mental focus on the task at hand (and foot). In Class 5 climbing, the norm is to belay all parties using a rope and multiple anchors (pro).

I recall some recent cold clear nights which prolly provided a nice opportunity for surface hoar to form. Could be that was the burried weak layers and it may have been hard to detect. You skibums should take note of when those *cold clear nights* happen and presume something is hidden if it snows afterword.

Somewhere in the midst of all this retro-70's ish over femo-analyzing crap I have suddenly become out of touch with my inner maleness. It shouldN'T be like this! Ladies and gentlemen, lets get it together p--l--e--a--s--e! I think the best thing for ALL OF US to do at this point is to purify our souls, ask forgiveness from Mother Gaia and surf some porn.

cool, I jus downloaded the sound track to "Dances with Wolves" onto my iPod! Cant wait to be toppin out some snowy peak to that music, Im gonna feel like a real fukin hero!

Procreating is natural Nature is largely about procreating As long as we continue to be bio-creatures our natural urges to procreate will also continue to manifest in however many and varied ways we choose to interpret them. It is pointless to attempt a suppression of sexual urges, they are integral to the very biology and psychology of us all. The real problem is not the inherent impulse toward "who/what we find attractive", the real problem is (simply put) pre-judging abilities and worth based on appearance alone, and then not questioning the prejudgment. Feminism of the 60's-70's didn't get this and took it too far calling the very impulse itself "wrong". Thats why there was a sound rejection of that kind of feminism in the 90's especially by young women. I much prefer todays feminists, strong, independent and owning their sexuality.

I guess even "easy" 60 degree slopes are no longer "real climbing"??? Silly chest beating imo Good TR and climb though, nice job!

I'll drink to dis, but.. Hoomam beans are an merely an aberrant and temporary parasitic presence on an otherwise perfectly good planet. Learn to see time on a geologic scale, then you will be more tolerant of your fellow parasites. Thinking of time on a much larger (longer) scale has greatly helped me to over come my occasional but reoccurring urge to steer the vehicle into the oncoming lane at high speed. BTW, I will soon be seeking a new climbing partner so get in line early.

Seattle has exactly 16 snowplows. St. Paul MN for example (a geographically flat area) has hundreds - and they aint shy about applying the salt chemical shit neither.

This was once the reasonable position held by most people of the religious persuasion. Unfortunately, thanks to the modern fund-a-mental cases and biblical literalists, today, you either believe the planet is less than 10,000 years old, or youve been brainwashed by commie atheist "evolutionists". seahawks, "something" from "nothing" is well accepted in Quantum Physics so your statement about science rejecting the possibility of the universe coming from nothing etc.. is wrong. In fact, theres a very good chance that it did spontaneously "begin" out of nothing. Also, contemplating "what was before the big bang" is erroneous thinking in as much as the term "before" cannot apply to a state in which time does/did not exist. Concepts like "before" and "after" are only meaningful in the post-bigbang state.

I wasn't stopping at Christians alone Eric, I included other types of "thinking" there as well. Obviously though, not all of them believe what the dork says. Sadly though, most people believe he has a valid message that is worthy of being in the "news" because he "represents" a valid perspective. You must have read recently didn't you that like 25% of the American public believe "Jesus will return to Earth" this year '07. So my beliefs and prejudices are likely not that far off, if at all. So do YOU think Jesus will come back to Earth this year? Just curious.. And if so, then why bother caring for environment etc (or solving any number of other problems we face), in the face of Armageddon? If big daddy controls our fate, then why bother doing anything? Now you can see why I hold on to my so called "beliefs and prejudices". This kind of thinking -or lack there of- will be the end of humanity. People (human beings) will likely die out because they are basically just smart enough to kill themselves, and too stupid to save themselves. Ok, I admit to some amount of cynicism here. But its 2007 and we still have greed and mass over consumption by the few with the means, mass poverty and malnutrition, classism and vast inequity of wealth and freedoms across the world, imperialism and tyranny, mass brainwashing/indoctrination and strangely, an obsession with both security & self victimization, along with a love of and fascination with death and violence as a means to an end. Add to that an almost complete lack of concern for our environment and I think a little cynicism is warranted. I always have hope though, I think we could begin to save ourselves by rejecting religion (most importantly, rejecting religion as an institution) and embracing critical thinking and science as a basis for human culture (at least ones personal culture for starters). We could teach the logical and rational basis for ethics, compassion, equality, etc. We could "indoctrinate" our kids to value knowledge intelligence and logic and to be sceptical of beliefs. We could teach them the importance of creativity, openmindedness, and how to adapt and consider the whole as opposed to "their own". We could teach them how small causes and personal decisions may result in very big and lasting effects. We could teach them to be self sufficient AND responsible to others and that this is the best hope for all of our survival. Just throwing out a few ideas. As long as evangelicals or whoever have most of these as their foundational values I personally have no urgent problem with them.

Probly the some of the same people who call for a "ban on winter climbing". Maybe some of the same people who call for congressional investigation into why James Kim was "allowed" to drive down a mountain logging road in a snowstorm and nearly kill his family. Maybe the same people who voted for Bush and Cheney. And maybe the same people who think global warming is a myth or will actually be a good thing. In other words, unfortunately, anywhere from 1/4 to over 1/2 of the American people probably care -or worse yet *believe*- what this demented cult leader has to say. If not him, then some other demented cult leader. Wonder if "God" brought up that little bit about Patty callin for the assassination of the president of Venezuela? Seems like maybe "God" would choose a more worthy vehicle for his messages to be conveyed. Of coarse, it could be that "God" really IS an old white man with a long beard who only speaks english to a few chosen, rich, rightwing, cult leaders, enjoys destroying shit and generally bringing extreme suffering upon the masses. Also, I wonder what's being neglected around the rest of the universe while "God" is so busy talking to Pat or causing earthquakes, terrorist attacks and other havoc on this one single, pissy, little insignificant shit of a planet. Coarse, he ("God") prolly gots like Superman or Spidey man powers or somethin. Scotty, dude, beam me out'a here..

if you simu-climb on hard shit though, you aught not have anyone considered "weaker"

Best climber "goes second" because he is driving the bus - ie, if he goes, the entire bus crashes (unless youve managed to use the ti-bloc auto brake set up). It is generally considered that a leader falling while Simuclimbin MIGHT not pull the second off with him - therefore, weaker climber goes in front

Good things 'bout simul-climbing, it encourages you to choose your partners carefully, improves your concentration, and also your ability to trust others..

A little late I know, Regardless of his history of barbarism, Saddam died displaying a great deal of balls, laughing even - with a noose around his neck. To many people around and across the world (most importantly inside Iraq), it had the appearance of a revenge killing and not of "justice". Personally, I think his "execution" displayed quite effectively the barbarism that lies just beneath the surface of all human "civilization"- yippee.. The way this all happened (and arguably THAT it happened) will only bring more division, more passionate ignorance, and more violence in both the short AND long term. If you profess to have a better way then "an eye for an eye" (ie democracy, justice etc..) then you better be prepared to demonstrate that better way with your actions. For what ever reason, we're all still waiting for that "better way" to be demonstrated - it certainly was NOT in this case.

WTF? One of the most entertaining of the recent posters I thought.

Your "fall"? Was it down the hogs back and require chopper assistance? Its a long slog, you may want to already be in better than "couch potato" shape. Odds are for very good conditions at that time of year though.