Mtguide

Guess that means we'll have to obey the law,eh?Oh well,plenty of time for ripping the town a new asshole later on.BTW there just might be some ice up on I-Rock by then,too. --------------------------------------------- "Once I made up my mind,I didn't need it any more..."

Huh???What happened to party at Lane's-or maybe you never got him talked into it.Well,I'll be happy to host the party-but you know my place is a lot smaller,is all.Actually now is a good time,too,cause the apartment below me is vacant;noise no problem-well,within reason.(no reasonable reason refused,unreasonable reasons negotiable)

Bob McGown,Pres. of OR chapter of AAC,and one of the main forces of the Madrone Wall taskforce,would pretty much have the goods on the status of this issue.Contact him at Oregon chapter AAC

The whole thing sucks--and it's true,war has always been this way.My father, who fought on Attu in the Aleutians in WWII,told me once,"the generals use soldiers like a carpenter uses nails;if you're up on a roof nailing sheeting and you drop a few nails,you're not going to climb down to get them;likewise with soldiers in war."Evidence of how much the "leaders" care about our military personnel is Bush's move to CUT the hazard pay of servicepeople on duty in Afghanistan and Irag,and Bush-backed legislation to cut funding for veteran's medical services,to name just a few.Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz's model for the "efficient",leaned-down,minimal army is just a corporate model for making fewer people do more work,which is essentially working our military to death in current combat zones.Anyone who thinks that the politicians,corporate fat cats,and so-called leaders give so much as a popcorn bloody fart for the lives,safety,or the families of the men and women in the military is hopelessly naive,clueless,or just plain fucking stupid.Wars are,and have always been,fomented by the ruling class,and the young and naive are roused to patriotic fervor by propaganda demonizing and dehumanizing the other side.You are increasingly seeing on major media channels very bald and pointed statements from a wide range of commentators across the political spectrum,to the effect that the Iraq war was indeed about the oil,something the ordinary guy in the street(that's me and you) knew months before the ordnance began to fly.Hundreds of millions around the planet protested the war along with those in the United States,something totally unprecedented in history.When the pre-war polls showed that 60 to 70% of the US supported the war,what you need to read that as,is that at least 30-40% opposed it; so at least that percentage(and think about it-that's about 90 to 120 million people)were thinking,were not duped by the PR bullshit and the spineless corporated media shills.Yes,it is sad,and it is absolutely needless,but it will continue as long as,to quote Edmund Burke,"good men do nothing."

We're going global with this shit! Trask will be here soon enough-limeys beware.

No,no,no,no----jeez,there,Dave,no need to constantly adjust poles,HAHA; just switch hands as you go,put the short pole on the uphill side,long pole on the downhill,very low tech,very fast,minimal demand of cognitive function--and of course don't drop the poles on steep slopes-but in freshies they won't go far.Spring skiing on firm snow,you might have to go back down and pick up a dropped pole.But we all know the basic caveat of gravity sports,eh? PS: Yet another vote for BD Flicklocks,both 2-and 3 section; well worth the nickel.

Absolutely;glad to have you--just email me thru this site to let me know and I'll send you location,directions,phone,etc. I have a fairly sizeable 2 BR apt.,probably floor space for 5-6 people plus a couch;Wayne's crashed here a few times-he can give you a description.Give a holler. Seriously, I make take you up on this.

I've had several experiences with rude,offensive Canadian border guards.Many of them are extremely conservative,and if you appear to be the least bit "counter-culture",there are some who will totally overreact.I wear a small turquoise post in my left ear,(And no,I do not have long hair)and the first time I went through the border wearing it(I'd forgotten to take it out)we were detained for several hours while our car and everything in it were searched for drugs--all packs and containers dumped out,everything opened-everything.As the search progressed and nothing was found,the agent became even more angry and abusive.Finally we were allowed to continue when an older,more civil agent took the rude(and much younger) one aside and after an brief and evidently very tense discussion the older man told us we were free to go.Almost 30 years ago,I was hitching up to BC and bought a bus ticket to go through the crossing.When the agents boarded the bus they were unbelievably hostile,and again,very young.As one agent walked up the aisle,he saw an old woman sitting there,innocently smiling,and shouted at her to wipe the smile off her face;she started crying,and when a couple of other passengers started to object they were absolutely screamed at to SHUT UP if they didn't want to be immediately arrested.Back in these days I did have long hair,and was traveling with a large backpack;I was detained,as was the entire bus,my pack was taken out of the baggage compartment,and in the station I was strip-searched,and my pack and all its contents completely searched; I was finally allowed to proceed into Canada because my ID was all in order,I was going to visit friends who were respectable Canadian citizens,and I had enough money to satisfy the guards that I would not become a derelict ward of the crown in the 3 weeks of my intended stay.All of this was done in the most icy,hostile manner possible.Since then,there have been other occasional instances,though nothing quite as unpleasant as those two. In their defense,border guards are govt.civil servants who don't make very much money,have a huge responsibilty,and are ridden very hard by the bureacrats above them.They do have to deal with all kinds of truly criminal kinds of characters,are pretty much stuck in their little spot at the border watching an endless stream of American affluence parade before their eyes,and it doesn't take long for them to get really sour.Of course,they knew what the job was when they took it.

Oops,sorry--meant to reply to Attitude's original query.And I was just referring to downhill ski lessons in general,not specifically AT--yeah,i don't know of anywhere you can find AT specific instruction.

Lessons to begin with for sure;why waste time re-inventing the wheel?A good way to go is to take a lesson,ski on yr own 3-4 times to digest it,get another lesson,and so on,throughout the season;maybe take a spring clinic toward the end of yr first season.If you've been getting out often and hard,you'll have the miles under your belt to be able to work hard and really get the benefit from it;you'll know what kinds of questions you need answers to.They'll work yr ass off till you get tired enough to really feel the difference btween forcing it and the effortless ride when "it" happens for you.Do not underestimate the value of resort skiing for developing your skills for the backcountry--you can concentrate on just the skiing,run after run;don't worry,you'll get the conditioning for skinning up hill soon enough.Learn and master a solid stem christie(originates from the snowplow) for backcountry survival skiing(ice,windpack,sastrugi,steeps,etc.)and from there to a jump turn. Read: "Ski the Whole Mountain"by Eric and Rob DesLauriers,"Breakthrough on Skis" , "Br.on Skis II,&"Br. on the New Skis"(shaped fatties) by Lito Tejada-Flores.All excellent.Softer boots to start with can force you to develop strength and technique to the point that when you finally get the "right" boots for you,you'll be pleasantly surprised by how good a skier you are;you'll have power and ease you never dreamed of,because the real foundation will be there in the muscle memory. You don't mention anything about your backcountry skills: be sure you have navigation,avalanche and general winter mountaineering skills well in hand.Don't depend on anyone else's knowledge -be responsible for your own safety and ongoing education;be able to give help when necessary.Work to become a really complete ski mountaineer/alpinist.Blue skies and far horizons to you.

An excellent book is "Traditional Lead Climbing:Surviving the Learning Years" by Heidi Pesterfield.Most thorough treatment I've seen of the whole subject,from anchors to partners & psychology.Climbers of all levels could benefit from reading this before leaving the ground.

Great shot,Wayne;finally got around to viewing yr post--that's definitely some grim-looking catwalk.OSHA approved,I'm sure--many congratulations on a fine classic.Talk about "blossoms at dawn in the face of the mountain god".

Creatine has,in years past,been associated with muscle/ligament tearing injuries,especially when using the original formula powders which required creatine loading for the first week or so,without adequate hydration.My personal experience has included muscle cramps and residual stiffness.Part of the reason for this could also be the effect of creatine(which basically increases energy production and energy storage in skeletal muscle) enabling harder training,before actual muscle and ligament development have caught up to demands of heavier training or harder climbing.In any training,it's necessary to alternate between heavy and light training,i.e.,heavy weight/low reps,and light weight/high reps,to allow ligament and tendon to catch up to muscle,which has a better blood supply and genrally grows faster.This is whether you use creatine or not,but especially necessary if you do use it. The new creatine formulas don't require loading,and don't seem to cause the muscle cramping as frequently.But it's always a good idea to drink enough water,while training--and new research indicates it's possible to overdo water,too. ------also,the whole chapter on nutrition in Twight's book Extreme Alpinism is excellent,especially the section on hydration.

Elegant solution--just bust a cap in the ass of the teachers,school board,all the kids and their parents,administration,etc.Vaporize all facilities--end of problem.Wow,cool. ----------------------------------------------- "I do not think,therefore I do not exist."

managed to nurse myself through a 5 mo.episode of tendinitis last winter.( I work as a carpenter,so it was hard to avoid using that arm;took a looong time to improve.)).Ice is essential after work in the evenings,1 lb.bag of frozen peas for 25 min.,remove,allow area to warm up on its own,repeat.I also used Glucosamine chondroitin,MSM,and Aleve(over-counter form of Naprosyn/naproxen sodium.)Pineapple juice ingredient is bromelain,and it's much more effective to take this as a supplement,you'd have to drink gallons to get the same amount contained in verified amounts in capsule form,and actually less expensive in the long run than buying cases of juice.Cross-tissue massage at site of inflammation can be very helpful for warmup prior to any use involving the affected area-BUT the very best thing you can do is to stay off of that area as much as possible until definite improvement takes hold,and that takes time.My orthopedist was accurate to estimate from 10 weeks to 5 or 6 mos. depending on your age,severity of inflammation,and how disciplined you are in helping your own recovery.Do nothing that causes pain; light,controlled usage such as ultra light resistance grip exercises 2 or 3 times a week can aid in recovery once the initial acute stage inflammation is over with;light=1 or 2 sets of 10-15 reps.And ice,ice,ice-----.Best of luck.And on this one,'no pain ,no gain'is the worst approach.Do NOT climb,lift weights,use the brake on your bike ,etc.,with that hand.No pain=Gain in this case.I can't stress strongly enough how important it is to avoid aggravating it;otherwise it can become chronic,leading to osteophytes(bone spurs)which can require pricey surgery to remove,and subsequent rehab of up to two years.I learned this the hard way ,in my late 30's.

In Portland an excellent orthopedist/shoulder man is Dr. Ira Weintraub,himself a climber.

I have plenty of floor space and a couch at my place for anyone from out of town,just bring a sleeping bag.

"Those who know do not speak; those who speak, do not know." -Lao Tzu,Tao Te Ching

Get a copy(if you can find it) of "Portland Rock Climbs:A Climber's Guide to Northwest Oregon",by Tim Olson.Also keep an eye peeled in the bookstores (Powell's,Great NW,Hawthorne Blvd,Cameron's,Looking Glass,Daedalus)for vintage copies of "Climber's Guide to Oregon" by Nick Dodge,and "Oregon Rock" by Jeff Thomas,"Oregon High",also by Jeff Thomas,and "Summit Guide to the Cascade Volcanoes" by Jeff Smoot.Forget going to Borders or Waldenbooks,etc.They don't deal in this kind of thing.The local climbing stores have book sections,some more complete than others.Beckey's three volume guide to the Cascades,Jim Nelson's Cascade Select,and Alan Kearney's Classic Climbs of the Northwest are excellent.The Mazamas ,the long time local climbing club,has an amazing library of climbing literature,well worth checking out.If you can't find some of the first titles I mentioned in the bookstores,the Mazamas has them.Best practice ice is on the lower Eliot,Newton-Clark,Coe or White River glaciers on Mt.Hood,Eliot and White R. most accessible.Upper Heather Canyon can be pretty good in winter depending on conditions,a bit of a ski to get into.Sometimes the ice will come in on Pete's Pile,less frequently in the Gorge,but when it's in,as it was in the early 90's ,it's fantastic.Global warming may have made that a thing of the past. Biking &hiking-Oregon and the NW room at Powell's is full of guide books on this.Look for a map titled "Mountain Biking:Greater Portland and NW Oregon". running-try Forest Park food,pubs-Willamette Week publishes reviews and guides to these on a regular basis,call them for current copies. Gyms-24 Hour Fitness(best equipped,family and serious gym rats),Giant's Gym(cheap,iron pit,hardcore)Bally's(upscale)Riverplace(the Rodeo Drive of Portland fitness). Rock gyms-Portland Rock Gym,Stoneworks,Clubsport Gear shops=ClimbMax,Mountain Shop,US Outdoor Store,Oregon Mountain Community,REI,The Next Adventure(new and used;watch out for the Soviet-era ropes and ice screws)Andy and Bax,Johann Mountaineering Shop. Any further questions,just look up my e-mail on the list and give a holler.Basically,if you can read,you can find it. Mtguide :grin ------------------------------------------------------ "All you have to do is open yr eyes and ears and you're influenced---" -Bob Dylan

PDX show is already in the works;Oregon chapter of the AAC will host, most likely at Old Market Pub & Brewery,6959 SW Multnomah Blvd. in SW PDX,sometime in Oct or Nov.,no date set yet. --------------------------------------------------------

Chamonix,a copy of Rebuffat's "100 Finest Climbs in The Alps",& letter of introduction to Catherine d'Estivelle, Swedish Bikini Team and/or Team Playboy Adventure Racers. ---------------------------------------------------------

Second to that;a man of integrity and rare quality. ------------------------------------------------ "A good boy,and one who keeps a buffalo in mind---" -Bob Dylan

Well I'm fascinated;guess I'm gonna have to go take a look,renew my acguaintance with that place.Looking at the topo again,I stand corrected:just from the 8000' contour to the summit is 364',and from 7800',where the grade definitely starts to ramp up,is another 200',so you have 564' total.Just because I don't remember the ice doesn't mean it's not there.Sounds like fun. ----------------------------------------------------- "If the ice comes in on the N. face of O-Rock and there's no one there to climb it,is it really there?"

Thanks for your comment; yeah,she's quite something--she's definitely been there and back,if you know what I mean.Wisdom earned the old fashioned way. ----------------------------------------------------- "It is a long road that leads to the peaks.----but---it bestows riches beyond price: the happiness which one sees in the eyes of those who make their way there." -Rebuffat,On Snow and Rock

Are we talking about the Ob. Rock next to Echo Rock on the NW flank of Rainier,Flett Glacier (snowfield actually)on one side,Russell Glacier on the other?Park at Mowich Lk.,take the Spray Park trail up past Hessong rock and Mt.Pleasant? 13.5 hrs car to car? Really?! If so, unless things have really changed up there due to catastrophic geological/glaciological cataclysm, I am stumped as to how it could take you 13.5 hrs.In August of 1967,Jim Langdon and I climbed Echo and Observation within the first 2 hours of what wound up being a little less than a 21-22 hr. day,in which we went on to do Hessong,Pleasant,Fay, the Mother Mts.,Castle,Gove and Tolmie.My recollection is of a beautiful day,easy approach up the trail,out onto the Flett and up to the saddle between Echo and Ob.,on easy,low angle snow,and easy class 4 climbs of about a rope length or so on each.We took no pickets or screws;maybe a couple slings and pitons,but never used them.Unless you're measuring pitches in terms of distance climbed between belay stances,I'm hard put to find 3 to 4 pitches of climbing on Observation.Current USGS 7.5 min. topo shows about 280' of el. on the steep E.side of Ob. Rock,and I certainly don't recall there being any ice on it.Not at that time time of year.We used to consider a rope length(150' back then) a "pitch".I can see if you're using short pitches,the distance between belays,then maybe there are 3 or 4 pitches.Three of 90',four of 70'.But where's the ice?Do you have photos?All I honestly remember is a volcanic plug of rubble,no ice face to speak of.Admittedly,my 30+ year memory may have some gaps;we did just the easy S-SW side.And I know that so much has been done everywhere in the last 30 yrs. that maybe you're talking about a route we wouldn't have even considered.Not with the gear,technology and techniques of the time.So I'm not intending to put anyone down here,or question your achievement,but I'm really curious to know what there is on little ol' Ob. Rock that could take 13 hrs.please let me know;maybe I'll have to take a run back up there and see what we missed. --------------------------------------------------------- "Everybody has a photographic memory,but some aren't using any film."