JayB Posted January 20, 2003 Posted January 20, 2003 Didn't climb anything, but was up there dinking around on the skis and checking things out today. Ice: There's a climbable flow on the south side of the valley leading up to source lake, about 3/4 of a mile in. Looked like about 50 feet of WI 3-4 with a tree at the top to finish at if you're not into thrutching through unconsolidated snow to finish off your ice leads. There were also a couple of thin, burly (scary/dangerous) looking flows "in" on the slopes due west of Source Lake, starting at about 300 feet (rough estimate) above the lake. There were a couple of folks starting up the northernmost flow (on the climbers right). Kind of hard to rate something from so far away, but I'd guestimate three or four pitches in the WI4-5 range with M grades at about the same level or just a bit lower. Just a guess. There was also another thin looking flow about 200' to the south (climbers left) that looked like it might go at about WI4 for 2-3 pitches. Keep in mind that these are just guesses, and everything on that aspect looked thin and gnarly. Snow: Thin crust/hoarfrost on top of about 8-12" of looser snow, which was itself on top of a firm layer about 12-18" deep. Should stay very stable until it gets hit by warmth and/or snow. Quote
Greg_W Posted January 20, 2003 Posted January 20, 2003 What kind of temps did you run into Jay? Quote
JayB Posted January 20, 2003 Author Posted January 20, 2003 Howdy Greg: I'd guess that the temps ran into the low 20's overnight and into the mid-to-high-30's during the day. It was very sunny up there until at least noon today so the south and east facing aspects probably got quite a bit of sun. Quote
dbb Posted January 20, 2003 Posted January 20, 2003 The guys who climbed that long route said it was about 2 pitches up to 4+. They said there were a few fixed pins, and that a couple bugaboos would be good for the belay. They also mentioned that the ice pro was pretty poor. Loren and I climbed some ice and one of the new mixed routes just above source lake. Find some photos here... Quote
cracked Posted January 20, 2003 Posted January 20, 2003 We top-roped some short, but for us steep and fun smears in the basin of tooth. It was insanely warm, but the ice wasn't melting, for some reason. Quote
Cpt.Caveman Posted January 20, 2003 Posted January 20, 2003 (edited) How does m7 rate at 5.11? Is that like it feels like 5.11 in crampons and other gear? I rate stuff speculating how it would feel in rock shoes in the summer. Therefore I have never done a more difficult route in my definition than 5.0 or hard 4th class. But I never had a bolt to clip either. Poeple are curious. Anyone answer. Edited January 20, 2003 by Cpt.Caveman Quote
cracked Posted January 21, 2003 Posted January 21, 2003 "Vail is an outhouse, keeping all the shit in one place..." Mark Twight. Well, I don't totally agree, but I do find those bolts near the Tooth ugly. Quote
COL._Von_Spanker Posted January 21, 2003 Posted January 21, 2003 I climbed some ice near source lake weekend before last. It was fun. Quote
TimL Posted January 21, 2003 Posted January 21, 2003 (edited) Bolting wars do nothing but hurt the climbing community and it would be sad to see one starting n Alpental Valley. Caveman - From Climbing Mag: M7: Feels like 5.11+ rock climbing M8: Feels like 5.12, mostly drytooling severely overhanging rock. ice is usually spotty or detached. M9: Unconsolidated grade - can involve entire or many pitches of M8. M10: 5.13 drytooling. I haven't done much sport drytooling but for one would like to check those routes out in the near future. They look fun! Edited January 21, 2003 by TimL Quote
fleblebleb Posted January 21, 2003 Posted January 21, 2003 Duh. Before saying stuff open and close your mouth three times while thinking things over. Debating bolting in a valley with a ski resort, a parking lot for several hundred cars that fills up most weekends, a ton of vacation houses or whatever they are, the biggest highway in the state, and piss and shit on the innumerable trails at no more than 50 yard intervals, is just plain silly. It's not like the bolts are for protecting routes that could do without them either. Quote
cracked Posted January 21, 2003 Posted January 21, 2003 Well, yes, but the climbs could easily be TRed, couldn't they? Admittedly, they do look fun. Sorry, I was not trying to start a bolt war, as nothing productive ever results. Note that I edited my post. Quote
robertm Posted January 21, 2003 Posted January 21, 2003 I don't think they can be TR'd since there is no safe way to get on top and around. I haven't climbed these bolted routes but have climbed the flows near them. Quote
Jens Posted January 21, 2003 Posted January 21, 2003 (edited) I haven't climbed the routes but I agree, a lot of the mixed stuff around here you really can't get to the top of safely to TR. As for impact, we've got Korean war surplus explosives, buried cable, sheet metal, and a whole lotta' other junk in that valley. Bolts are the least of our worries, espcially when they are painted to camoflauge in. In my humble opinion, we need more routes like these. Speaking of the valley and bolts, when is somebody gonna' open that beautiful whitish sport wall just above the freeway on the north side of I-90(near the west-bound on ramp when leaving Alpental)? I heard a rumor that Burdo had considered it a number of years ago. PS. That rock up in that valley is sure hard on picks. Any geologists out there.. what is that stuff on the Moh's hardness scale? Edited January 21, 2003 by Jens Quote
cracked Posted January 21, 2003 Posted January 21, 2003 I stand corrected. If there is no safe way to TR the routes, bolting is justified. Still, I would hate to see a proliferation of bolted climbs in the mountains. Then again, the Snoqualmie Alps probably don't qualify. I will try the drytool routes sometime and make a more informed judgement then. And Jens, where are surplus explosives in that valley? How did they get there? Quote
Cpt.Caveman Posted January 21, 2003 Posted January 21, 2003 Tim I noticed that too but it's not actually the answer to my question. Quote
wdietsch Posted January 21, 2003 Posted January 21, 2003 where are surplus explosives in that valley? How did they get there? hidden in the trees on the slopes ............ avalanche control .... they used to have a sign at the trailhead showing an unexploded shell ... Quote
Dru Posted January 21, 2003 Posted January 21, 2003 Im more curious about, are these "Cdn Rockies" M7 & M9, or "Colorado" M7 & M9 (supposedly at least a grade easier) Quote
Jens Posted January 22, 2003 Posted January 22, 2003 (edited) Congratulations to whoever is doing M9. That's world class climbing. Edited January 22, 2003 by Jens Quote
Dru Posted January 22, 2003 Posted January 22, 2003 I beg to differ. Everybody and their dog does M9 nowadays as a warm up in Canmore - well maybe not in the PNW. M12 is "world class", when it comes to bolted single pitch stuff, these days. Quote
daler Posted January 22, 2003 Posted January 22, 2003 Dru, I've climbed alot in the Can. Rockies and recently alot in the colorado rockies. the routes are not softer, if anything alot of them are harder. And as far as the routes go in the PNW they are as stiff as any of the routes in Canada. And i'm not sure if you are flashing M9 or not. but there are very few who are warming up on them. M9 is still damm hard!!! Go climb Gorilla Bar at Baker and let me know if you think it is soft M8. The kind fellow who put up the routes by the tooth climbs alot in the can. rockies and is very capable of knowing the grades. And yes he has sent M9 leashless in Canada. And to those worried about the bolts, alot of times by trying to access the tops of routes to top rope them you do alot more damage to the terrain. Look at all the trails atop the climbs at marble canyon. dale Quote
Dru Posted January 22, 2003 Posted January 22, 2003 i send m3 with leashes on. there are a lot of soft grades out there at that level. Quote
mattp Posted January 22, 2003 Posted January 22, 2003 (edited) Post deleted by mattp Edited January 22, 2003 by mattp Quote
fleblebleb Posted January 22, 2003 Posted January 22, 2003 Ah yes, this thread is clearly coming to a horrible fate, what with Chepe's two posts of gibberish and my one post of sarcasm, and the comparison of grading conventions in the Cascades and the Rockies. The signal to noise ratio here is what, still more than 10:1? Lighten up, this moderation stuff could get ridiculous. Cleaning up a thread that has pages of spray is entirely different than microscopically deleting a post here and a post there. Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.