9/11 faked?

[JayB]

I, [insert truther name here] can simultaneously believe that the US government can slaughter thousands of its own citizens, inflict scores of billions of dollars worth of damage on its own economy and infrastructure and maintain absolute silence on the part of all those involved *and* grant a buck private access to hundreds of thousands of classified military documents and diplomatic cables - and fail to conceal sex acts that two consenting adults engaged in in the oval office.

 

[bstach]

I have never seen so many people here, who normally are on opposing sides of issues, agree before. Therefore, it must be true.

[JayB]

What this thread really needs is JMcKay....

[tvashtarkatena]

It's a shame, because all of this truther bullshit actually distracts people from the real shit going down.

 

Yeah! Like politically-connected insider fatcat toll-booth operators!

 

Some prefer side shows to musicals.

[JayB]

With aggregate budget and pension shortfalls into the trillions that show's coming to the main stage, and soon.

 

The playbill's even getting notice in strange quarters, these days....

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/26/opinion/26sun1.html?_r=1

[prole]

Guess states should've been funding their contractual obligations instead of passing tax-cuts. Whoops!

[j_b]

With aggregate budget and pension shortfalls into the trillions that show's coming to the main stage, and soon.

 

The playbill's even getting notice in strange quarters, these days....

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/26/opinion/26sun1.html?_r=1

 

so you'll be going after the bloated wages of the private sector that got bailed out on the public dime?

 

btw, since you acknowledge that pension shortfall hasn't occurred yet, why haven't you been trying to solve the cause of the current budget shortfall?

Edited December 28, 2010 by j_b

[Choada_Boy]

Sigh... "Tin Foil Hat or Shocking Truth"

 

 

"Please examine the National Institute of Standards and Technology World Trade Center Disaster Investigation Website:

 

http://wtc.nist.gov/

 

...and read the Final Reports of the Federal Building and Fire Investigation of the World Trade Center Disaster:

 

http://wtc.nist.gov/NCSTAR1/

 

...or at least the abstract of NIST NCSTAR 1-6D: Global Structural Analysis of the Response of the World Trade Center Towers to Impact Damage and Fire:

 

http://wtc.nist.gov/NCSTAR1/PDF/NCSTAR%201-6D.pdf

 

 

...but seeing as you have to download the whole article to read the abstract, you might as well look at the whole article.

 

You can also look at the NIST pentagon report:

 

http://www.fire.nist.gov/bfrlpubs/build03/PDF/b03017.pdf

 

...and compare the surveillance video images in the report to the cruise missile explosions in this video:

 

 

...or watch this video of Purdue University's computer simulation of the North Tower Collapse:

 

 

...or the project website:

 

http://www.cs.purdue.edu/homes/cmh/simulation/

 

..or Zeitgeist:

 

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-594683847743189197#

 

...and if you still think there was a massive conspiracy and cover up, well, how's that extra chromosome working out for you?"

 

 

[olyclimber]

http://www.killmydaynow.com/2010/04/different-look-at-common-things-37-pics.html

[rob]

I doubt Kevbone will make it through this, but in my opinion, it thoroughly debunks about everything the crackheads keep stating

 

http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/06-09-11/

 

[kevbone]

I doubt Kevbone will make it through this, but in my opinion, it thoroughly debunks about everything the crackheads keep stating

 

http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/06-09-11/

 

Rob...I read the entire article. It proves nothing.

 

I do like the first response

 

 

Thanks for your efforts to answer many of the charges of conspiracy of 9/11. Unfortunately, your explanations for the collapse of the buildings did not satisfy me at all.

First, there were many eyewitness accounts of explosions emanating from the basement levels of the towers in staccato-like fashion. This was not addressed in your discussion.

Second, blaming the fires for weakening the structural integrity of perhaps one or two of the 6 primary support beams such that the two towers would collapse in free-fall fashion is far-fetched to say the least. Fires need additional fuel to burn more intensely (hotter). No such fuel existed in any of the floors damaged. Jet fuel burns rapidly and exhausts itself fairly quickly. This is probably the weakest counterargument and least-common-sensical thing you tried to present.

Third, you failed to respond to the night-shift maintenance crews’ allegations that a team of unfamiliar electrical maintenance men came with orders to check the internal wiring throughout the towers and did work throughout the towers infrastructure starting nearly six weeks before 9/11 and finishing the week before 9/11. Fourth, Murphy’s law still exists. If something can go wrong, it will. Reality is not so perfect and logical as you seem to suppose. Asking why a conspiring government would do things that appear contradictory to its ‘supposed’ purpose (conspiracy to scare the wits out of American citizens)is to assume everyone was ‘in on it’ when in fact, very very few may have even been aware of what was going on. There are many good honest people in government.

Fifth, you didn’t address Pres. Bush’s reaction after he learned what had occurred while in Fl. Listening and watching him lie(?) was not comforting to me at all. He made me think he knew something before the facts presented themselves.

Sixth, when thousands of fairly smart and reasonable citizens are presented with evidence and circumstances, you assume that because of their ignorance of Middle Eastern politics that none of them are qualified to make a judgement of what happened in plain view of many. Don’t you think you’re being a little arrogant? This is the way you appear to me. It’s kind of like disagreeing with the judgement of a jury. The jury is still out about who did this and why it was done. Most everyone can see that at least a few people or agencies in the US Government may have coordinated their contributions to this event for nefarious purposes with the actual perpetrators of the crime with the intent to cloud the facts surrounding the event. If so, it would not be the first, nor the last time this has ever happened.

Seventh, much evidence has been sifted through and digested. The weight of the accumulated evidence points to an inside job – not unrelated or physically impossible circumstances. Your contribution has been helpful in eliminating some of the fog surrounding some of the misunderstood facts but falls far short of answering many questions.

Sorry.

 

 

[Coldfinger]

It proves you are an idiot an that is something.

[rob]

Why did the government plan on blowing up bldg 7, HOURS after Bldg 1 and 2, and without any explanation? They couldn't have known it would be hit by debris from bldg 1 and 2, or catch on fire, so how would they have explained a sudden explosion and collapse hours later? Why not just hit it with another plane?

 

Firefighters entering the building knew it was going to collapse and calculated it would collapse by 3PM. They were a few hours off.

Edited January 3, 2011 by rob

[kevbone]

I don’t have all the answers Rob. I do believe there is more here what the "official" explanation was.

 

Coldfinger, what is with the name calling? I bet you would not say that to my face. I am not provoking you, just stating that it is easy to name call while hiding behind your computer. Let’s agree to stop with the name calling simply because we disagree.

 

Take care!

 

[G-spotter]

I don’t have all the answers Rob. I do believe there is more here what the "official" explanation was.

 

 

 

Fortunately, the truth can be empirically determined and what you believe makes no difference.

[Choada_Boy]

"Despite incontrovertible evidence, there are still some skeptics."

 

 

[rob]

First, there were many eyewitness accounts of explosions emanating from the basement levels of the towers in staccato-like fashion.

Really? Please post reference.

Third, you failed to respond to the night-shift maintenance crews’ allegations that a team of unfamiliar electrical maintenance men came with orders to check the internal wiring throughout the towers and did work throughout the towers infrastructure starting nearly six weeks before 9/11 and finishing the week before 9/11.

I'm not sure I've heard this one before. Please post reference

Fourth, Murphy’s law still exists. If something can go wrong, it will.

Exactly. Quite an operation the government managed to pull off, huh?

[rob]

Hey, how do you imagine they've kept the "night crew" (that actually placed the explsoives) quiet all these years? Impressive.

[Choada_Boy]

I doubt Kevbone will make it through this, but in my opinion, it thoroughly debunks about everything the crackheads keep stating

 

http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/06-09-11/

 

Rob...I read the entire article. It proves nothing.

 

 

Yes. It proves nothing. But it uses what are called "facts" to refute all of your "beliefs".

[Choada_Boy]

I wonder how many NYC firemen buy into this bullshit? My guess: zero.

[Coldfinger]

Kev, I certainly would, and I just did. Don't try to have your cake and eat it too.

 

You ARE free to disseminate lies disrespectful of the dead and the living, so at the very least I am free to point out the obvious: you are being an idiot.

 

Let's put it this way: maybe if 2,975 people from your community died and some idiot had to prove how smart he was, you'd understand how disrespectful of the dead (and the living) this whole thing is. Apparently that they were from your country is not enough for you.

 

I was born outside of Boston, where planes were hijacked from and every single person onboard was killed.

 

It was part of a larger war that had been going on in Afghanistan for years, no coincidence Ahmad Shah Massoud was assassinated just before, one of many more than the casualties of Al Qaeda in the states. So try to understand there has been a huge death toll and a whole lot of suffering beyond 911 and these folks deserve to be respected too.

 

This is not to absolve or ignore the actions of our government in the aftermath, but it really makes you and the believers look like clueless idiots.

 

Please lock this thread!

 

 

Edited January 3, 2011 by Coldfinger

[kevbone]

Yes. It proves nothing. But it uses what are called "facts" to refute all of your "beliefs".

 

Facts? That depends on where you get your "fact" from.

Coldfinger. You sound like the same people that say “if I don’t support the war then I don’t support the troops”. They are two totally different things. That statement pisses me off to no end. I totally support our troops, just not the leaders of our troops. There is a difference.

 

Same concept with “who” was behind 9/11. We are not debating that 2,975 people lost there lives or that 9/11 was the worst day in American history (not to mention over 4000 US troops that are completely innocent, don’t forget about them, I HAVE NOT!) At least I am not. So stop with the disrespect card. It’s been played. You have been debunked on that topic. I simply do not believe what the “official report” reported of “how” or “who” was behind it.

 

To me, to be patriotic means to have the ability and the reasoning to question your government. You man choose not too….I may choose too.

 

 

 

[kevbone]

Fortunately, the truth can be empirically determined and what you believe makes no difference.

 

Still waiting for the empirical truth to be determined.

[Coldfinger]

You really are full of crap Kev---to be doing this in the name of being PROGRESSIVE or INTELLECTUAL FREEDOM.

 

First, there really are horrible things done by horrible people (or just the demented, delusional or indifferent) so why not focus on those REAL problems and stop trying to pass yourself off as some sort of admirable dissenter (there are lots of real ones out there).

 

Second, it's simple: if you want to say things in the name of 'intellectual discourse' you have to be intellectually honest.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

Fortunately, the truth can be empirically determined and what you believe makes no difference.

 

Still waiting for the empirical truth to be determined.

 

STFU you moron.