Rogers Corner and BOC bolts.

[Doug T]

I smell BS too.

 

A couple of months ago we removed over 25 FEET of webbing and rope from those 2 trees and put in an anchor. The new anchor is safer and easier to belay and descend with. The old anchor was an eyesore.

 

We asked lots of folks, including the ranger, their opinions of putting in an anchor over using the tat rappel and the unanimous reply was that an anchor was better.

 

This is the first complaint since the anchors went in, yet the route has been climbed many many times. The silent majority prefers the anchors.

 

So put your crowbar away and pick up your wire brushes and bush-whackers and put your energies into making the place a better climbing area.

 

Doug Taylor

[Sol]

what a whiny little bitch.

 

drep, what have you done for index lately?

 

routes that could use a scrub:

imperial fun

senseless thoughts of paranoia

everest with lycra

sisu

good girls like bad boys

technicians of the sacred

bravo jean marc

earwax crack

another man's car

 

that's a start at least.

[DRep]

Sol, You don't even know me, or what I've done for Index or other crags on my own so STFU!

 

Doug, thank you, this is what I wanted to find out. While I may not agree with it 100%, if you had a unanimous decision among everyone you talked to then I can live with that. My OP came across a little harsh and cavalier, I had just had a heated discussion with my partner which got us both worked up. So fear not, I'm not going to chop the bolts because I see that they are important to people. I just worry about the future of the crag due to things I've been noticing. But the times are changing and I just need to live with it.

[Sol]

do work.

[catbirdseat]

Since the tree is protected from rope damage by slings, the issue becomes one of aesthetics. Decide whether you'd rather look at multicolored nylon slings around a tree or somewhat more innocuous looking chain below it.

 

To a slight degree, slings too can inflict some damage to a tree, especially if they increase the rate at which soil is removed from the roots. This is probably not true in this case.

 

If you had asked me before putting in the anchor I'd be indifferent. Now that it's there, and assuming the slings are cleaned up, I'd say leave it be.

[E-rock]

The only reason that anchor shouldn't have been bolted is bcause more of those fucking trees need to die at Index. Quit being an eco-tard. If you climb in the PNW trees have to die!

[Buckaroo]

The only reason that anchor shouldn't have been bolted is bcause more of those fucking trees need to die at Index. Quit being an eco-tard. If you climb in the PNW trees have to die!

 

FFFFF you A-hole

[E-rock]

"rapping from the tree is natural"? is your rope natural? how about your slings, shoes, or harness? all natural fibers, too?

 

like i said, a 3 digit IQ should be a requirement for a discussion like this.

 

Nevermind, apparently I was drawn into a random spray war by a fucking retard who doesn't know anything about the meaning of "natural" in the climbing world. Apparently you're another noob who thinks he has a say because he now climbs 10a. Die, dipshit.

[Doug T]

what a whiny little bitch.

 

drep, what have you done for index lately?

 

routes that could use a scrub:

imperial fun

senseless thoughts of paranoia

everest with lycra

sisu

good girls like bad boys

technicians of the sacred

bravo jean marc

earwax crack

another man's car

 

that's a start at least.

 

I'd like to add Racer X

[AlpineK]

Just a little point of order here regarding trees.

 

Quoting from American National Standards Institute (ANSI) A300 rules for pruning.*

 

5.2.1

Equipment and work practices that damage living tissue and bark beyond the original scope of work should be avoided.

 

 

In the past ropes were placed around crotches of trees of enough size to support body weight. Since the rope slides during work and removal this would damage tissue clearly beyond the job intention. Currently one hangs in a tree from a device called a friction saver. On completion of your task the device is removed from the tree.

 

Sometimes there's no other choice given what you have with you, but a rap bolt station next to a tree is head and shoulders above a bunch of nasty old slings of questionable strength.

 

 

* From TCIA

 

The ANSI A300 series of standards for tree care operations – tree, shrub and woody plant management – apply to professionals who provide for or supervise the management of trees, shrubs, and other woody landscape plants. Intended users include businesses, government agencies, property owners, property managers, and utilities

[Raindawg]

Since the tree is protected from rope damage by slings, the issue becomes one of aesthetics. Decide whether you'd rather look at multicolored nylon slings around a tree or somewhat more innocuous looking chain below it.

 

No, dude...it ain't just about "aesthetics". It's a matter of to what extent you want to add permanent artificial alterations to the climbing environment. If the tree isn't being harmed, you can always use rap-slings of an appropriate non-blaring color and then not allow the "tat" to accumulate...a solution that's a lot better than adding metallic scrap to one of the oldest and most classic climbs at Index that has somehow survived for 40 years or so without the "improvements".

 

 

[el jefe]

*yawn*

[el jefe]

"rapping from the tree is natural"? is your rope natural? how about your slings, shoes, or harness? all natural fibers, too?

 

like i said, a 3 digit IQ should be a requirement for a discussion like this.

 

Nevermind, apparently I was drawn into a random spray war by a fucking retard who doesn't know anything about the meaning of "natural" in the climbing world. Apparently you're another noob who thinks he has a say because he now climbs 10a. Die, dipshit.

 

another mouth-breather adds his 2 cents worth...

[canyondweller]

Sol, You don't even know me, or what I've done for Index or other crags on my own so STFU!

 

This is "internet-speak" for "I ain't done shit anywheres, but there's no way you can prove different. I'm anonymous."

 

IMO, the bolts should not have been put in. The tree was/is fine.

[DRep]

Over my ten years growing up as a kid climbing at Index I've scrubbed K-cliff in 2004, Cut back the brush on the approaches to the Inner Walls and the Upper wall trail many times. I've been going to school in Bozeman, Montana the past four years. In my time spent in Hyalite Canyon, I spent time directing early season water flows to popular climbs found in the Genesis area so that people can have spectacular pillars and icicles close to the parking lot (make it to these climbs last season? wonder why they were so fat?) I'm not a stranger to helping a local crag.

 

Look I don't know any of you. You don't know me. I can tell you that being back in Washington, I will be doing my part to help maintain Index (The routes listed above will have a few cleaned this fall).

 

As far as the "Natural" comment. What I mean to say is that slings on a tree are replacable, holes in the rock are not. It's just how I feel about it. Keep slandering me if you will, I've had enough of this ego drivin shit talking! I'm Out!

[RuMR]

Sol, You don't even know me, or what I've done for Index or other crags on my own so STFU!

 

This is "internet-speak" for "I ain't done shit anywheres, but there's no way you can prove different. I'm anonymous."

 

IMO, the bolts should not have been put in. The tree was/is fine.

and remind me, your opinion is worth what???

[Off_White]

Okay okay okay, I'll move this mess to Spray.

[billcoe]

Okay okay okay, I'll move this mess to Spray.

 

Damn, now the threads gonna denigrate further and start being all about politics again....

 

Obama Palin Mccain Biden blah de blah blah blah yak yak...

[olyclimber]

Bill, I think you're on to something! Who would have bolted, McCain/Palin or Obama/Biden? Which would chop? And what would it cost the taxpayer?

[pink]

McCain Would Drill, Palin Wouls Preach No Drilling But her Daughter Would Despite

[tvashtarkatena]

I'd sling Palin to a tree, drill her, then bolt.

 

BTW, slings around trees in popular areas can severely damage the cambium layer and eventually kill it. Keep the bolts for the tree's sake.

[Off_White]

Hey you scumbuckets and hamster dancers, this thread is strictly for climbing related insults and slander, go check out an Athahulkee thread if you want to spew that kind of stomach chowder.

[pink]

Obama Would Say He Was Going To Chop the Bolts That the Poor Bastards Put In And Try to Make The Rich Pay for It, and Biden Would Be Sitting There Telling Palin How Great of Speech She Gave.

[olyclimber]

i could go for a bowl of stomach chowder right now

[pink]

Hey you scumbuckets and hamster dancers, this thread is strictly for climbing related insults and slander, go check out an Athahulkee thread if you want to spew that kind of stomach chowder.