mattp Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 I think he's painting too extreme of a picture and it undermines his argument. Joseph's reply to Blizzard had a lot of good points, but where he says that those who disagree with him are united in advocating unrestricted bolting, presumably everywhere, or where he talks about developing new routes as an insatiable thirst as if there is a sickness behind all of this, he loses credibility. Where, earlier in the thread, he argued that overnight some time in the 1980's everything about the sport suddenly changed when the gyms opened up, I think he is incorrect. Climbers, and climbers who do and who do not get involved in these debates, and climbers who pursue new routes or have no interest in it, come in all different shapes and sizes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Joseph needs to chug a case of STFU!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 or someone's gonna open a kegger of WhoopArse TM on him... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 ps: Not by me of course...i accidentally swallowed a pill of SallyWankerIam... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 the effect hasn't worn off quite yet.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bug Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 It's wearing you down isn't it R? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Joseph needs to chug a case of STFU!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 It's wearing you down isn't it R? yep! I'm even shorter now...unfortunately the effect of that Sally pill, in addition to making me shorter, is making me retain water, so i'm bloated and bitchy too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 How is that funny? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 i see you found the stash of Joseph's STFU...why don't you take a swig of that and a nibble of NOOB cookie, bitch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archenemy Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 bolt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 chop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 What's amazing to me is the repeated assertion that climbing unbolted trad lines invariably involves acts that are either terribly difficult or dangerous. Most lines that see any traffic, which constitute ~95% of all of the climbing that gets done feature moderate climbing, with abundant protection, which is easily obtained. It wouldn't surprise me if the limiting factor for most people wasn't the difficulty or risk, but the price of the gear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 i believe in state-subsidized climbing gear. paid vacations. let the rich contribute to the poor's vacation time. actually, that's a pretty good and progressive idea. community health. but yes, trad climbing is mainly safe. witness the "hardest" trad lines now: the falls are clean, good protection. placing gear is a bitch, but that's part of the whole difficulty equation. making a big deal out of it seems a bit arbitrary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 boltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted March 13, 2008 Author Share Posted March 13, 2008 (edited) I was going to earlier just post “Screw you” and leave it at that but thought it over and decided not to. You see, unlike you, I do take it personally. Very much so. As far as why I put the original post on here to start with, if that was one of your questions or you might give a flying fu*k about, it was because I find the bitchy, sanctimonious pontificating and reaching lecturing Don continually interjects offensive and objectionable. Much like what you just brought to this thread, except from you I find it personally objectionable and offensive. I've done enough stupid hypocritical things to know not to toss rocks at others glass houses, however, when I get preached at, I’m still a bit of an anarchist as well, and it still rankles me when someone (in my mind) shows up preaching black and white bullshit at me. Like Don. So I directed this post at him, it’s maybe my 3rd shot at a similar theme, and he’s annoyed enough that he won’t respond, although I know he reads every word, which is what I want. If I could have a discussion with him about it, I would, because I suspect he’s a pretty fine fellow. As he’s not around, I’ll put it on the same place he puts the stuff I find objectionable. I’ll confess as well that I don’t do a good job of remembering all the things I’ve ever discussed with people. I do recall only 2 bolting conversations that involves you. The big one was when you power drilled a bolt: "fait accompli", into the apron out at Beacon. You didn’t ask me beforehand,, nor did you follow what you knew to be the protocol to do so. If my memory serves me correctly, I was one of the only folks not to be giving you a raft of bitchy, sanctimonious pontificating and reaching lecturing shit about it,. Nor did I give you a raft of bitchy, sanctimonious pontificating and reaching lecturing bullshit and crap when you then just went and yanked it right out: “fait accompli” and again without discussing it with me beforehand. I can see that my lack of doing so may have confused you as to my actual bolting position, which I am trying not to preach as I have understandings both ways on the subject. It is not black and white at all to me as confused and hypocritical as I can be. I try to refrain from bitchy, sanctimonious pontificating and lecturing about it as I do see several sides, like with that Beacon Bolt. In the end, in the grandest scheme of things, it’s not all that damn important anyway. I can post my position later at some point although I do not believe that anyone will give a rats ass. I could be wrong about the Beacon bolt you put in as my memory about this kind of thing is poor, but of course you can go hunt up the very thread I’m referencing and find the very words we all used then. I even invite you to toss them back in my face if my memory is incorrect about all that crap. Frankly, it didn't seem as important to me, a mountain out of a molehill so to speak, as it appears to be to you now from reading your many words, many of I read to be slamming me. In all of your words I never did see a fuc*king word one that indicated you couldn't see a single fuc*king bolt in the Yos pic I posted. Which was the fuc*king question I asked. When you read my words there, and here as well, remember this most important of underlying points AS I SEE IT: to you, they may only be words: but to me, it’s personal. Edited March 13, 2008 by billcoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoff Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Y'all better play nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raindawg Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Mr. Billcoe. If you don't like my posts, you aren't required to read them nor respond to them. You can just treat them as opinions you don't prefer, from someone you don't respect, and thus ignore them. I'm making an exception responding to you now, just to offer that advice. End of story. good luck and happy climbing! - don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Sorry, Dawg, but that is not a valid dodge. Where you make a good point, some commend you. Where you are simply being a pest, many condemn you. With few if any exceptions, the only posters on this bulletin board who have ever argued "if you don't like my posts you don't have to read them" have been those who were widely condemned for being obnoxious and most here believed they were deliberately so. You may find it amusing to continually "explain" how climbing has been taken over by the devil or the top performers in the sport are in your mind no more than a joke, but that'd be like having some of cc.com's loudest Athiests campout inside your synagogue or maybe at your office or lab or your golf countryclub with signs proclaiming that Zionism is wicked and Raindawg is the biggest offender. You might ignore them the first day or two but it would grow old if they persisted. The 500th time you enter the same conversation between the same individuals with the same message that is generally if not directly dismissive of most others involved you are not some freedom fighter carrying the banner of hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 bill's really been opening up lately! hookers and assault w/ a deadly-weapon confessions in only a single week! truly, he is bruce banner! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted March 13, 2008 Author Share Posted March 13, 2008 Agreeing to what Matt said: but thank you Don, and may success, good luck and happy climbing follow you as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted March 13, 2008 Author Share Posted March 13, 2008 You know this to be true: people are like onions Ivan, under the skin, we all have layers. Some of us have more and some of us have less shielding them than others is all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Moderators....can you fix the sizing here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 boltitchopitboltitchopitboltitchopit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 BoltitChopitBoltitChopit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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