Dave_Schuldt Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 On ODD days. Who's down for a ride next weekend? Be nice to horses and hikers out there, it took 10 years to get this far, we don't need any complaints. http://bbtc.org/home/index.php for info to be posted soon. to the BBTC, WTA, USFS and Friends of the Trail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 WTA. These are the guys who lobbied for/supported the closure of the upper Middle Fork Road. A trails oganization, for God's sake! And now we're thrown scraps in the form of mountain bike access on odd-numbered days??...access that will, no doubt, be yanked the first time Harvey Manning claims he's been accosted by the 'silent menace'. (his words) Â Once the road shuts down, I'll be riding my bike well beyond the Dutch Miller trailhead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Schuldt Posted August 28, 2005 Author Share Posted August 28, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nothing Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 dave, Â i'm w/fairweather on this one. wta has never done a thing to support mt biking or share the trails with anyone. the middle fork trail is no exception. their way or the highway. speaking of highways - it seems as though they are trying to turn many of the trails into highways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EWolfe Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 Pshaw. Ride hard, poach the sweet lines, and screw the Man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancegranite Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 Reading some of my dad's copies of 101 hikes, I never realized how full of venom the text was. Every third page they bitch, bitch, bitch about the purity of hiking and their superior distain for all other users. Â Don't these fossils realize that those other user groups are the only allies they have? I don't care if you hike wearing bells and waving sparklers, if you are out hiking, chances are you are not there to drill for oil.( and therefore a friend of mine) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Schuldt Posted August 28, 2005 Author Share Posted August 28, 2005 Pull your heads out of your asses and listen up! I have done many WTA work parties and never got any shit for being a biker. Some of the crew leaders also ride. You clowns are stuck in the 80s. We are building a sick trail on Grand Ridge that will be open to bikes. Oh, and while your heading up to your next climb don't forget who is working on the trails. Check this link for a trip report. http://www.cascadeclimbers.com/threadz/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/490404/an/0/page/1#490404 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshK Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 Yeah, the Manning and Spring's books are seriously critical. It is tiring to read. There is a difference between fighting bullshit like sno-mos and ATVs and fighting bikes. I understand limiting bikes on the high-impact alpine areas, but they should be allowed on more non-wilderness trails, imho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mal_Con Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 My opinion is they should allow bikes where ever horsies are OK. Bikes don't tear up trails a much as steel shoes and bikers usually don't crap in the trail. What with cuts in FS budget WTA is about the only one maintaining them cept for BBTC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EWolfe Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 Actually tire divots create channels that can deveolop into major run-off outlets. nJust by a skid stop or a track through a soft patch. Â INSIDIOUS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mal_Con Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 True but still not as bad as crap or a really churned up trail with exotic weeds sprouting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olyclimber Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 Ya! and what about those FUCKIN ATLANTIC SALMON! this world is going to hell in a hand basket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marylou Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 My opinion is they should allow bikes where ever horsies are OK. Â So, Mal, are you saying the Wilderness Act should be revised or reinterpreted to allow for mountain bikes on any trail in the Wilderness system currently open to stock? Â I mean, it's kind of a cool idea and all, but it does open a huge can of worms. Dave Schuldt is a mountain bike guy and I would think even he would frown on such a dramatic change to the Act. Â And while we're at it, shouldn't this thread be in Access? I'd rather see it there where it at least has a chance of not turning into a sprayfest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomtom Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 Dirt bikes and Monster trucks next! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 So, Mal, are you saying the Wilderness Act should be revised or reinterpreted to allow for mountain bikes on any trail in the Wilderness system currently open to stock? Â Yes. Trails need maintenance. Forest Service has less money to support trails. Mountain bikers would be one additional avenue for trail support and maintenance. Get them in the loop! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mal_Con Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 It depends on the trail. The new middle fork trail has been upgraded to horsie specs and is like a small road now NTB use could not hurt it more. What frosts me is that places like the Redmond Watershed and Cougar Mountain trails are open to horses but not bikes. I some dork galloping a horse down cavehole one time that would have killed anyone running or walking there, bikes have a lot more control. Bikes used to be allowed under the wilderness act. I think the real effect would be to prohibit horses from unsuitable areas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downfall Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 I think the real effect would be to prohibit horses from unsuitable areas. Â From what I understood when working trail for the FS for a couple of summers is that major concessions are made to stock travel since for most of the trails these were the origional users. I'd say most trails were origionally blazed by horseback riders trying to get to some lake. Since they have the historical precident for usage its hard to take that away from them (even if I personally would be for it). Â I second the claim that WTA is turning lots of trail in to roads. I think they have a tendency to not have a very strong wild-ness ethic as well as taking a bunch of weekenders/rei-gawkers our to build what they think a trail should look like. In the end you get 90% of the maintenece done within the first 2-3 miles of the TH and because of this short range you get too much work done. I was once on one of their crews and they told us we should be pruning all foilage back 10 feet from the trail. I told them I didn't want to do that and dediced to go for a hike instead. Â Sorry this has little to do with MTBs which I don't really have an opinion on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 ...shouldn't this thread be in Access? I'd rather see it there where it at least has a chance of not turning into a sprayfest. Prohibition of mountain dykes from trails is unlawfull discrimination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 what I want to know is what gives people license to wear some of the most fruity clothes in existance just because they are on a bike. Is there some 80's eurotrash discount card you get with every bike sold? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olyclimber Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 once you're tried shorts with a chamois you'll never go back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 you gotta join the fad if you wanna be rad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 is "chamois" french for "look at me I'm sponsored by all these sponsors, and by that I mean I'm paying them to advertise on my ass."? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 is "chamois" french for "look at me I'm sponsored by all these sponsors, and by that I mean I'm paying them to advertise on my ass."? Â Maybe one is paying to become the sponsor's ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 a chamois is just a french goat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Schuldt Posted August 29, 2005 Author Share Posted August 29, 2005 I would love to ride my bike in the wilderness, however, the thrash it would take to make that happen would eat up huge amounts of Forest Service time. I don't think it's a battle worth fighting. The NPS is going to open more areas to MTB. See the IMBA site for details. Until all the user groups see that the pie is much bigger than thier sport we are screwed. We all want more trail, right? I got frustrated with the BBTC 'cause no mater how much I tried no other club members showed up for any Grand Ridge work parties. (This trail will be open to bikes) They more or less cried like Fairwether and wanted to play in thier own sandbox. This makes us look bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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