Lambone Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 quote: Originally posted by JayB: I suppose that's one of the things that I've never understood about some of the spray(ers) on this site. Take a guy like Lambone for instance (though it could be anyone who gets out on hard stuff) - does grade V free routes, big aid routes like The Shield, long alpine routes, leads WI-*$#ing-5, etc - yet there are people out there who think that the fact that they have some business calling this guy a pussy because he clips bolts and they don't, regardless of what grade they lead at the trad-crags. Amazing. This despite the fact that I'd be willing to bet that 98% of the folks that chime in about sport climbing as the definitive route to wussdom would likely be shut down in a massive way - think not even making it to the first bolt - trying to follow his hardest sport leads - and let's not even talk about the WI5 stuff. Wow Jay, you don't know how much that means to me...! Although my hardest sport leads are barley even warm ups by todays standards. Back in the day I use to try and play Dr. Flash Amazings role as the defender of sport climbers. Thankfully he has stepped in and is doing a much better job. I bowed out of that game as it led to too much negativity, as you speek of. I'm just a generalist who enjoys all types of climbing (except hard scary bouldering). The people who I dislike are the specialists who think their version of climbing is better than someone elses. Who is to say that Godzilla is a better, or more worthy route than Repiles and Emphetimines...? Oh and by the way, I pretty much am a pussy, I carry tripples of everything on Godzilla, and all routes at Index, just in case I have to aid it that day... Erik is the real stud...he only takes four cams. Quote
Greg_W Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 quote: Originally posted by chucK: What can be verified is whether someone's posted words are stupid or not. I think it's OK to flame posted stupidity even if the ignoramous can climb harder than me. I think you are spot on ChucK. Good climber or not, if someone takes a ludicrous stance on a subject being debated he deserves to be flamed. Since JayB brought him up, here is a Lambone case-in-point: Lambone defending Larry the Tool's aggressive and intimidating actions at the SCW parking lot. All he was trying to do was take the contrary view which obviously opens one up to serious flame-age. Greg W Quote
sk Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 I will talk shit to anyone anywhere, on line or in person. I don't care if they are chris sharma or not. Granted i have a great deal of respect for some of the bad ass climbers on this site. But lets face it, just because you can climb 5.14 doesn't make you not an ignorant asshole if you are. say what you need to say, do what you need to do, most importantly, be true to yourself. Ummm, sk has spoken Quote
Alex Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Lambone: Erik is the real stud...he only takes four cams. [/QB] Why, I do believe I-am-a-bone is coming on to you erik! Quote
Peter_Puget Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 Quote:"Good climber or not, if someone takes a ludicrous stance on a subject being debated he deserves to be flamed." UNder the influence of Dwayner and a reference to Jerry Springer. I am editing this. But Greg I called you a name because that is an idiotic position to take. [ 08-21-2002, 12:30 PM: Message edited by: Peter Puget ] Quote
Lambone Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Greg W: I think you are spot on ChucK. Good climber or not, if someone takes a ludicrous stance on a subject being debated he deserves to be flamed. Since JayB brought him up, here is a Lambone case-in-point: Lambone defending Larry the Tool's aggressive and intimidating actions at the SCW parking lot. All he was trying to do was take the contrary view which obviously opens one up to serious flame-age. Greg W[/QB] You're right there spraymaster Greg, and I never complained about all the shit I got from that. I sorta felt bad about unintentionaly insulting alpine brother mattp, but other wise I was just fuckin around. I've taken my share of shit from the pigs, and I hate to see em just as much as the next dirtbag... I still think those who openly dis on sport climbers on this board are lame closed minded pricks. Spray on! [ 08-21-2002, 12:29 PM: Message edited by: Lambone ] Quote
JayB Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Dru: JayB if I could respectively disagree for a minnit here, I dont belive you have to climb at a certain grade to criticize ethics. For instance, I can say chipping holds on a blank wall to make a 5.14 is unethical and that the chipped holds should be "repaired" with cement or whatever, even if I'm only a 5.7 climber. The principle of the thing is the same no matter what grade you climb at. Same goes with criticizing bolts being placed next to usable gear placements, the principle is the same no matter if its a 5.7 or 5.14 gear route being retrobolted. Dru: You're absolutely right if what we're talking about is ethics. Although the absence of caffeine in my veins probably made my post a bit more vague and rambling than it had to be, the only ethics I meant to touch on were the "ethics" of talking smack about one's fellow climbers. I think ethics is the wrong word to describe the phenomenon, but I've just never been able to figure out the folks who think the fact that they refrain from sport climbing entitles them to belittle the folks that do, without taking the full scope of their respective abilities into account. I just brought up the case of Lambone and the folks who attack him as perhaps the most glaring example of this phenomenon. It's a species of BS that I've never encountered outside of this board, and I figured that it was high time someone called it for what it is. Quote
Greg_W Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Peter Puget: Quote:"Good climber or not, if someone takes a ludicrous stance on a subject being debated he deserves to be flamed." UNder the influence of Dwayner and a reference to Jerry Springer. I am editing this. But Greg I called you a name because that is an idiotic position to take. Ludicrous: adj "Laughable because of obvious absurdity or incongruousness." That's Webster talking. I stand by my statement on the grounds of freedom of expression and freedom of speech. There is no "freedom from being called an idiot." Your opinion is yours, mine is mine, and we both have the freedom to call the other an idiot. For the record, I don't care what type of climbing you enjoy. Ethics, permanent damage to the rock, and government over-control are another matter. PP, you can re-edit your post; I don't care if you think I'm an asshole. I've been called worse by better than you. To quote the great American philosopher, Popeye, "I yam what I yam, and that's what I yam." Greg W P.S. PP, I could stoop to your level and say something like, "Bite off, Fucko." But I won't Quote
allthumbs Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 so what's the alternative to dissin' and sprayin' ?? actual work ... i don't think so Quote
Greg_W Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 quote: Originally posted by trask: actual work Now THAT'S a ludicrous idea. Quote
JayB Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 quote: Originally posted by chucK: Ludicrous! Why should this be a yardstick? What is so special about climbing? How about "imagine yourself trying to do the hardest math test they're capable of acing?" How about "imagine yourself trying to build the Lego creation that person has done". Chuck - I certainly wasn't taking a stand for the right to say something stupid or offensive without rebuke. Different topic entirely, sorry If I didn't make that clear in my post. As far as the legos examples of legos and mathematics are concerned, that too is something entirely different. Expertise in a given field certainly does not entitle one to immunity from criticism in all other endeavors oneself, nor does it give one the right to critise everyone else whose attainments in their own field don't quite measure up to your own accomplishments in say, competitive lego events. If, however, you are involved in competitive lego building yourself and are about to make demeaning comments to a fellow lego enthusiast about his prowress with the said legos, you should, I think, take your own lego building accomplishments into account before opening your mouth. That's all. Quote
chucK Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 I just love it when people quote dictionary definitions! I mean it. I just eat that shit up! Hey Greg, Could you look up Webster's defintion of "incongruousness" for me now? Please! It's quite a mouthful. I'd like to use that in a sentence! Quote
Attitude Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 quote: Originally posted by chucK: quote: I have another one to add - before making negative comments about one of your fellow climbers, imagine yourself at the base of the hardest route they're capable of leading at the moment - with an audience. Ludicrous! Why should this be a yardstick? What is so special about climbing? How about "imagine yourself trying to do the hardest math test they're capable of acing?" How about "imagine yourself trying to build the Lego creation that person has done". Let's just whip out our dicks, and the one with the biggest is King of the Mountain! Quote
Greg_W Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 Close as I could get: Incongruous: adj 1.Not corresponding: disagreeing 2.Made up of diverse or discordant elements 3.Unsuited to the surroundings or setting Hope it helps! Greg W PAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGE TOOOOOOPPPP! [ 08-21-2002, 12:52 PM: Message edited by: Greg W ] Quote
Dr_Flash_Amazing Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 Dr. Flash Amazing could out-lego your punk ass any day, fool. Quote
timi Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 U guys have way too much time on your hands, go climb something...it relives a bit of the frustration that masterbation leaves behind... Quote
Dr_Flash_Amazing Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 Sure, circa preschool, maybe. They're too trad, though. Legos romp. Quote
chucK Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 Speaking of Legos! Check this game out lego game (requires shockwave). It's cool. I play it, ummm,...with my kids.... Take THAT JayB!! Quote
Dru Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 see.. overhanging 12c in the needles...not the whole route but roofs, bone... anyways to answer off white's question, you hammer directly with the drill until you can make a little hole to rest the drill in then you start using the hammer. paul piana wrote an article in climbing mag c. 1994 about this crazy old man named gene somebody that put up all these routes in the needles using exactly those ethics - free, no hooks drilling on the lead. his quote "Its a lot of work and i wouldn't recommend it to anyone". I still have that issue but im not gonna spend 6 days digging thru the pile looking gfor it. i bet its in the climbing magazine index anyways. Quote
Peter_Puget Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 Hey Sexy I said that bit about 4th being closer to 5.11 than 5.11 is to .14c but I would also add that the trade off for specialization is that mostsportos who climb .13 are not even all around .11c leaders. Actually over the year sI have met very few people who are. PP Quote
sexual_chocolate Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 I did say "fairly fit", not 15 lbs overweight. And in a few months, "fairly fit" becomes "very fit" with proper training and diet. And yes, I do believe his name was Gene, and he would hit the rock with just the drill, over and over until the drill would finally stay in the hole he had created. Then he would hammer. Quote
sexual_chocolate Posted August 22, 2002 Posted August 22, 2002 PP, maybe sport-climbing is the only thing that interests them? Take the average 5.13 sporty, teach him/her some traddie techniques, and I bet quickly they would be able to lead 5.12 trad....Sport-climbing gives the same athleticism required on harder trad, don't you think? BTW, at least a few of the 5.13 climbers I know are quite good on trad, with 5.12 gear on-sight abilities.... Quote
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