el jefe

i believe "rise and fall" was greg child's route, but the phrase "hardcore strong" would apply to greg as well. i don't know anything about a second ascent. darryl cramer would be the person to ask.

hmmm...kev's got a good point here. kkk makses quite a lot of posts re: sperm swallowing and bestiality...and he exhibits quite a lot of anger, too. classic signs of repression...hmmm...

i'm guessing the correct spelling for "chirp" is "t w e r p" -- nicht wahr?

THAT is Beacon?? THAT is a ROUTE?? THAT IS WHAT ALL THIS SPRAY IS ABOUT?? there's always one guy who is the last one to get the joke! this time it's you, counter!

i don't believe "victimal" is actually a word -- at least i couldn't find it in my dictionary. however, it isn't surprising that someone who freely makes up "facts" whenever he needs one would make up words, too.

yes, nice photos of a great place. glad you had a really good trip.

come on, steve, if you go to the valley you have to either trad climb or sport climb, you can't do both. we can't be having any of this variety/different styles sort of shit going on. you have to pick just one thing and go with it.

check out greg orton's guides to rock climbing in western oregon.

good work on another useful and excellent guidebook, chris. just ignore the clucking of old hens like joseph and raindawg. those guys are caught in some kind of weird time warp.

summitchaser, the first rule of climbing is there are no rules!

even hegel reads like pure, clear simplicity itself when compared to this blather.

macleod and ilgner are right on this point. if you want to improve you have to fall off.

no hard and fast rules that i know of. if it seems like a real pain in the ass to get the draw on the bolt in the first place, then equipping with fixed draws seems to make sense to me.

chickenhead? i thought that was a boulder lying on the slab. "angle of repose"

summitchaser = slow learner

you guys need to get a clue. this route is clearly a major addition to index and likely to move it from a backwater climbing area to the forefront of the world climbing scene. wait until they run that photo in alpinist! you'll see.

i read through this thread while perfectly sober and had the same response as you, spiderman. however, summitchaser making an ass out of himself on this site is certainly not a new thing.

how does a bolt change anything? the pin was fixed gear, too, so the bolt wouldn't impact the boldness of the climb since either way you'd be clipping in situ gear. that said, the pin may have become unnecessary with the advent of modern cams, in which case it may not need to be replaced by a bolt or by a new piton. once upon a time the really small and really large cams currently available didn't exist, hence the use of fixed pins and bolts in some instances.

yes, raindawg, time to walk the walk, not just talk, talk, talk...

[quote=Nitrox[ Nor does being an ingrate Polack. and nitrox wonders why i think he is a racist prick troll -- got some more racial and ethnic slurs you feel like throwing around, nitrox?

refresh our memory: McCain by landslide....., because you know this country better. like i said- don't you have a date with a pig? Only a degenerate scumbag would make a joke about someone's Grandmother getting raped during WW2. Is there a way to block a person entirely? No quotes, no nothing, so I don't have to ever see this worthless loser's spew ever? Throw them down the memoryhole completely? Can't keep yourself from peeking beneath the toggle line, eh? What a fuckin pussy. Anyway, who said anything about rape? My understanding is that GGK's bloodline is pretty, um, shall we say, accommodating. not racially pure aryan stock like you, gruppenfuehrer fairwetter? you fascist sorts tend to obsess over who's having relations with whom.

he's the "mouthpiece of the intelligentsia" when it talks out of its ass.

right back at you

up past your bedtime, atreides?

nice try, rudy, but the neanderthals on this website are still carrying the "ten essentials" and practicing the hip belay every time they go out. not much chance they'd understand that the world has moved on...