Raindawg

a) not necessarily so. b) I'm already starting to make my lost money back.

That's quite a range!

Dude! I read the same thing! It will be a frozen point in time for today's spoiled generation. 30 years from now it's going to be, "Where were you when you first heard that Michael Jackson died?" "...uh, I heard he had some good CD's...uh...I think I cried for days...yah, I think that's what happened....wasn't he one of them dudes at Woodstock?" Like, uh....I can see the comparison! You do the math: JKF, widely beloved world leader, untimely, shocking and horrible demise: Jacko, sold a bunch of records, could walk backwards, and his best friend was a monkey named "Bubbles".

It was always my understandin's that the feller who posts here as "Peter Puget" is none other than the Index regular and rock-cop (at least from my experience), Darryl Cramer. Now that just be what I been told, and if I'm wrong, you're welcome to to correct me and no offense to that Cramer-dude if he ain't P.P. an he can have some o' dis:

Who are they? Sport "climbers".

Too bad, dude. I'll take any opportunity to promote my "ideology". It has never failed to befuddle me that someone of your insight and sensitivity can't understand why your own dubious notion of environmentalism is in fact not just stupid, but rather stupid, e.g. unhibited drilling for personal satisfaction at the expense of the finite rock resource. Whose the "f-tard"? to use your own crass terminology. Look in the mirror. Can't answer your question, dude...I don't know what a "chidred" is. I don't....because it's lame.

Banning pope? Dat weak sauce. I happens to know that the feller has had some good trips in the mountains lately on a bike, had a few beers, and wanted to share his enthusiasm. I've got to agree with him: jackass, worthless "forums" such as "cafe sensitivo" and "pirates" are a stinkin' waste of space, better replaced by single forums on related mountain subjects such as burly mountain biking and backcountry skiing. I was with him and Fairweather, albeit on running foot, during last week's mountain adventure and it was awesome. (we call it a "huck and run"...they huck, I run). Check out his TR: Suntop Mayhem It ain't as if it's going to be a slippery slope to a forum on scrapbooking or such, and they are sure as heck more relevant than "for the fathers", "happy birthday kevbone" and other pathetic topics. And then the pirates thing with a grand total of 99 inane threads....the old "arrrrrr" joke can only go so faaaaaaaaar. Dang bill-dude...you make sense...for once. A while back, I posted pictures of myself doing the first ski descent of the West Face of Grand Central Tower at the Peshastin Pinnacles. The ski taboo has already been broken. Awesome Ski Descent of Classic Leavenworth Rock Climb Wrong conclusion. As I've stated above, he was enthusiastically drunk. Like you've never been drunk and enthusiastic? Pyramid Thunderhead IPA. And no, I wasn't there, egging him on. I have finer tastes: A special place where those who promote or condone their special exceptionalist version of the "leave no trace" philosophy can thrive and continue to convince each other that the emperor is actually wearing clothes. Good times? Whatever In short, pope be just trying to share da love and open a few minds to some more mountain fun...Ban him? that's up to the moderators, but in the meantime, he coming over to my house in's about 10 minutes to drink some Thunderheads and watch some climbin' videos.

Hey intolerant pseudo-hippie...they're as much entitled to their own view of truth and love as you are. Most that come by my house are quite pleasant and as far as Starbucks is concerned, their money is as green as any other customers. Lighten up. (And guess what...some of them look pretty darn slick/lovely in the "fancy clothes" you seem to mock. Yeah? But what if they were pleasant foreign sport climbers in fancy clothes? Pleasantly dressed = pleasantly dressed. Nothing wrong with that. However, if sport-climbers knocked on my door and claimed that they were environmentalists, they wouldn't get a glass of juice and a sandwich, I'd edumacate them on what a bunch of hypocrites they be, and send them down the driveway, or better yet, to Olympia, where they might have better luck.

Hey intolerant pseudo-hippie...they're as much entitled to their own view of truth and love as you are. Most that come by my house are quite pleasant and as far as Starbucks is concerned, their money is as green as any other customers. Lighten up. (And guess what...some of them look pretty darn slick/lovely in the "fancy clothes" you seem to mock.

"DeChristo": If you're referring to "pope", you need to sit down, little man. Pitifully pompous prat. If your aim is to defend another, bolster that person's strength rather than posture to shield weakness. Quit treating the guy like your bitch, Dogberry. On topic: My perception, generally, is of rock grades being more soft since the advent and proliferation of grades beyond 5.9+. My estimate is one full grade higher on many routes up through 5.11... and on the two .12s I've climbed. Who believes any of your BS, anyway? Now take your seat...

Right, because if you don't know Kimmo, he can't really be a climber. No, dude...it's because his manner of discourse seemed very, very familiar. (And what does having a double avatar have to do with being or not being a climber? I never said this guy wasn't. There are/were several folks around here with multiple "avatars", some who were quite the active climbers.) Looking for company?

You complainin'? I wished they'd all go away! Who needs the company?

Nope...ain't my thing. You're going to have to troll elsewhere for your like-minded excretory-fascinated brethren. First evidence ever that you were my "buddy". "Kimmo"'s a joke and probably someone's double avatar. yah...I guess that's why I'm a well-published author writing books just for the likes of you. Perhaps you didn't show up that day in art history class when the professor lectured on the the symbolic nature of imagery...I guess that requires, first, going to college....oh never mind. You are, however, welcome to attempt to interpret, with all your assumptive wisdom, what the following might have to do with the nature of sport-climbing:

gee RumRy, I could really care less if sport grades are soft or whatever...I'm only involved in this topic because I stick up for my friends, in this case, a) Donini, a former boss of mine and an alpine master b) "pope", my long-time climbing buddy, and a very good climber indeed. Do you stick up for your buddies? or do you stand by and watch while they get peed upon? Got any buddies?

There's a seat waiting for you right next to DeChristo. Now go climb back into your cubicle and make some money for the boss, li'l feller.

Pope...your memory is fading...you told me about the whole 5.11+/bowline thing happening at Little Si (I still have the pm), you even told me the route name (Aborigine)... Who believes any of his BS, anyway? "DeChristo": If you're referring to "pope", you need to sit down, little man.

Dude....if you're going to do it, do it right! Who are they cheering about? You got only two choices:

You pegged yourself as a "noob" with the comment about "this donini fellow". Maybe your climbing has been more "off" than "on". "This Donini fellow" be the man twenty + years ago and then some, and he still is. Do some research. Check it out for yourself. [Try "Google" for starters.] The Kevbone [predicatable and meaningless] Mantra!

Jim Donini is probably manlier than most everyone on this site and it STILL is his day.

I doubt it. But as you might expect, there have been a number of flings, some ending rather badly, and some busted up pre-existing marriages.

Classy! The latest manifestation of the cc.com salute...make sure you show it to your boss. Cap'n Caveman and company throw it back at ya.

does she climb hotel room walls?

That's called sport-climbing.... I've been hit by falling rocks three times. 1) cut up my hand - which I was using to protect my unhelmeted head 2) cut up my forearm - which I was using to protect my helmeted head from a direct hit. 3) The worst incident was a rock accidentally kicked down by a cameraman on a film project I was working with. It was the end of the day and we were rushing to retrieve the fixed ropes where they were anchored to a ledge at the bottom of an easy chimney. Although we normally wore helmets, we didn't bother this time because we were in a rush. The camera-guy was about 15 feet above me when he knocked this rock down about the size of a coconut that landed on my coconut. I almost blacked out which would have resulted in falling onto a sloping ledge and over a 150 ft. drop. Big concussion, out in a remote area ontop of a cliff, bleeding, getting dark, yada yada....although I was a mess, we did retrieve the gear and managed to stagger a long ways out to the desert where a vehicle was waiting. Survived the incident and was fine a couple of days later but I still have a big dent in my skull. Lesson? We were too much in a hurry to bother with the 10 seconds it would have taken to put the helmets on in an area of loose rocks and that's when the incident occurred...we thought it was safe because we had already done "the dangerous stuff" earlier that day. In this case, the helmet would have made a real difference (it probably would have cracked the helmet...but it would have absorbed the blow.)

Is this the first book published by the Mountaineers to feature "the F-bomb"?