chelle

Thanksgiving isn't for for a few more days, can we hold off talk of X-mas until after that...

Clean out your closets and help someone stay warm this winter.

You guys need to head outside and take advantage of the stagnant air over the PNW. It'd be nice for you to find a distraction from today's spray fest that seems to be spreading outside that designated forum.

A couple years back another poster on this board recovered his stolen rack from a woman who called his phone number that he'd written on a piece of the gear she found on her lawn. Pays to mark a few piecs of gear with contact info just in case.

My longest commute was taking a bus from the Richmond Dist to downtown in SF. Less than 4 miles distance and anywhere between 45 minutes and 1.25 hours. I moved across the Golden Gate Bridge to Mill Valley and the 16 miles (and waiting in line to pay the toll) took only 45 minutes reliably. Once they insititued the prepay electronic toll lanes the commute was 30 minutes. Now I commute 15 mintues form home to work here in Seattle.

Only if you work a traditional week... Sunday was my Monday and yesterday was my Friday. Today is the start of a weekend. First time I have 3 days off (no school, no work) in a row since August.

I think the mods for access must have been out playing. I've asked the spray mods to move this thread to access.

MisterE. I agree with Arch. Season 1 & 2 were great. I felt like an addict. Season 3 was ok. We stopped watching about 2 discs into season 4. It's been about 2 months and I was thinking of picking it up again now that I have more time to watch tv, but this thread reminded me why I stopped. Thanks.

That was part of the logic behind helmet rules I believe. Public health policy. I'm curious of the civil libertarians views on public health policy regarding avian flu/anthrax/other pandemics. Should the government be allowed to mandate behavior, or should we trust that all citizens will act in their best interest? Actually I believe the government can mandate your behavior in the case of pandemic or bioterrorism threat. It was a quiet little proposal that passed after 9-11 and the feds encouraged all states to adopt some form of plan on how they would contain "outbreaks". I don't recall the specific codes but there was some discussion in this forum a couple years ago. The governor of the state would basically declare martial law and it would be a crime to not comply with requests for health exams, vaccinations, limitations on physical movement or travel... As for the smoking ban, Chuck it is not just about lowering health care costs. It is about improving the health of the overall population. Tobacco smoke contains some 5000 chemicals and upwards of 50 known carcinogens. Second hand smoke has the same chemicals as first hand smoke. In effect if you hang out in smokey places or a smoker resides in your house you are a passive smoker NOT a non-smoker. Your own health risks are the same. Cancer (many forms not just lung), stroke, heart attack, increased cholesterol levels, asthma, emphysema, chronic bronchitis, GERD, and many others. These are not fun problems to deal with and may not be evident for many years after exposure. The issue's not about private property rights, economic parity with tribal business establishments, etc. It is about public health.

Sorry you got hurt Joel. I wish you a speedy recovery. BTW Griz... Maybe the nurse's aide or students could help with a sponge bath, as the RNs tend to delgate that task so they can concentrate on more complex aspects of a patients care.

I was only there for 9 days about 5 years ago and stayed in the area around Lk. Taupo on the N. Island. I thought the food was amazing. Most places we ate at were healthy and organic just because that was normal there. I thought is was kinda interesting that the deer they had on venison farms behaved a lot like our cattle herds.

There is also some good climbing up north in Chang Mai. Haven't been there, but I saw an interesting looking guide book at Feathered Friends in Seattle about a month ago. Another route to Ton Sai is to take a long tail boat from the harbor in Krabi to West Rai Lay (maybe 150 bhat if I recall correctly) and then walk to Ton Sai. About a mile. You'll get a sense of the whole place and will be able to stop off in one of the climbing shops in Rai Lay and get a guide book. I'd recommend picking up some snacks for your pack in Krabi. You can get a pound of cashews for about $2 and bananas and other fruit too. Eat the bananas & pineapples there and you'll never settle for another piece of fruit from Dole... If you're not wanting to stay in the grass bungalows with mosquito nets and have a bit more money to spend, upgrade to a cinder block bungalow with a fan for a couple more hundred bhat. Book for a few days at a time and renegotiate with them for a cheaper deal each time you "rebook". Have fun!

Enjoying my b-day with friends.

How about Tuesday Dec 6th?

Maybe it should be since it's all about rock climbing adventure.

Bronco - we had a similar summer of climbing adventure... I climbed one afternoon at a local crag. Spent most of the summer working to support my broke student lifestyle. Got in some good hiking in the rain and ate lost of berries. Had a fun vacation checking out the Bella Coola Valley and the sights along highway 20 in central BC. Organized my climbing gear when I moved and thought about next summer when I will hopefully get to use it again.

We've needed to rent them every year. Do it before you leave town... Getting a tap was kind of a pain last year.

Murray - I thought this was going to be about some new webcam you installed on the roof of your store or that had been mounted on the deck of the Brewery. When is that going to happen?

No surprise. I found this part interesting. Especially the use of the word alternative referring to sources for oil, not "energy" as stated. If they (and the three previous administrations) poured half their efforts into investing in real means of alternative energy we might not be in this predicament today.

The New York Times September 28, 2005 Interior Secretary Says U.S. Will Push Search for Energy By FELICITY BARRINGER WASHINGTON, Sept. 27 - Interior Secretary Gale A. Norton said Tuesday that after the two destructive gulf hurricanes that battered the nation's energy heartland, the Bush administration would intensify its push to expand energy development on public lands including the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge and in the nation's coastal waters. "The vulnerability of having all the energy supplies and refining and processing capacity in one geographic area reinforces the idea that we need diversity of supply," Ms. Norton said in an interview. Citing government reports on the increasing demand for petroleum and natural gas and the sustained high prices that tend to result, she said, "The hurricanes have brought more attention to the fundamental issue." While Ms. Norton took no position on a Congressional proposal to end a 25-year moratorium on oil leases on the outer continental shelf and to eliminate internal departmental appeals of administration decisions to lease public lands, she did not reject its approach. She said she had read only a two-page summary of the measure, which is before the House Resources Committee, but she was open to the idea of alternative energy development on public lands. In a wide-ranging interview in her spacious, wood-paneled office, the secretary - one of the few Cabinet members to serve since the opening days of the Bush presidency - spoke of what she deemed the flaws in the Endangered Species Act and of her worries about restrictions on some activities in national parks. But she carefully sidestepped any endorsement of final solutions. Ms. Norton's remarks came at a time of intense debate over efforts by Congress or the administration to reshape longstanding laws and policies on matters within her department's purview, among them oil leasing practices, protection of endangered species and management of the national parks. But while cautious about endorsing legislation or making new policy pronouncements, Ms. Norton left little doubt that she would continue her efforts to reshape the policies and practices that have restrained private interests - be they energy exploration companies or the makers of recreational vehicles like motorized water scooters and all-terrain vehicles - that seek greater access to public lands. Craig Manson, an assistant interior secretary, who joined Ms. Norton for the interview, defended the review of national park management policies. Permissible "impacts" on park lands, Mr. Manson said, are confused with impermissible "impairments." "Footprints are going to be made if people are in the parks," he said. "But that's not necessarily an impairment." The 1916 law creating the park service, known as the Organic Act, says its purpose is "to conserve the scenery and the natural and historic objects and wildlife" of parkland and "to provide for the enjoyment" of these in a way that "will leave them unimpaired for the enjoyment of future generations." Citing this law, Mr. Manson said, "It's important that there be a balance between the two aspects of the mandate." He added, "From time to time those two aspects sometimes get out of balance." The "bulk of the work" of the current rewrite of department policies set in 2001 - a rare occurrence, as rewrites are not usually done so frequently - will be handled by "park service management," Mr. Manson said. A draft revision of the management policies that govern more than 390 units of the park system produced sharp denunciations by the National Parks Conservation Association and a group of retired park employees, who said it was catering to commercial interests, like the manufacturers of often noisy recreational vehicles, at the expense of conserving park resources. While saying that the revisions were a work in progress, Ms. Norton did say that she found it hard to see how noise, like the noise of recreational vehicles, impaired park resources. "Sound is an instantaneous issue," she said, adding: "There are things that need to be dealt with in terms of the enjoyment of current visitors. Clearly, current visitors are the ones impacted. But we tend to lump all of that under impairment." Construction of cellphone towers, Ms. Norton said, is not necessarily deleterious to park landscapes. "Cellphone towers are an issue," she said, "but the scale of land use of a cellphone tower is a very tiny impact. We have some cellphone towers that are disguised within buildings, or fake tree cellphone towers. There are ways you can do it without impact." The two officials took no stand on the rewrite of the Endangered Species Act that the House is scheduled to consider Thursday. But they made clear their openness to the act's two major proposed changes. The first would replace the current process of designating areas of "critical habitat" deemed essential by biologists for the recovery of an endangered species with a slower and less binding process of identifying "specific areas that are of special value to the conservation of the species." It also proposes the use of financial inducements to win landowner cooperation and the reimbursement of landowners who, because of the law, must forgo economic benefit their property would have provided.

What kind of climbing trip? For a several week expedition, I've bought through Backpacker's Pantry on the web. Most stuff these days comes from the local grocer (Trader Joe's or the Thriftway). For car camp trips to Squamish I just buy food up there...

What I heard... Shut down because of failure to pay taxes, 3-4 years ago maybe. Much of the stuff was sold off a couple summers ago. The tavern itself was for sale for awhile. No idea what the status is.

What an accomplishment! Congrats on the ascent, but mostly on the safe return. Glad you guys came back to tell the story.

The Gokyo Valley/Khumbu Valley trek is very beautiful. Allow 18+ days.

Here you go people...A thread for you to organize a Smith Love Fest, 3rd Annual I think. Have fun. I'll be in the thick of my final quarter at school and won't be able to show. Somebody kick bunny face for me. I hate that climb.