Dwayner

Can Big Lou be the protagonist?

Words of wisdom from an alpine master whose identity shal remain unknown: "All your base are belong to us." Check it out: http://www.planettribes.com/allyourbase/AYB2.swf

Who's buyin' the Mickey's?

Prof. Dru: I don't recall seeing you at any of the two pub-thangs I attended so maybe you're Iambone, Dru and Peter Puget rolled up in one. Me AND pope will certainly show up at one of those beer things in the near future when he's done with his gig in Ellensburg in a week. Then you can appear, too, count to two, and see two people. For real! Can't vouch for "Donna". After the crap she's got from this list, I doubt she'll appear, although I'll ask. (She doesn't live around here anymore so that complicates scheduling matters.) Dang! Such skeptics! And you probably don't believe in the Easter Bunny either! - Dwayner

Charles...back off, amigo! Me and pope suggested to our girly friend that she adopt the cyber-name "Donna Top-Step" because she wanted to post stuff on the internet without worrying about spooky dudes. I actually came up with the name myself some time ago for funny purposes and she thought it sounded good. "Donna" whose initials are L.S., ain't so bad. I heard from her yesterday. She's probably been scared away from the crappy replies she's gotten on this board. You laugh, my friend, but if you met her in person, I think you'd be drooling worse than pope used to. So knock off the half-baked speculation and crack open a nice cool quart of Mickey's! aloha, Dwayner

Never climb with your "X"? pope not only climbed with his "X", he took her on his ridiculous "Cirque Expedition" a couple of years ago! (The EX in question be a certain Miss "Donna Top-Step".) If I recall, they had a serious falling-out perhaps two months before the trip but they went anyway. pope, at the time, was thinkin' with his li'l head, the timeless wisdom here being that THE LITTLE HEAD DOESN'T HAVE A BRAIN. I've heard both sides of the story and it seems that pope was lookin' for some base-camp booty with his "X" and got rejected BIG-TIME! Donna ain't so bad...I don't know why she's so disliked by the cyberalpinists, she's actually kind of a sweet girl but I guess I should comment on that elsewhere... P.S. Did I mention that she's hot??? Sorry, D. if you're reading this!

"Never climb higher than the summit." "A marmot never soils it's nest", i.e., get your dang skull and crossbones water bottle and your zip-lock bags outta here and do your business outside!

Beer is good...Everett too far...getting thirsty...Everett too far.... Have fun tonight...and a special "you go gurl" to birthday princess Lisa, a "you really kinda fun and interestin'!" to Jules, Dynamite and the (artist?) girl with the short black hair from New York, and a hardy alpine high-five to Beck, Fast Eddie, Matt, Dr. J (who says he ain't gonna be there), Alpine K, Big Lou and my other righteous climbing brothers too numerous to state in my Mickey's-induced lunch-time stupor. With the salutations out of the way, here's the big question: WHERE IT GONNA BE NEXT WEEK? How's about back in Tacoma (where the previous turnout was small [but quality!]) or somewhere in the middle like Ballard again, which might be a fine central location for those in the north and south. You have fun, now. No more flying off bar stools, no punch-outs, and remember to collect your credit cards from the bartender before going home. And let the sober dudes drive or you be having Dr. Jay puttin' stitches in your miserable, achin' butt! aloha! - Dwayner

quote: Originally posted by dane: As far as making climbers look like wussies, HA! who are you to make such a bold claim.] I am "Dwayner" and am entitled to my own opinion. Who the heck are you? quote: You dare to even think to compare this to climbing or climbers, we are nothing alike (although I won't speak for all climbers).] Not intended to be a bold or daring statement, just an opinion, which I stand by. quote: I think you need to think a bit more before you post. When I think of some of the great climbers of past and present, it makes me think all others are mere mortals, including your hero! I thought plenty about it. I've been climbing for almost 3 decades. Guys like Lance Armstrong should be pointed out to climbers as an example of athletic excellence. He's in the news, I'm pointing it out. Have a nice day. - Dwayner

Two words for you, Mr.Puget: Eschew obfuscation. Nothing personal but your posts read like the contract I just signed. Maybe you're a fellow academician in which case you are excused because it is part of your culture. aloha, Dwayner

Why can't some of you people just enjoy the fact that a great athlete pulled off a magnificent triumph? I see this disturbing trend often in mountaineering...lots of distrust and skepticism of other's accomplishments. What does that have to say about the critic? Where's the specific evidence? If I had to go by what I read on this board, I could come up with some pretty dysfunctional speculation about the climbing "community" in general. It used to be that false accusations had serious consequences. I guess that's just not the case anymore? Face it. Lance earned it and is a far better athlete than most of us will ever, ever be, even if we were doped up on super-enhancers. - Dwayner, shakin' his head sideways.

quote: Originally posted by Peter Puget: My sense is that many of the traditions in climbing are as outdated as these two examples. While they may help to connect us with a romantic ideal their continued irrelevancy only contributes to ongoing conflict and controversy. My sense is that Mr. Puget's sense is wrong. What I see having taken place in the last nearly 30 years is a "devolution" of ethics, so to speak. The concept of "clean-climbing" in the early 1970's was actively promoted as an environmentally superior alternative to the thoughtless banging of pins and drilling of bolts. I agree and I see nothing irrelevant about it even though it is now "old" and "traditional". The argument against sport-climbing and grid-bolting WILL continue. - Dwayner, going out to his haul bag now to polish his hex's and stoppers and wash his white painter's pants.

If you watched "Le Tour", on OLN, they had a great commercial. It showed Lance about to get blood sucked out of his arm for a drug test. The voice-over is Lance himself: "People always want to know what I'm on. What am I on? I'm on my bike...six hours a day!" After a variety of scandals, these guys are regularly tested. Suggesting that people are using drugs for athletic enhancement, i.e. cheating, is a very serious accusation. If they find any drug residues in Lance, it's probably residual nasty stuff from large doses of chemotherapy, and not from the banned substances. Give the guy a break! No need to disparage his victory by making that stuff up! - Dwayner

I've said it before and I'll say it again: Lance Armstrong makes most climbers look like total king-size wussies! (For those of you not following the Tour de France, he won his third in a row yesterday, just a few years after being booted off his Euro-team for committing the offence of getting cancer which not only affected his private bits, but had spread to his lungs and brain!) He and his competitors raced in 20 stages, most of which were more than the equivalent of peddling at full speed from Seattle to Leavenworth over Steven's Pass EVERY DAY!!! What's the point? I can grab infinitely more inspiration from a super-strong heroic guy on a bike like that than from a dozen hang-doggin', beta-miming, pre-placed quickdraw clippin', three-week-long rehersin', yogurt-for-dinner suckin', "5.14d" sport-primates. And so can you. Choose your heroes carefully. Very few of mine have much if anything to do with mountaineering but I can draw on their excellence, nonetheless, to encourage me to want to excel in climbing and other pursuits. That's just my opinion, spray-fiends. aloha, Dwayner P.S. Lance Armstrong makes most climbers look like total king-size wussies!

Brother All-Thumbs: Soloing on glaciers is generally foolish. I'm very surprised that some folks here seem to be almost encouraging the practice to someone who claims not to be a climber. Wait until you have one or two or more experienced partners (preferably at least two others at your stage of the game). It doesn't matter how wildly experienced or inexperienced you are, if you punch into a crevasse unroped, there is an excellent chance that it's all over. You'll be famous in 5,000 years when your carcass is discovered by some jackass archaeologist such as myself. Even if some nearby folks happen to see you disappear into the icy depths (and if you're soloing, you can't expect anyone to rescue you - it's a self-reliance thing), you might be dead from the fall, wedged and inextricable, etc. In my opinion, there isn't much of a discussion here. Find some fun buddies who know what to do (including crevasse rescue which you, likewise, should be knowledgable about) and if you can't arrange that this year, the mountain should be there for you next summer. aloha, Dwayner [This message has been edited by Dwayner (edited 07-27-2001).]

Went to beer night Tuesday in Ballard. Highly recommended. Full of celebrities from cascadeclimbers.com...MattP, Alpine K, Lisa, Jules, Dynamite, BECK! and many others, each and everyone a star in my book. (I mean that!) Dang! I thought I was attending the Cyber-Emmy's! I thoroughly enjoyed meeting each and everyone of you and I highly recommend the experience to some of you others. Show up and meet some great new pals! Thanks again for the nice evening, groovy guys and groovy gals! 'hope to see you again soon although Everett be a bit far to drive for us Tacoma denizens! aloha, Dwayner

Any of you studs/studdettes doing RAMROD on Thursday? (it ain't what you think, pope, it's a grueling bicycle challenge . Ride Around Mt. Rainier in One Day). Look out for the Croquet Guy! I'll be running CAMROD again with the croquet mallet between Longmire and Ohanapacosh so don't run me down. If you're a climber, yell "Googookaju" - much better than "did you lose your ball?" to which I will answer, "Ask Lance Armstrong." When you pass my support guy, world-famous So. Cal. climbing dude "Denis Erectus", you may yell at him. Call him Mr. Erectus or variations thereof, or "Sport-climber". He will be seated in a lawn chair reading a book (or trying to chat up tourist-babes) in front of a car waiting for me every few miles to hit a ball through his cleverly placed wickets. If I'm successful, I get some Gatorade and a small snack. Yah, it's a weird thing to do, but it's an annual tradition. So if you're doing RAMROD...have a great ride and no matter what you think, riding that bike is a heck of a lot harder than running with the mallet during my traveling croquet game. See you on the road! - Dwayner

Hey Bolt-Monster! I assume that your post was written with the intent of great sarcasm given your nom de plume and such, but actually, apart from your allusions to profanity and violence, you have poetically summarized much of how I feel when I see grid and retro-bolting. Laugh if you wish. Thank you, Dwayner

Hey! What with that Tuesday beer thang, folks be spoutin' 'bout? Went last week and met some of my righteous alpine bru-tha's. For those who might be interested in such a thing, what's the plan? Some dang deal in Seattle or what? Beck! Aren't you in charge? - Thirsty Dwayner ...dang! noon already! time to head for the 'frigerator and get my breakfast sixer of Mickey's!

quote: Originally posted by offwidthclimber: thanks for the clarification Jman. as long as you've never used any fixed gear then i guess you can say what you do without being a hypocrite. ever use slings to rap off? however, this whole conversation is still lame. it's been hashed out here over and over. this regurgitation of the issue isn't going to change a thing. The issue here isn't personal hypocrisy. Whether one has or hasn't ever clipped a bolt, banged a piton or even drilled a line of bolts is not the point and doesn't disqualify anyone from such a debate nor negate their opinion. The debate must continue here or elsewhere. I shall do so because I hope to sway climbers to a cleaner ethic, especially those new to the activity. As has been stated many times before...we figure it out, or "the man" WILL step in eventually. I don't think that too many of us want that, even though I am confident that they will side with my view. This "regurgitation" IS changing things. It inspired some folks to erase a dubious bolted line placed on a traditional route on a traditional crag, and in the aftermath, more people are considering the issue from its various facets. I'm sorry that you don't appreciate that. Also, Mr. Offwidth, rappeling off slings doesn't permanently harm the environment. Slings can be readily removed and their color can be selected to be less unsightly if aesthetics is a big concern. aloha, Dwayner [This message has been edited by Dwayner (edited 07-23-2001).]

Brother Yossarian: The environment is everyone's business. Personally, I think environmental ethics in climbing have gone down the toilet in the last thirty years. As I've stated before, the clean climbing revolution that occured in the 1970's, and which resulted in the further development of chocks and the invention of cams, was a revolt against the permanent alteration of the rock. The introduction and eventual normalization of sport-climbing has seemingly thrown that notion out the window. Many people seem to think that drilling a line of bolts to create a sport route is some sort of real contribution to human progress. Climbing in general is pretty darn insignificant in the big picture, but if we're going to do it, we should at least respect the rock, and leave it nice for future generations. I assume that everyone packs their garbage out of the mountains rather than glueing it the side of the rock or leaving it shoved in cracks? By the way, there have been some great statements about the negative bolting from the likes of Doug Scott, Yvon Chouinard and even Rheinhold Messner. If I can collect these, I'll probably post them together somewhere on the internet. My two cents....for the moment. - Dwayner

Who cares if the original first ascent used knifeblades. The fact is, it went CLEAN well before the new bolts were added. Perhaps all bolts should be removed from sport climbs that can be protected clean. There would go half the attrocious bolts at Vantage! Or how about Numbah Ten at Index, a climb regularly aided on small gear (so it's known that protection can be placed) but some "big-shot" thought he'd do the world a favor by adding a line of bolts so that IT WOULD GO FREE!!! HURRAY!!!! "The rock is permanently damaged but I free climbed it and didn't pound any pins!!! Maybe I'll get my name in a guide book and people will think I'm COOL!!!" WE CALL THIS BOLTING STUFF PROGRESS????

I applaud the removal of the DDD bolts and from what I can gather from the assorted comments, the fellows involved are interested in doing a good job of it, that is, a restoration rather than a mere hacking. At the bottom of this issue is the matter of ideals. Would you like to leave relatively pristine crags for future generations? Or would you prefer to permanently deface the rock to satisfy your ego in the present? (or lack of desire/ability to lead a challenging route cleanly in this case). This act sends a statement that should cause us to think before bolting a) traditional routes on traditional crags b) bolting anywhere else. If you don't want to lead cleanly at Castle or anywhere else, top-rope it. And if you fall, you're dangling anyway, just like a lead on a sport climb. When I started climbing (1973), every bolt drilled was a major ethical decision because we were fully aware of the permanence of the act. It was also the time of the clean-climbing revolution, where pitons and bolts were being shuffled out in preference for gear that would not damage the rock. (See the essays in the Chouinard catalogs of that era for some truly progressive thinking.) With the coming of sport climbing to our shores, this sort of important environmental ethic has seemingly gone to the wayside, and so many new climbers are acustomed to thinking that bolting wherever, whenever is the acceptable norm. (The guys who bolted DDD should have known better.) I don't have any hot tips on how to fill holes with granite dust or whatever, but methods of restoration would be a worthy subject of investigation. My only complaint is that they damaged the hangars which I think should have been returned to the owners to emphasize the point that this isn't hacking, vandalism, or theft but an ethical and environmental statement. Sincerely, Dwayner P.S. Good job, guys, but a little quiet dignity in the aftermath would keep the spray-monkeys more at bay, and would also reinforce the notion that you are making a serious statement. Also: Quit bitching about the price of the crowbar, it cheapens the issue. I'll gladly reimburse you if that's a real problem. [This message has been edited by Dwayner (edited 07-20-2001).]

Sir Daniel, mi amigo! I ain't admittin' to nothin' much. Let me have the dignity of "outing" myself when and to whom I please. that's why a bunch of us have phony names around here...it's not necessarily to absolve ourselves from the responsibility of our own "spray", but to add a little fun and mystery and to protect ourselves from the scary guys who might take our banter too seriously. That's all. O.K.? Here's the scoop: I'm a professional male model married to a daughter of a former President and am Lance Armstrong's private trainer. I am also ambassador to the United Nations representing Spire Rock in the General Assembly. There...I think I told you too much already. - dddddddddwwwwwwwwwaaaaa....whatever!

You wanna see a REAL man? Lance Armstong, all American, is now placed 3rd in the Tour de France. You wanna see a guy make all of your 5.14 sport climbing/peak baggin'/big wallin' heroes look like total pansies? Watch him smoke through the Pyranees in the next few days. I've never been into that bicycle racing scene myself although I do the mountain biking and triathlon stuff occasionally so it ain't like I'm promoting my big sport. I just started watching this stuff this year and some of the guys are amazing and inspirational not matter what sport your concentrating on.