Will Jesus make me a better climber if I pray?

[Off_White]

Its only spray if you all choose to treat it that way. The question of whether a spiritual practice can contribute to your climbing ability is not without merit.

 

I'm a flat out atheist, so its not a path I'm likely to explore. Still, a lot of climbing is in your head, so it makes sense that the other things going on in there will affect your climbing.

[summitchaserCJB]

climbing itself is what it is for the person; it doesn't have any intrinsic objective reality.

Gotta call post-modern BS on you. What are you referring to? You don't think climbing has objective reality? hmm...

[Bug]

I grew up in a religious family. I love my family members, but I was unable to jump on the religion bandwagon. I tried, went through confirmation and everything, it just didn't make sense.I believe religion is the opiate for the masses.

 

People who believe in, and want, an afterlife are too weak to handle the fact that we die. Period. Enjoy it while you can, as you could get run over by a car tomorrow.

 

That being said, I do think the ten commandments are a pretty good idea. If more people followed the golden rule, the world would be a better place.

 

Will prayer help your climbing? You have nothing to lose by trying, but reading Arno's book might be a better use of your time.

 

Sorry if I offended any religious people out there, but I think that far too many people have died (and are still dieing) in the name of religion. Can you say the crusades? The middle East?

 

And yes, this should be in spray

Spray is where some of this should be.

Some of it does have connections to climbing at least for most people.

Who does not feel the power of a sunset over huge mountains?

Or the deep satisfaction of performing at your peek or even beyond?

If we devolve into a debate over whether or not Jesus lives or whether Catholic, Islamic, or some other theology does or does not hold the key, we only detract from what seems to be common to most posters in this thread; There is something powerfully uplifting and life enhancing about climbing.

 

[jmace]

wanting to be better at something is selfish.. not neccesarily the activity you want to be better at.

 

What happens if I pray to be a better climber so that my friends will have a better time because we will summit, then its not selfish its for everyone. Would that work?

 

 

[Kimmo]

climbing itself is what it is for the person; it doesn't have any intrinsic objective reality.

Gotta call post-modern BS on you. What are you referring to? You don't think climbing has objective reality? hmm...

 

we were talking about what climbing is to individuals, and that relationship is subjective. of course the act of climbing itself is objective, to the degree that we all can agree on some identifiable event actually occuring. but, i suppose that the relationship between humanoid and any given event is perhaps objectifiable, ie it can be reduced to scientifically identifiable markers. but, i suppose it can be argued that science itself is subjective....

[gyro]

I'd rather be in the mountains thinking about God, than in Church thinking about the mountains.

 

I enjoyed this comment. The mountains have always felt like my church and crucible more than any brick and mortar building made by man.

[marc_leclerc]

wanting to be better at something is selfish.. not neccesarily the activity you want to be better at.

 

What happens if I pray to be a better climber so that my friends will have a better time because we will summit, then its not selfish its for everyone. Would that work?

 

 

haha! I don't know.... I guess if it wasn't for you.... but you theoretically, God would know what you 'really' want deep inside. In other words, you oculdnt just say its for your friends and trick him like you try and trick another person...

[ivan]

i am only an atheist when i'm not under a serac

[Doug]

If you go to church that's that much less time you have to climb and train. Hence you will be a worse climber. End of story.

 

I'd rather be in the mountains thinking about God, than in Church thinking about the mountains.

 

:tup: :tup:

[Bug]

Chairman Moderator, please ban Ivan for sinning in the wrong forum.

And paste a sticky star to KKKK's avatar for the post of the day.

 

We climb for different reasons.

We hold our beleifs for different reasons.

We post for different reasons.

But we are all more alike than unalike.

Edited January 28, 2010 by Bug

[summitchaserCJB]

Oh yes, opinions.

[chirp]

The only thing I get out of this thread is how many people seem to be unable to spell the word believe properly.

[Bug]

The only thing I get out of this thread is how many people seem to be unable to spell the word believe properly.

Perhaps that is why you are not sponsored.

You are too busy re-arranging the i's and e's to see the bigger picture.

I recommend Isha Yoga.

It is a scientific methodology for connecting mind, body, and spirit.

There is a beginning course offered starting Feb 10.

My climbing has definately improved as a result.

 

Here we go................

[Kimmo]

My climbing has definately improved as a result.

 

even with the weight issues? powerful stuff, that eesha yoga.

[Kimmo]

btw, isn't it ishta yoga?

 

[markwebster]

climbing well, (getting in the zone), and hiking far out in the backcountry has made me feel as close to something larger than myself than anything else i've ever done.

 

I can remember solo hiking up by Mt. Daniel, 4 days in from Stevens Pass and looking around a flat level plateau up by that old abandoned mine. It looked to have been done with road graders, but it was all rock, and all natural. A house sized rock sits in the middle of the plateau. I realized there was something much bigger than myself going on up there. I was as important as a grain of sand in the greater scheme of geologic time.

 

When you can set yourself aside, and see the big picture, it can feel like a "divine moment". Perhaps that is why they created wilderness, so us non-believers would have a church.

[Dirtyleaf]

Now there is not a whole lot on the subject of climbing and religion that I have to say or comment on. It's already been done for me. Thanks. I HAD to go to private school up until 5th grade. I HAD to go to church at least 3 times a week on top of that. Well, not one to be told what to do I quickly found ways of getting attention. Bothell Police Department. Fighting my peers. Smoking in front of the classroom door when I was told to "cool off outside" I got suspended a few times. Then, when I found out for myself that I didn't really give a shit about any and or all organizations, groups, other people, etc. In comes drug use. Spiritual? Those long 20plus hour days in the mountains filled with hardship, and constant struggle. Those days of near perfect synergy with your climbing partner when words really aren't necessary. Or, (what I did) was figure that shit out with acid trips, and many years of hard drug use. Hunter S. Thompson laid the path for me. I've read most of his books. Gonzo. So, I still don't believe in a higher power but more of a connection with all things living. (Im not a fucking hippy)

[Dirtyleaf]

So, I stopped all the drugs after about 5 solid years of using on a daily basis. The day I got off of the methadone program was the same day I went to Darrington and climbed exfoliation dome. Now all I do is climb, think about getting a job, moving, and school, and training for climbing. That's about all I need. If I can't see something, I won't take your word for it. I'll need to find out for myself. Which I did. Thanks for playing.

[telemarker]

I think Jesus can help you quit smoking.

[ivan]

don't know about climbing, but jesus appears to have the miraculous ability to trim my most erudite comments on the subject out of this Very Important Thread

 

how was the thread about the Invisible Dude in the Bathrobe not spray to start?

[rocky_joe]

spray yet?

 

jesus is from israel. there is no climbing in israel. jesus knows jack shit about climbing. jesus can't make you better at climbing.

 

pretty sure Buddha is the guy you're looking for. Seems to do pretty well for Sharma.

[ivan]

spray yet?

 

jesus is from israel. there is no climbing in israel. jesus knows jack shit about climbing. jesus can't make you better at climbing.

 

pretty sure Buddha is the guy you're looking for. Seems to do pretty well for Sharma.

i disagree - the Good Book clearly states our Dear Lord and Savior could walk on water - certainly then he must be a fucking force to reckon with on ice then - his buddy moses was a known mountain climber too

 

to stay on topic, evidence clearly shows having drive and determination can allow you to do fuck all anything - look at joe simpson (atheist pig that he is) - if you Believe, you can't be killed!

[Dirtyleaf]

This is exactly where I was hoping this thread would end up. I've talked to climbers who said something like "God gave me the courage to..." Ok. Fair enough. I'll listen to almost anything you say without talkin smack back. But, I find myself going back to the days walkin' the downtown seattle streets at nighttime scorin dope. FUcked up scenarios abound. whatever. I lived through it. Now, however, I go back to That mindset when I climb. It's my personal memory bank of the dark side of the force. It helps to put all emotions, feelings, etc. aside and put forth. I think even Jesus would agree. I've taken some decent whippers because I forgot I was climbing and I started to feel happy at the pretty mountain scenery. What a dumb way to fuck oneself up or die. Get twisted. Accept the anger and hate. Happines+Love equals stupid fucking mistakes.

[G-spotter]

 

jesus is from israel. there is no climbing in israel.

 

wrong

 

they got limestone in the main part of the country and granite in sinai

 

http://www.mountainproject.com/v/international/asia/israel/106564255

[Bug]

This is exactly where I was hoping this thread would end up. I've talked to climbers who said something like "God gave me the courage to..." Ok. Fair enough. I'll listen to almost anything you say without talkin smack back. But, I find myself going back to the days walkin' the downtown seattle streets at nighttime scorin dope. FUcked up scenarios abound. whatever. I lived through it. Now, however, I go back to That mindset when I climb. It's my personal memory bank of the dark side of the force. It helps to put all emotions, feelings, etc. aside and put forth. I think even Jesus would agree. I've taken some decent whippers because I forgot I was climbing and I started to feel happy at the pretty mountain scenery. What a dumb way to fuck oneself up or die. Get twisted. Accept the anger and hate. Happines+Love equals stupid fucking mistakes.

So, you climb well feeling anger and hate but climb poorly when you are happy?

Did I get that right?