MSR vs. Jet boil

[mzvarner]

i have the reactor, but am looking at the PCS. Its lighter, boils the same amount of water and it does it faster. you can even get all kinds of extras like a hanging sytem or frying pan. Whats the rest of the community think?

[olyclimber]

they differ most in how much they weigh and how fast they will boil at altitude. those are the two must specifications i aware of.

[Syndicate]

The reactor is a bad CO source, according to tests on backpackinglight.com. Not an issue for most backpackers, but for a climber where it will be used in a tent this is certainly a concern. Obviously you will ventilate anyway, but there is no reason to expose yourself more than necessary.

 

I own a PCS and use it year round boiling water and melting snow. The fry pan is extremely difficult to use, but with a LOT of care you can make pancakes. Just remember that this thing is really only good for heating water or making pasta.

The hanging system works perfectly and I have never had a spill with it. It holds the pot on by nature of it's design, so even if it gets bumped or the wind shakes it around a bit, no trouble. The hanging setup also supports the larger GCS pot, which I use for snow melting.

I have operated my Jetboil successfully in -36 centigrade in my tent using the hanging kit. The heat from the stove keeps the canister warm.

 

 

Your other option if you are a winter climber is the MSR Windpro, which you could use in your vestibule if you wanted. I own one but much prefer using the jetboil.

[Maxtrax]

For use in fair-ish weather or in a tent the Jetboil is great but if you are using the stove for brew stops the Reactor will significantly outperform the Jetboil in windy conditions. I can't remember the exact numbers now but at a certain level of wind (I think it was around 12-15 mph) the Jetboil's boil time had increased by ~6 minutes whereas the Reactor's had increased by only around 15 seconds. Also the Reactor actually has a big enough pot to be useful for melting snow for more than one person.

[KirkW]

Don't know about the CO issue (it hasn't killed me yet and I've used it in a vestibule dozens of times) but I've had a Reactor for about a year now and my only complaint is the cost of the fuel vs. white gas but that same complaint would also apply to the Jetboil. And the damn empty canisters that are a pain to recycle. Other than that this is hands down the BEST stove I have ever used. Perfect size for two people, fastest boil/melt times available of any stove on the market. Consistent boil times (doesn't drop off nearly as bad as other canister stoves when it nears empty.) Good build quality. Absolutely AMAZING in the wind...I could go on and on.

 

One of my climbing partners has a Jetboil that we used for over a year before I got a Reactor. We haven't used his Jetboil once since then.

 

The only reason I would go with the Jetboil would be if I was doing a lot of solo stuff as it is smaller and you can pick a used one up pretty cheap on the web now.

 

Good luck with whatever you choose but in my mind there is NO comparison between these two.

[layton]

Don't know about the CO issue (it hasn't killed me yet and I've used it in a vestibule dozens of times) but I've had a Reactor for about a year now and my only complaint is the cost of the fuel vs. white gas but that same complaint would also apply to the Jetboil. And the damn empty canisters that are a pain to recycle. Other than that this is hands down the BEST stove I have ever used. Perfect size for two people, fastest boil/melt times available of any stove on the market. Consistent boil times (doesn't drop off nearly as bad as other canister stoves when it nears empty.) Good build quality. Absolutely AMAZING in the wind...I could go on and on.

 

One of my climbing partners has a Jetboil that we used for over a year before I got a Reactor. We haven't used his Jetboil once since then.

 

The only reason I would go with the Jetboil would be if I was doing a lot of solo stuff as it is smaller and you can pick a used one up pretty cheap on the web now.

 

Good luck with whatever you choose but in my mind there is NO comparison between these two.

 

Agreed!

[Dhamma]

dude if you have the reactor WHY are you looking at the jetboil. jetboil sucks for climbing. they dont work in the cold. the one i had (returned to rei) failed in the wind at 10kft on shasta last spring. its great for fairweather stuff, but completely unreliable and frankly dangerous for the cold/wind. if my buddy didnt have a whisperlite we would have been in trouble. the reactor is the SHIT

Edited November 23, 2009 by Dhamma

[JoshK]

I dunno, Jetboil seemed to work just fine in cold temps a couple weekends ago. If you do get one (not sure why if you have a reactor), you can make a great hanging system for it with a bit of cord and a few zip ties. I don't know about the Reactor's efficiency but I am amazed that the fuel can I started using 2 trips ago still has fuel in it despite hours and hours of melting snow. You can get a kit that allows any standard pot to be used on it. I got mine as a present and if I ever need to replace it, I'll look at the Reactor, but on it's own, the Jetboil seems pretty cool to me.

[Dane]

I have a Reactor. Been using it for winter climbing for 3 seasons now, generally in pretty cold conditions. So far I think it sucks. Going back to a pump and white gas.

[DanielHarro]

Pump and white gas is better, as far as canister stoves I used mine a fair bit and brought it to AK last spring and it worked super well. If I needed a stove for winter I would get the Reactor for sure, much better (pot size) for melting snow. As far as the CO issue goes I recall Colin and Rolo getting mild CO poisoning with their jetboil on their The Torre Traverse....you need to be careful with any stove.

[Dane]

Daniel (or anyone using a Reactor) are you doing anything special to up the efficiency of the Reactor?

 

Still find it hard to believe there is no striker built in?

[DanielHarro]

Dane-

 

I sent you an email.

 

And as far as the striker goes I have had bad luck in the past with those damn things, seems like they are not reliable if they get wet so I always brought a lighter anyways....

[BigSky]

I've had a heck of a time with the jet boil in the cold (sub @ 20 degrees). If it wasn't so convenient it wouldn't ever make my kit over much light canister options.

The low psi that the reactor can run at makes a pretty good difference for cold weather use (compared to the jet boil that is), but it's just plain heavy/bulky.

[Crack]

Dane -I'd love to know why you think the Reactor "sucks", and why you would continue to use it for three seasons...

 

 

[goatboy]

The piezo ignition is just extra junk to carry and pay for, in my mind. Wouldn't you carry a lighter anyway in case it fails?

 

Also curious about Dane's question about increasing efficiency on the Reactor. The thing is ridiciulously fast and efficient, in my experience, more so than anything I've ever seen. Maybe you have a "lemon," Dane? And why would you use it for three years if you hate it so much?

 

Curious, curious...

 

My review: The Reactor is outstanding. But I have heard of folks asphyxiating themselves by using it in closed spaces. So be careful with it. It's a killer!

[dbb]

The Carbon Monoxide (CO) issue applied only to the first generation of the Reactor, and only when the stove was run at less-than-max gas flow level. They fixed that issue pretty quick.

 

There are two key differences between the two:

- The Reactor runs at a lower PSI for the duration of the canister (instead of an effective variable psi like other stoves. this is why in a lab test the jetboil is "faster". the real world tests show otherwise) This gives consistent performance over the entire canister

 

- there is no exposed flame with the Reactor, so it works well when exposed to wind

 

There is a 3rd party aluminum pole hanging stove thing for the Reactor btw.

 

Those things said, they both have their uses. Reactor is great for alpine climbing, cold, etc. I like the jetboil for tossing into the pack on a ski trip where we want to have a quick brew up. I find that the jetboil is also handy in a small tent because it attaches the pot to the stove... until I kick it over of course.

[Dane]

The Reactor is one of the better cartridge stoves around.

IMO the Reactor is not a winter stove dispite MSR's claims. White gas and a pump still rule.

 

Much to like about the Reactor and I do like it...but.

 

Fact is all cartridge stoves are poor performers in cold weather...unless you set the cartridge upside down or can heat the cartridge. MSR's Iso/Pro, better than anything else, works to about 20 degrees. Most winter climbing is done well below those temps.

 

I use almost a full can of fuel for two of us at every dinner meal/rehydration. More if we have to melt snow for everything.

 

Anyone else using this much gas?

 

8oz of fuel in a 12oz can. 4 oz of wasted weight just in the can. MSR says 80 min. per can. Seems about right from my own use. Gas and pump stove would half that time cooking.

 

From REI's comparison numbers:

 

Reactor will boil 10 L of water on 100g (4.5 oz) of fuel...so I should get 20+ L from one cartridge. You don't get anywhere near that in cold temps or working from snow.

 

Dragonfly will do 6.7L. Cold temps or hot. It is consistant.

 

As we all know the paper story isn't the entire story.

 

I've been using cartridge stoves for lots of years. (as well as white gas/pump stoves) Only way I've found to make a cartridge stove work well in cold weather is to play Russian roulette. You add a heat exchanger....and doing so is DANGERIOUS!

 

I had hoped the Reactor might have solved the cold weather problem...but it has not.

 

Daniel Harro's heat exchanger shown below. Photos posted with his permission. I've use'd something similar made from cooper wire pounded flat. Looks like Daniel's idea would be more effective. Trick is you never know just how hot the cartridge is with this method. Anything over 120 is not a good idea. Over heated cartridges can make a real mess of things.

 

A heat exchanger and a insulated cover for cartridge and pot are what I would use in really cold weather. YMMV don't try this at home:)

 

 

 

 

I like how small and easily carried the Reator is. Yes there are smaller stoves. But the big advantage for me of the Reactor is the size of the pot. It is all about hydration in winter. Not like anyone here has ever for got their lighter right? I like having a igniter on the stove...left unused till needed.

 

 

[KirkW]

Yeah...you're right...heating the cartridge is key. I use a "squishy bowl" with a shot of warm/hot water and empty /add as needed to keep the fuel warm. I store the extra with me in the bag.

 

This thing beats the shit out of white gas setups when it comes to using it on ledges or in other awkward places. I don't have a hanging setup yet but would like one. Wind has very little affect on the stove. I won't say none...but very little. I've used it down to 0 degrees F and as long as I kept on top of warming the fuel it was no problem.

 

I haven't used the dragon fly much and I'm sure for expedition or longer alpine climbs white gas would be the way to go because the canisters are pricey and a pain in the ass sometimes. But for most of the things I'm doing in OR and WA it KICKS ASS!

 

[Dane]

That is the ...shit! Thanks

[KirkW]

And you can eat your oatmeal and drink your coffee out of it. Steaming rubber bowl of soup or instant mashed potatoes makes a pretty sweet hand warmer too! They work as advertised. (the cup is too small IMO and is worthless)

 

http://www.google.com/products?rlz=1C1GGLS_enUS344US344&sourceid=chrome&q=squishy+bowl&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=rEUoS47nMJHWtAPd87G4DA&sa=X&oi=product_result_group&ct=title&resnum=3&ved=0CCkQrQQwAg