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RodJ

New Smith Rock '09 Supplement - 200 'new' routes

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A new publication featuring 200 'new' routes not found in the 1992 Alan Watts guidebook. The park is broken down into 9 areas. Routes are shown on over-head maps on each of those areas. Also included are a glossary, a list of common climbing commands and important/relevant phone #s & websites.

 

You can get your copy at any of the following locations: Redpoint, Rockhard (both Terrebonne), Mountain Supply or REI (both Bend) for $9.95.

 

$3 from the sale of each supplement goes to the Smith Rock acct. of the ASCA to be used to pay for hardware to rebolt routes at Smith Rock.

 

For more info contact: felsen428@yahoo.com

 

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200 'new' routes not found in the 1992 Alan Watts guidebook.

How many of those not found in the old red supplement?

Edited by Drederek

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100. Ryan Cafferky (formaly Lawson) granted me the route descriptions from his 2001 supplement contingent upon all monies earned beyond printing costs ($4+), expenses ($1-) & retailer cut ($2),($10-$4-$1-$2=$3) going to the ASCA.

 

The problem I had w/ his '01 supplement was that I couldn't find many of the routes - that was my motivation for the over head maps. I rounded up an additional 100 'new' routes. I also printed this with a more durable (but more expensive) laminated cover & included some infomational/educational content in the hopes of reducung the number of injuries due to ignorance. I hope people will find the extra cost of my new supplement reasonable & affordable.

Edited by RodJ

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This supplement is quite a let down. Its mostly just copied text from the internet, loosely put together with Ryans 01 supplement. With Watts new book heading to press this supplement will soon be a lost cause. It seems the me this was thrown together over a night of browsing the smithrock.com site and just copying text, and coming up with a couple of topos dawn in MS Paint.

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Also included are a glossary, a list of common climbing commands

 

"send it, brah! SEND IT!"

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Dam, I wish I had that a couple weeks ago. We tried to find this climb, 5-gallon something?, but ended up on Solar instead and having to place some crack thingys.

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Corvallisclimb: I’ve been checking my e-mail for input from climbers that I could use to improve the Supplement. I haven’t seen anything from you.

 

When Ryan’s 2001 supplement came out, I was excited to have beta on 100 new routes. Even thought it wasn’t a Falcon Publishing quality publication, I didn't whine about it, I was just happy that someone was doing something to give us new routes to climb. His supplement has been out of print for 5 years now (i.e. unavailable). My supplement is a major step-up from Ryan’s in every way (2X the routes, maps included, much more durable cover, useful info). This may not be as pretty as the 'Select' book & Rock Climbing Oregon, but it is also not a rehash of Watt's old book - these are all 'new' routes.

 

I used 3 books, 4 websites & ~20 climbers to gather info on new routes. I had to rewrite many route descriptions, create over-head drawings from scratch & figure where all 200 of the routes belonged on the maps. This turned out to be very challenging & time consuming. Not a single route description was cut & pasted from any website or book other than SmithRock.com.

 

This was supposed to be a quick project – it wasn’t. I’ve ended up spending 250+ hrs. & there is no end in sight. I improve it every week & every printing. I bill out @ $60/hr. – that’s $15,000 in lost wages for me over the last 2.5 months. I am not making a penny off this effort – all $ above costs are going back into the park. I’ve already sent $300 to the ASCA, with a couple thousand to follow before year’s end.

 

This book was intended to get people through until next year when Alan’s new book comes out (Nov. 1st @ the earliest (as of this week)) – not to compete with it. The supplement retails for under $10 & isn’t loaded w/ ads or any kind of BS. I didn’t go the sponsor /advertiser route because I wanted to put out a bare-bones guide only, w/ max info in min space.

 

If this supplement improves people's climbing experience at Smith even for only this year, then it is not a lost cause. I wouldn't call the ~$2000 that it will generate for rebolting projects in the park a lost cause either.

 

Since I don't know you, let me ask you a couple of questions: 1) If it is such an easy thing to do, how come nobody (specifically you) has released anything like this other than Ryan? 2) How many publications do you have out of any kind?, 3) How much $ have you contributed to the ASCA or equiv.?, 4) What have you done for the betterment of SRSP & it's (or any) climbing community?, 5) If the answers to the questions above are zero, then who are you to criticize my (or anyone's) work?

 

 

Shapp: Clearly, everyone knows where 5 Gallon Buckets is, even though it wasn’t in the original Watt’s book. Does that mean I should not have included it?

 

 

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Corvallisclimb: I guess I could have written my initial reply in the following more condensed form:

 

If you already know where all 200 of the routes in my supplement are & the quality of the publication doesn't meet your high standards - don't buy it!

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RodJ-

 

It looks like I might have seen an earlier edition, the first you dropped off to Jeff at RP. I saw another one last night that I thought looked a lot better. I don't want to come off as knocking it too hard. I think I've probably done enough in that area that I can criticize your work. My only real problem is how alot of it is just copied off the internet. But good on you for compiling the information it for those that need it. Also I'm sure all the donations are much appriciated. I look forward to seeing how you let it evolve through each printing that is a cool idea.

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RodJ

 

I appreciate any efforts on anyone putting together some sort of publication to provide beta on new routes. I haven't looked at this new supplement, so it's hard for me to judge.

 

 

But i would say do some research before calling out Corvallisclimb on what efforts he provides to Smith Rock. He is a valuable asset out there, doing a good part of the shitty anchor replacements out there, and then some. The answer to most of your questions would make you feel silly.

 

but thanks for all your lost wages.

 

JL

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CC: I appreciate your reply.

 

I did have a number of 'beta' copies out that I had printed on my printer @ home designed to get feedback from the climbing community before I printed the real thing - I did leave a copy with Jeff/Redpoint. I may not have gotten them all back. The routes in those beta copies DID have route descriptions strait from the websites. I later discovered, after meeting with a lawyer for the first of 2 times, that I couldn't use their descriptions (copyright infringement), so I had to re-write all (except those taken from SmithRock.com (Mike Volk was kind enough to give me permission)). This applies to route descriptions taken from books also (what few there were).

 

I was out all day on the East side & will be incorporating a few tweaks after I am done here.

 

My partner & I were thinking of trying to talk the State into matching funds to put up a rope bridge between the N. Point & the Student Wall - what do you think? If they go for that, maybe we can get one between RDD & the main area.(?)

 

I just read a couple of recent posts regarding who you are - who are you? Please send me a PM & let me know. If you are someone who will be making use of the $$ that I generate, I would be happy to help you when-ever/if-ever you need it.

 

Rod J.

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RodJ, you clearly do not get the irony in my post.

 

I've been climbing at Smith since a little before the Watts guide came out. I can still find climbs in the Watt's book that I haven't done, and get on something new nearly every time I go that is in the 1992 book, which isn't that freqent anymore.

 

I am sure glad you got something going to "keep us going" until the new book comes out.

 

Nice sobb story on the wages, a lot of us out there in the climbing world spend a lot of time maintaining the crags and putting up new routes and never seek any conpensation or complain about lost wages.

 

Please do not persue a bridge at N. Point. The walk over is barely a stroll as it is. What a waste of money that would be. I would much rather prefer a wetbar at the base of the Westface Variation, or access over the aquaduct bridge!

 

"Even thought it wasn’t a Falcon Publishing quality publication" that is some funny shit, linking "quality" with "Falcon publishing". They turn out the biggest piece O crap guides I have ever seen, after being Smooted in Washington, Bolf and Ruefed in Oregon, and I don't know what in Arizona

Edited by shapp

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Shapp:

 

Since I didn't recognize your irony & sarcasm, please stick to directly saying what you mean (when communicating w/ me anyway).

 

I'm probably not as good a climber as you, which means that I don’t have as many options when it comes to the old Watt’s book – I’ve exhausted pretty much all of them. If the old Watt’s book is still doing it for you after all these years, then don’t buy my supplement.

 

If someone else would have put out a supplement w/ a bunch of new routes within the last 5 yrs. (since Ryan's supplement went out of print), I would have jumped at the chance to get my hands on a copy.

 

I guess you missed the point of my "sob" story. I’ve been accused by a couple of people of making $$ off this effort & secondly, not giving all proceeds above costs to the ASCA. I was just making it very clear that this was/ is not only not a profitable project, but a costly one. Yes, many make sacrifices for the cause & I was/am happy to make my contribution to the good of the community - I just don't want my efforts (& motivation) to be misconstrued.

 

As far as the proposed bridge is concerned, tell the family of the guy who just died crossing the river, that a bridge would be a waste of money. I see this as a good time to get a bridge in there. I will consult w/ others in the SR climbing community & the State Park officials first & see what they have to say, if you don't mind. If you want to let me know who you are, I will be sure to share your idea for a wet bar as an alternative.

 

A Falcon published book is a higher quality publication than mine (although I’m striving to improve mine with each printing).

 

All I want to do with the book is to benefit the climbers @ SR & raise some $$ for the ASCA to be used @ SR. The intention of my post on this forum was to notify climbers that a new supplement was/is available for those that are interested.

 

I’m tired of the attack & defend BS, so I won’t be wasting any more time justifying this project. However, I still welcome legitimate requests for information as well as constructive comments, & will continue to respond to both.

 

 

 

See you at the crags.

 

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RobJ,

 

I do not own the guide yet but plan on picking one up next time I head to SR. Thanks for putting all the work into the book and getting something updated out. Yes we keep hearing about a new guide book for SR for many years now, I will believe it when I have one in my hands. You did something about it, thanks. Some of us don't have time to look for all the places for new routes that are not in the red book.

 

As for the bridge at north point, I agree there is no need for it. That guy was a freak accident. Some one had other plans for him. It is such a long approach as it is, ya right. Are craggers that lazy?

 

Thanks again.

 

 

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no need for a bridge. some of us badly need the exercise. also the approach helps to keep that part of the park a little less crowded.

 

good luck on your guidebook project - if you need something to spend all your profits on, I'm sure there are a ton of erosion control type projects out there that would be worthy (i.e. the walk off from the backside of Koala Rock, just to name one such potential project).

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rod,

i would love to see a complete list of the routes you have put in this 'supplemnet'. can't be to hard as it's a simple copy and paste. my concern, as you know is misinformation put in this 'guide' of routes that you have never or will never get on. while i'm not saying this is fact, i'd love to hear the percentage of routes you've actually climbed compared to how many are in the guide. for instance: would you call something 'unknown' and then proceed to give it a rating and gear beta? are you exposing new routes without making any effort in contacting the fa party? some of my routes on the smith rock group, i've worked on for years and would not appreciate you haphazardly putting them in the guide without even contacting me; beyond that they are NOT ready for the general public.

 

i've pm'ed you about this and called you and still do not know the answers. one more thing: if you're calling out tyler on what he has or hasn't done at smith then you are probably not the person that should be writing this 'guide'.

 

mark

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Letroll & Dan:

 

Thank-you for your input on the bridge idea. I value this kind of useful feedback. The erosion control idea sounds like a valid alternative.

 

MarkD:

 

The following is the reply I sent to you exactly 40 minutes after you PMed me:

 

"I don't remember ever hearing or seeing your name. To find if any of your routes are in my book, you will have to buy a copy & look. I don't have a list of which routes I got from Ryan vs. other sources (books, climbers, websites). If you only gave your new routes to Alan, then I shouldn't have any of them in my book. Alan has been helping me with the accuracy of the info in my book. I would love to be able to include your routes in the next release. This is a constant update/upgrade process.

 

Call me if you would like to talk further: 541-------- or e-mail me directly @ felsen428@yahoo.com.

 

Rod"

 

Sorry I didn't call you back last night. After I got off work it was midnight on the East coast.

 

The only routes that I included in the SRG of my supplement, not from Ryan, where from Mike Stoger & Jim Ablao. I am not able to send you a complete guide electronically (nor would I if I could), but will send you just the SRG section for your review.

 

Your question of routes climbed is a reasonable one (so I counted them) - 97. So, basically half. The other half were taken from climbers, books & websites. After I had compiled everything (& even after the initial beta version that covallisclimb saw) & just before the initial printing, I had numerous climbers review it. Here is a partial list of those who gave me significant feedback @ that point: David Potter, Jim Ablao, Ian Caldwell, Ryan Cafferky (Lawson), Calvin Landrus, Aaron Lish, Pete Keane & finally Alan Watts.

 

I didn't try to hunt down who did the 1st accent on any of the routes, that is way beyond the scope of this book. That in itself would probably take years.

 

I believe that there is only 1 'unknown' route left, & that is in name only.

 

I will never get on anything above an 11b, so I rely on feedback from better climbers to correct or confirm those 'harder' routes. Inside the front cover I request feedback & list my e-mail address. I know this book still isn't 100% accurate (& I make note of that in the disclaimer), but it's very close as of today.

 

So, when you get back, if you are so inclined & you do not want to buy a copy, I will loan you one to review.

 

Rod

Edited by RodJ

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Ryan Cafferky (formaly Lawson)

 

Did he get married?

 

I don't know - sorry.

 

Rod

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Re: the young guy that tried to cross and lost. I don't swing around Smith Rocks anymore. But when I was still in my young and crazy daze, I, nor any of my friends were ever tempted to ford the river in that location in the spring. I feel sorry for the young mans family and friends, but this was a poor choice.

 

Not that most of us haven't made and survived poor choices.

 

A bridge would not be a welcome addition.

 

Retired Rock Ape

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No on the bridge. I'll go talk to Julian myself as you obviously have no idea what the hell your doing out there. Putting in a bridge because of the accident is absurd. How about a mandatory prussik back-up on all rappells?

 

 

This guy having anything to do with park input or representing local Smith Rock climbers is scaring me.

 

 

JL

 

 

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