foraker Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 I can't even grok how they (he/she/it) do that shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 SC-- what a dull world if i wasn't impressed by something. i'm not impressed by much but certainly much more than raindawg. i think the moments in life when you can say "wow, that's amazing" are fantastic. life would be kinda dull w/o them. why does one need to be "impressed"? can one live in such a continuous state of wonder that no single act can dent this? what's a river to an ocean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 as well as watching any olympic sporting event...you know, they don't rehearse or train at all...incredibly talented, aren't they?? there's nothing inherently "human" or "natural" about responding in a particular way to a feat deemed "impressive"; it's a learned, calibrated response based on a shared sense of "values", a values of "appreciation". as such, it's an artifice of sorts, a tangential sublimation of of of.... loneliness? separation anxiety? in order to fit the established patterns of communality. having said that, i take back what i said about the creative, or non-creative, aspects of climb "rehearsal": once it ceases to be a "creative" act, it no longer carries with it the possibility of learning, so any "rehearsed" climb that leads to conventional success (or non-conventional) is inherently and neccessarily, by definition, "creative". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pope Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 I'm with Dwayner. Ethics and style matter more than the grade. Suppose the same gal climbs a route several grades lower in difficulty but without all of the aid climbing. Then I'm more impressed (but still ambivalent since climbing accomplishments are personal in nature and do nothing to impact the human condition). But seriously, 5 months? Let's call it what it is. Five months of aid climbing for one "free" ascent of one pitch. Whatever. Of course it's difficult and that anybody can cling to such nothingness is truly amazing. Impressive and inspirational? Not to me. I'm just confused about why anybody would bother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 Impressive and inspirational? Not to me. I'm just confused about why anybody would bother. kinda like football? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 ...to improve their skills? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grtmtnchic Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 i think the moments in life when you can say "wow, that's amazing" are fantastic. life would be kinda dull w/o them. can one live in such a continuous state of wonder that no single act can dent this? what's a river to an ocean? ...you're almost saying the same thing. A state of wonder and amazement is desirable. Minx was inspired by this achievement - she tapped into it - that's great. Having that feeling continually, tapping into the wonder contained in more mundane things, well that's great too. Impressed, inspired, bewildered...all semantics, and all good. I see your point tho', SC, about the "danger" of being impressed by a single act...there's a lot of ego involved in that. Is it really wrong to find some moments more amazing than others tho'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grtmtnchic Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 Impressive and inspirational? Not to me. I'm just confused about why anybody would bother. kinda like football? Ha-ha-ha! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 (edited) right now i'd be happy to have my abilities justify getting my rack out of the garage. 5.14 anything trad is impressive no matter the gender. raindawg, i just want to know what exactly would impress you? 5 months of rehearsal doesn't. You seem to slag on everything anyone does. Not so. There is a pattern to my discontent. Much of it involves environmentally dubious "sport-climbing" and secondly, it's stylistic practices, some of which have been incorporated into trad-climbing(e.g. hangdogging, seige-climbing - like the above 5 month exercise ). 5.14 trad crack...nice effort; siege climbing, however, doesn't impress me. If you're not into 5.14s, that's fine. Neither am I. I can appreciate the accomplishment in the abstract sense only. I'm not sure why you want to shit on somebody else's parade, but OK, if that scratches an itch. What gets me is that you continue to claim, like an underfed dog chained to a clothesline, how environmentally unfriendly sport climbing is. Really? I was always of the opinion that rock gyms and sport climbing areas 'soak up' the majority of the climbing population, which means they're not tramping around much more environmentally sensitive areas above the treeline. It concentrates whatever impact does occur tiny areas that are, by definition, mostly made of rock, and that are heavily managed anyway. So I call bullshit on your oft spouted theory, Doctor. Sport climbing has been good for vast majority of the wilderness environment. Edited March 11, 2008 by tvashtarkatena Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 (edited) As for training for five months for an athletic contest, I guess you must not get out much, Raindawg. That's the standard training period for the average person to run an average marathon, nevermind something that's never been done before by anyone. It may seem ridiculous to you, but who's now enjoying worldwide recognition within her sport for her accomplishment? Edited March 11, 2008 by tvashtarkatena Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 do you really think she really cares much for the recognition? if so, i'm with raindawg.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 (edited) I've been climbing for almost 30 years and I still couldn't tell you what the word "redpoint" means. Seriously. And I only recently learned the word "take". WTF? Is that like "tension"...or "falling!!!!"? And recognition? Is that what it's all about these days? Sad. I've got nothing against sport climbers or rock gyms, but it is now apparent to me that spending too much time breathing chalk dust in confined spaces has certain negative impacts on higher mental function. Edited March 11, 2008 by Fairweather Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 Don't run too far with the 'recognition' ball, there, puppies. She's getting the recognition. That's a fact. Whether she wants it or not, well, you'd have to talk to her about that, now, wouldn't you. This thread is the first time I've heard her name, so speculate away if it makes you feel better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StreetBoss Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 Hey Rudy..how long did it take Warren Harding to finally send El Cap? Hmm, glad he did cause it opened up so many possibilities. Anyway, I love watching football, what about skiing. I don't begrudge anyone's opinion, the judgmental part is a bit abrasive. I like what Sonnie Trotter and now Beth are doing for gear climbing. So many folks (especially new climbers) are obsessed with the chiseled magazine bois & gurls commenting how easy the 5.12 finish to their last sic route was. Please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 I've been climbing for almost 30 years and I still couldn't tell you what the word "redpoint" means. Seriously. And I only recently learned the word "take". WTF? Is that like "tension"...or "falling!!!!"? And recognition? Is that what it's all about these days? Sad. The term 'take' has been in common use for decades. Given your post, you apparently thrive on a different kind of public recognition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 That's funny, coming from someone who personifies the word ego and started climbing just two or three years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 But seriously, 5 months? Let's call it what it is. Five months of aid climbing for one "free" ascent of one pitch. Whatever. Of course it's difficult and that anybody can cling to such nothingness is truly amazing. Impressive and inspirational? Not to me. I'm just confused about why anybody would bother. How long does a concert pianist spend to perfect one piece of music? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 The concert pianist perfects not only their own being, but brightens the world for others through the expression of their music. Climbing is an almost purely selfish endeavor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minx Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 oh good grief, you people are idiots today. recognition? how did that even become an issue? seems a bit presumptuous since the climber in question hasn't said anything about it. as for the concert pianist brightening the world for others, what a load of crap. anyone who practices and/or trains to do something at an extraordinarily high level is doing it for selfish reasons. personal satisfaction. the same reasons most of us climb. if the world is a brighter place, great. if not i doubt they care. they may be an attention whore and like to perform in front of an audience for the applause...selfish. they love the music and want to perform it perfectly...personal and selfish. who cares what the underlying reason why she climbed it was? it's an impressive accomplishment in part b/c it took that level of practice. i used to be pretty damn good at my chosen sport (which is not climbing). that took years and years of practice. and still does 30+ years later. all of that practice might lead to an occasional performance that was nearly perfect. a mere 2-3 minutes of time and it could take months to prepare for it. completely selfish. no one was getting anything out of it but me. and yeah it could easily take months of preparation and practice before attempting certain levels of competition. sure it was easier after the first time but it could take months and years to get to that point. imo, you're foolish if you don't think this is an accomplishment b/c she "rehearsed" it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glassgowkiss Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 (edited) the fact of the matter is that a lot of posters here doesn't even know what hard climbing feels like. just a bunch of angry monday morning arm chair quarterbacks..... and even if she gets recognition- don't think it's her motivation. it's the satisfaction when you clip the anchor stupid.... Edited March 11, 2008 by glassgowkiss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minx Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 *I* have no idea what hard climbing feels like. and i sure the hell don't want to come off like i even remotely understand in climbing terms what was involved w/doing it. i just think it sucks that some people have to be so lame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted March 11, 2008 Author Share Posted March 11, 2008 as well as watching any olympic sporting event...you know, they don't rehearse or train at all...incredibly talented, aren't they?? there's nothing inherently "human" or "natural" about responding in a particular way to a feat deemed "impressive"; it's a learned, calibrated response based on a shared sense of "values", a values of "appreciation". as such, it's an artifice of sorts, a tangential sublimation of of of.... loneliness? separation anxiety? in order to fit the established patterns of communality. having said that, i take back what i said about the creative, or non-creative, aspects of climb "rehearsal": once it ceases to be a "creative" act, it no longer carries with it the possibility of learning, so any "rehearsed" climb that leads to conventional success (or non-conventional) is inherently and neccessarily, by definition, "creative". dude...you need to lay off the peyote... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 The whole damn sport is a contrivance. There was no reason to climb Mt. Blanc in 1786 and no “need” to start specializing in crag climbing around 1900. We climb crags by a set of rules that we made up to keep the game interesting. Specialized shoes are OK, but we don’t use specialized extensions of our hands. We use ropes as a safety net, but specifically define varying degrees of physical assistance from the ropes as different types of a climbing “accomplishment.” Why is a redpoint different from an onsite? Because we define it that way. Given this, I think it is fair for Pope and Dwayner to say “I’m not that impressed,” but really they are talking about themselves and all of this is really as much of a discussion about how we like to play games on this bulletin board as it is about this awesome climbing feat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 Huh? Tvashie is the one who put forth recognition as a motivation. I was lamenting his glorification therein. Why you be hatin' on me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minx Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 i wasn't hatin on just you. i was hatin on all of the haters who are hating for a variety of hateful reasons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.