fern Posted October 22, 2002 Posted October 22, 2002 there's always a market for used beginner's tools, especially ones that can do alpine duty adequately as well. Just buy something inexpensive and go climbing and figure out what features YOU need. If you don't like them after a while then sell them and buy something else. just my opinion. People were climbing WI4 before I was born with wooden shafted droop-picked shiz and strap-on crampons. You don't need tech and flash to get out on classic moderates. Quote
freeclimb9 Posted October 22, 2002 Posted October 22, 2002 werd. it ain't the tools, it's the climber. No. NO! Cancel that lame idea. Buy into the hype: you WILL climb WI5+ by using the super-twisto bent wonders. Quote
Cpt.Caveman Posted October 22, 2002 Posted October 22, 2002 It sure aint but a little lightweight technology gives the comfort and more boldness than say the hummingbird or Terrordactyls.  Give me the technology. You two can have the seventies bs. Initially I bought the bd prophets. Puke tools in my opinion. I saw the advantages of a good tool. Call it bad technique but I got no shame.  I bet you both use leashes too Leashes are aid climbing foos  [ 10-22-2002, 11:10 AM: Message edited by: Cpt.Caveman ] Quote
freeclimb9 Posted October 22, 2002 Posted October 22, 2002 Leashes? Oh yea. Saved my pitiful life. BTW, ice-tools and crampons are aid. So are chalk and sticky rubber. Where does Olde E and Prozac fall? Quote
fern Posted October 22, 2002 Posted October 22, 2002 good luck trying to find 70s shit. that's not what I meant. If you can find Rages or Rambos or Machines or whateverthef@#$ for a good deal on the InterNet then buy it and just go climbing. You won't know what's best for you 'til you get out there, like you said with the prophets Caveman. Quote
Cpt.Caveman Posted October 22, 2002 Posted October 22, 2002 This is a good deal for a new tool US Dollars Tech wing 138$ http://www.sportextreme.com/pz315x312yUSD/ Â Why get a heavy ass axar or prophet I'd never buy em. Quote
freeclimb9 Posted October 22, 2002 Posted October 22, 2002 I realized that I do have a 70s era axe that I still use occasionally for mountain strolls. It's a 70 cm chouinard piolet that's been flaking its bright red paint since the day I bought it. It's damn scary on ice steeper than 50 degrees. Quote
Greg_W Posted October 22, 2002 Posted October 22, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Cpt.Caveman: This is a good deal for a new tool US Dollars Tech wing 138$ http://www.sportextreme.com/pz315x312yUSD/ Â Why get a heavy ass axar or prophet I'd never buy em. Sweet looking tool, Cavey. Hmmm...Christmas is coming. hehehe Quote
Cpt.Caveman Posted October 22, 2002 Posted October 22, 2002 I'd figure to give advice like it was a good friend here. Â Caveman sez- Buy the grivels, or dmm flys Quote
iain Posted October 22, 2002 Posted October 22, 2002 I got to try some Simond Najas the other weekend and liked them a lot. The grip is very small so my hands were not as tired as with my bd prophets, and the pick sunk with the lightest flick. I actually like the prophets but they are heavy and the grip is wide, and that full-length rubber coating makes it difficult to slide the leash up so I can hit the head to release a stuck tool. I just have the leashes attached to the head now. Funny hearing people call them old stuff since they were top of the line not so long ago. Quote
David_Parker Posted October 22, 2002 Posted October 22, 2002 quote: Originally posted by sisu suomi: "Ice is nice and shall suffice"(B. Sumner) NOT!!!! Robert Frost Quote
gym_rat Posted October 23, 2002 Author Posted October 23, 2002 Cobra costs a sh*tload though, even when bought from europe. Quote
Lambone Posted October 23, 2002 Posted October 23, 2002 still cheaper than buying some Charlet peice of shit, selling them for less and buying Cobras cause it's what you should have bought in the first place... Quote
gym_rat Posted October 23, 2002 Author Posted October 23, 2002 Oh, I won't buy a Charlet-the paint job on the Axar is too ugly. I need a sexy tool, it doesn't matter how it climbs. Quote
Scott_J Posted October 23, 2002 Posted October 23, 2002 quote: Â [ 10-22-2002, 08:35 PM: Message edited by: sisu suomi ] Quote
gym_rat Posted October 23, 2002 Author Posted October 23, 2002 Thanks Lambone. Say, do you need a partner for Colonial? Quote
jaee Posted October 23, 2002 Posted October 23, 2002 Anyone ever tried to use a quark in an alpine setting? I've got a set of Pulsars, which work well for plunging. I tried a bunch of different tools this summer and felt the quarks to be the best (for me, anyway) and ordered a set from sportextreme a few weeks ago. I'd assumed they were too radically bent to use for alpine climbing, but would like to hear if anyone has anything to say about them. They're amazing for me on vertical ice, and I intend to use them mainly for Ouray and waterfall type climbing. Quote
Figger_Eight Posted October 23, 2002 Posted October 23, 2002 I've been using a pair of Quasars for the last few years and unfortunately they blow for alpine. Any of the tools with the radically curved shafts are going to suck for anything other than vertical ice and mixed climbing. Â I got to use the Cobras for the first time last year and found their swing weight to be lighter than I'm used to. If you're used to heavier tools, like the Quasars or Quarks you might find yourself swinging the lightweight tools twice to set them instead of just once. Â Anyways, whatever - they all work. Quote
wdietsch Posted October 23, 2002 Posted October 23, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Cpt.Caveman: This is a good deal for a new tool US Dollars Tech wing 138$ http://www.sportextreme.com/pz315x312yUSD/ Â Why get a heavy ass axar or prophet I'd never buy em. Good deal .... it is a GREAT deal .... Dr. Doom and the boys in Salt Lake would rather you pay the US retail of $240 .... Quote
Cpt.Caveman Posted October 23, 2002 Posted October 23, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Figger Eight: I've been using a pair of Quasars for the last few years and unfortunately they blow for alpine. Any of the tools with the radically curved shafts are going to suck for anything other than vertical ice and mixed climbing. Whatever I use my light machines without a problem on less than vertical ice all the time. I used to think they did not work well on it until I actually tried it. That's what I get for listening to people tell me when and where I could use them. Â [ 10-23-2002, 09:42 AM: Message edited by: Cpt.Caveman ] Quote
Figger_Eight Posted October 23, 2002 Posted October 23, 2002 Â Cavey - if it's this tool you're talking about, you can use it on less than vertical ice for sure. I'm talking about the tools with the fat grips and the lip for the little finger. Burying the shaft in hard snow is a pain in the ass, if you can do it at all. Just my 2 cents anyways. Quote
Cpt.Caveman Posted October 23, 2002 Posted October 23, 2002 I got this fucker and it works on any ice. Just putting doubt into the theories (cough cough bullshit) that radically bent tools with pinky fuckthings aren't good on low angle or alpine ice. IT'S AN ICE TOOL If I'm burying the shaft in snow then I am walking not climbing ice   [ 10-23-2002, 10:00 AM: Message edited by: Cpt.Caveman ] Quote
iain Posted October 23, 2002 Posted October 23, 2002 I think he's saying using it as a belay for boot-axe, or self-belay would be a pain in the ass since it's hard to jam that thing into refrozen or windpack stuff. Prob works just fine with the pick on low-angle though. Quote
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