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First Winter Ascent this Friday


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I'm not sure what is worse:


Crossing the Skykomish in Winter, extracting one's testicles, and postholing on the other side , or getting one's ass ripped open by you guys.


I'll give Jammin this, he has grace under fierce criticism (probably because it fails to register at all).


Just imagine this thread if Arc were subjected party

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Well guys, I am just curious about what you guys would rate class 3, 4, or 5. Do you guys have a table that shows all the stages of the different catergories. I know pup on the mountain, who is an experienced climber, rated things different than me. I always thought of class 3 as something you wouldn't fall off very easily, class 4 as something that you could die on if you made a bad mistake but probably doable without a rope, and class 5 as a something that you would not think of doing without a rope.


I was going through a few pictures of my climbs last year, and I was wondering what you would rate this. I would rate at class 3 using the Fred Beckey system because the handholds were very solid, and I almost certainly would not have fallen because it wasn't bad or anything. However, if I had fallen, I would have not survived. I am sort of confused about this. If the terrain is easy, but there is tons of exposure, what would it be rated as? I think Fred Beckey would rate it as only three. However,some climbers would rate Beckey's class 3 as class 5 due to exposure. So what if you have a section of rock to traverse that consists of a 4 inch ledge to walk on and a few meager handholds but you would only break your leg or get scratched up if you fell, could it really be called class 5 (outside of bouldering).


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This is how I have always known it to be, (Can be subjective though IMO)


C1 hiking

C2 hiking some off trail in more rugged uneven terrain ( I have seen hikers On class 2 that think they are on class 4, quite comical)

C3 some use of hands with some exposure. Could result in injury or possible death. (many folks have died falling from class 3 stuff, Ed from NWhikers, for example, and many more)

C4 use of hands with much exposure. A fall will result in serious injury and/or death (most sane folks will rope up for this)

C5 ropes used, a fall would NOT be good so don't ;)



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Those sound like "hiking definitions". They are wrong.


Class 1 = hiking. Including off trail hiking, screefields, whatever.

Class 2 = scrambling on rock but not requiring constant use of hands

Class 3 = constant use of hands, exposure, but easy enough a rope is not required

Class 4 = shortroping or simulclimbing terrain

Class 5 = technical climbing.


Class 3 and 4 overlap and both overlap with the lower end of Class 5. They are not exclusive definitions.


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Um, well I have been on some routes that he rates as class 3, and well, frankly, I have been scared spitless. Then I learn that it was rated class 4 or 5 by somebody else. I am sort of wondering why this is. I like that Alaskan Rating System.


So g-spotter, why would you rate it class 2 rather than 3. Just curious. :)

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If'n there are rocks, roots, divots, depressions, or other obstructions in the trail I wold automatically rate is class 5 because you could fall out of your wheelchair and die and not make your first winter ascent (FWA), and more importantly, not be able to post about it on the interwebs.

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Pup and I did attempt the Kautz route on the Deer this past summer. I had a great time and we never got close to the summit. Pup got sick and we turned around and headed down the mountain. I had a good time and missing the summit did suck but pup was having problems with the altitude and so the following day we headed out. I messed up the route on the way out and he never bitched or complained... we both got out alive and will live to climb another day. He's a little slow... never bothered me. Made me feel strong :)... Enjoyed the trip and had a great time. Learned lots of beta for the route and would do it with him again... as long a we had an extra day at high camp...... the Kautze route and high camp at 11K is a bitch... he's a good guy and I would climb with him again if he wanted to climb. Good guy.



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