All day high performance trad shoe

[John Frieh]

So my 5.10 Newtons got a divorce (see I lost one ) which leaves me with a pair of scarpa marathons which just got a resole so they aren't as sensitive as I'd like them to be.

 

Shopping for an all day do it all shoe that climbs well... cracks, face, etc etc. I don't plan on downsizing too much as I'd like to cough them into cracks but still would like them to drive well.

 

What are the goods? What is 5.10 offering in place of the newton?

[catbirdseat]

I like my Montrail Splitters. They are very comfortable. They are perhaps better on cracks than face climbing depending on how you size them, of course.

[TrogdortheBurninator]

I am kind of intrigued by the new montrails with the memory foam. The bill some of them as crack shoes, but still say to use a tight fit. I wonder if the memory foam makes jamming with curled toes tolerable.

 

The new women's 5.10 sirens look nice, but there is no men's equivalent.

[John Frieh]

If I am going to climb any crack larger than ~1/2" I try to make sure and wear shoes that my toes are only touching the end... maybe slightly bent... but never curled. If anything curled toes hurts your crack technique... unless you are climbing a crack so small or larger that you aren't jamming your feet.

[tomtom]

The new women's 5.10 sirens look nice, but there is no men's equivalent.

Obviously a sensitive shoe.

[John Frieh]

Anybody tried the 5.10 piton?

 

Edited March 2, 2006 by John Frieh

[NYC007]

I havent tried the piton but I have used the splitter, they are nice but I find them a little soft. I like the FT ascents, climb face ,crack, dont climb ice well,not as still as the tradmasters but I like that about them. The piton looks sweet though.

[DirtyHarry]

What about Mythos, the old standby. I bit soft, but you can get them resoled with 5mm.

[foraker]

Sportiva Tradmaster?

[Dechristo]

kaukulators

[Weekend_Climberz]

kaukulators

 

I miss mine

[crackers]

I don't really climb cracks (don't have any in the gunks and turkey is bolted limestone).

 

with that caveat, 5.10 T-Rocks are great. They're super good for gunks style trad, and i've used them happily for longer days on Cannon in New Hampshire.

[willstrickland]

I'm a big fan of the 5.10 Hueco with the EVA heel pad. Not so much a fan of the model w/o the pad. Comfort is the name of the game with these. They are nowhere near as stiff as a Kaukulator or Ace, but a decent balance between being stiff enough to edge while still smearing well. They don't have the same support as a stiffer shoe, obviously, and no high top for ankle protection. Pretty thin toe profile, comfy tongue, and the heel pad is WAY nice. And they're white.

 

This is the first shoe I reach for unless I'm within a letter or two of my max or bouldering, and I have a decent quiver of shoes to pick from...Sportiva Focus and cobras, Moccasyms, Anasazi lace ups, boreal matrix, anasazi slippers (the blue synthetic ones). Scarpa just don't fit me well.

 

Do they still make that Sportiva high top "beginner" shoe? Those things were killer for all day stuff for the price. I think they were called Enduros or something like that, they were a dark red/maroon. I went through a couple pairs of those as all day shoes prior to the Huecos.

 

I know you said "high performance" but I think you would agree that to gain comfort you will give up some performance. You can always carry a pair of tight slippers for the gnar pitch on otherwise cruiser routes. Mocassyms can't weigh more than a couple biners.

[John Frieh]

Thanks everybody! Good info!

 

I should have mentioned I have never been able to get a descent fit out of la sportiva... I think it's my duck shaped feet but everything I've tried kinda worked but never really hugged my foot like scarpa or five ten. I still might try a pair of mythos on... who knows?

 

I have been looking at the Hueco and T-rock... Reading some reviews it sounds like they tried to replace the newton with those. I'm a little leery of the T-rock because it has the fiberglass midsole for edging... I think that would work against me for hand sized cracks. And the hueco with the foam heel is basically another scarpa marathon for me so I hesitate to consider these...

 

And I completely agree with you Will... one always trades performance for comfort. With that said I think that one can find a balance between the two... both in fit and shoe characteristics. I think something with a slightly pointed toe (somewhere between pointed and completely round) w/ toes slightly bent would climb good enough for me but also wouldn't hobble me for the hike out. That type of toe profile in combo with a thick midsole in a slip lasted shoe and I'm stoked.

 

Does anybody semi local (WA, OR, AZ) stock the tradmaster?

[Squid]

PMS is clearing some out - I think he had a 10 or 10.5 in stock the other day.

[DirtyHarry]

You shouldn't ever own a shoe called the "tradmaster." How gay. But then again, almost all climbing shoes have dumb names.

[willstrickland]

Huecos have been around for many years. They aren't a replacement for the Newton by any stretch. Nowhere near as stiff. T-rock, I have no idea.

 

From what you said above, you might look at the 5.10 "Climbalot" and "Ascent". They have a toe like a slightly relaxed version of the Anasazi, pointed profile but not requiring fully curled toes. One is velcro, one lace up. Both have padded heels, but I think they're gonna be very similar to your Marathons.

 

Replacing Newtons...I don't know if there is anything on the market with a sole as stiff and fat as those things. They're like bricks.

 

Those green anasazis from a few years ago (Mesa? I think) they might be the ticket. Think of them as the "pink shoe" but much, much stiffer. They did have the fiberglass midsole in them, though and you want to avoid that right?

 

If you got the duck feet, Mythos are gonna be a challenge. I have narrow heel/wide forefoot/low vol and could never get Mythos to fit. Most sportiva don't fit me well either, but neither do Scarpa. Pretty much all five-ten these days, even though their workmanship sucks compared to some.

 

Those Mad Rock std lace ups might be worth a look. They're cheap anyway.

[mattp]

Interesting that you would say that your "duckfeet" require five-ten shoes, Will (I realize that is not quite what you said). I have wide feet (I wear double e's), with a relatively narrow heal, and recently I've found some La Sportiva's that fit me better than any 5.10 shoes. I think the key lies in going to a shop where they have lots to try on and a salesperson who is willing to be patient enough to bring you ten pairs even if they may not make the sale.

[willstrickland]

I agree Matt, key is definitely going to a well stocked and patient store. Sportiva builds on something like 6 or 7 different lasts, some are very rounded toe/neutral (e.g. Kaukulator, Enduro) some a tad more narrow/slightly pointed (focus,cliff, mythos), some very cambered/pointy (Cobras, Testarossa). Their website used to have a breakdown of all the different lasts they used, might still be there.

 

I can't wear Anasazi velcros, nor the blue anasazi slippers (got a pair that I never wear), but the pink ones fit me better than any high-perf shoe I've tried, same with moccasyms...best slipper fit I've found, and all four of these are supposedly built on the same last...go figure.

[fern]

Though I have not worn the Tardmasters myself, I climbed for a couple of weeks with a guy who had them in Indian Creek, and while he could jam the hand and wider crax with no issues, anything thinner and the whine-meter pegged out at 10 because they were so stiff he had no sensitivity for small footholds, nor could he do and randsmearing or fancy thin toejamming. I think you could climb just as well in Mountain-Masters for all the versatility they demonstrated.

 

I climbed thru a pair of Red Chili Spirits last season - good all-rounders (somewhat soft), and while the durability on them was so-so, I think in recent years 5.10 is no better but more $$$ because of buying the 5.10 name. The Red Chili Spirit IZ looks a lot like the picture of the 5.10 Piton above, thin natural shaped toe box, cushioned heel. Less rubber over the top of the toe though. That looks like a dumb feature to me, cooks your toes in the sunshine, and you can't adjust the fit.

[John Frieh]

 

Holla! So I sent 5.10 an email to inquire into what they felt was a replacement to the newton and check it! 5.10 is actually going to continue producing the Newtons for EU distribution at least through this year so if you want a pair just call them up. Additionally mtntools.com has some sort of agreement w/ 5.10 to be a US distributor for the newton (not sure if other stores are also doing this)... mtntools won't be placing build orders themselves but will have the opportunity to pull from the EU build orders So basically you can get them from 5.10 or mtntools

 

Bottom line: my pair will be here next week

 

Awesome discussion and great info everybody!

 

mattp: maybe duck feet isn't the best adjective... basically I have a D width (normal for a guy) but the widest part of my foot is roughly dead center of my foot and not at the ball of the foot like most people. Pair that with slightly narrower heels and *blamo* la sportiva doesn't fit me that well. Oh well.

 

Again: thanks everybody!

[John Frieh]

And oh yeah... I hear if you preheat your rock shoes they climb a lot better

[TrogdortheBurninator]

I just picked up some of these from Evil Empire. They feel like the greatest comfy trad shoe ever. Like Mythos minus all the drawbacks like bad rubber and massive stretch. I hope to get out this weekend and will report back. If they suck then they are going back to the store, but I have pretty high hopes right now.

 

http://www.evolvesports.com/DEMORTO.htm

[TrogdortheBurninator]

And oh yeah... I hear if you preheat your rock shoes they climb a lot better

Anyone know if this would work for a thermos too?

[Matt_Anderson]

to bad about la sportivas fitting you well. my favorite all day trad shoe is the miura, the pair that has stretched enough to be ok on comfort.