minx Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 RobBob said: Dave, well said....you know I was kidding ya . Lummox, if you head off into the alpine w/o leaving your wife info on your whereabouts, you're an ass. It's called "do unto others." There was a bunch of sarcasm in an old thread on the subject of climbing with members of the opposite sex, to the effect that "if my wife/husband didn't trust me, then we don't have much anyway." Well after a number of years of being married, I can honestly say that neither my wife nor I want each other traipsing into the backcountry with someone else of the opposite sex, and I think that's healthy and common-sense. Who amongst ye can honestly say that if you went into the woods with an attractive something-not-your-mate, and got sweaty together, that sex wouldn't cross your mind? Let the first liar speak up! i had this conversation with my ISO. it saved a lot of hurt feelings. nothing wrong with saying it publicly as for climbers being dirtbags does that imply that dirtbags in general can't commit or does this go to my theory of that a girl shouldn't date cowboys, climbers or fighter pilots. none of them can commit i've never understood how one could settle for relationship with anyone less than an independent, passionate person. a relationship doesn't have to mean the end of such a life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobBob Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Hey, if I ever fall in that way, even if no one else ever knows, I will have disappointed and disgraced myself in a very bad way. That being said, I'm not going to tempt the fates by putting myself in situations that are both uncomfortable for my wife and remotely risky for me. If it's climbing with a mutual friend, for instance, that's one thing. But I'm not gonna hook up with a cc.com hottie and go climbing. Spray on, the rest of you. I'm done on this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr._Natural Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 exactly what michelle said. my SO does not need my permission to climb with guys and I dont need hers to climb with gurls. if you dont trust each other, maybe you shouldn't be in a relationship? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 minx said: i've never understood how one could settle for relationship with anyone less than an independent, passionate person. a relationship doesn't have to mean the end of such a life. My wife is into rock climbing but no so into mountaineering or the BC ski scene. I have a variety of partners for those trips, including a couple of mutual women friends who are great people and climbers/skiers. And there's no hint of any problems. If you're secure in your relationship and married to an independent and thoughtful person it all works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitten Posted August 26, 2003 Author Share Posted August 26, 2003 mattp said: Kitten, I think you are correct that "climbing is a must in the climbing community." Climbing is kind of a disease; those of us who take to it tend to get addicted and we are likely to become hostile if kept in a cage without an opportunity to climb. I have destroyed prior relationships over this selfish and self-indulgent habit and now am married to a woman who feels neglected at times, but who seems to understand that it is an important part of who I am -- does that make me a dirtbag? Matt~ I think I should clarify. I have met a lot of great people (men and women) on this board. I have also come across my fair share of liars. I don't think that all climbers are dirtbags or that all dirtbags can't commit. It just appears at a distance that commitment to climbing is a more serious act to climbers than a commitment to a relationship. The line between needing to climb to fill the desire/ego is connected so tightly to the destiny of a marriage. Can there be a balance? I want to believe this! I recall a thread about someone thinking they were cheating on thier families by taking big risks - when is the risk too much? Are these standards up to the individuals or to partners in a long term committed relationship? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitten Posted August 26, 2003 Author Share Posted August 26, 2003 David_Parker said: [Yeah Rob, I debated about writing that on the internet. I don't think my wife reads this board, but I decided I wanted to be blatantly honest about what I think to see what kind of reaction I'd get. We Americans seem to always be "hiding" behind our true feelings and not saying what we really think. I do NOT believe in "PC". I find it's just easier to be truthful; it seems to open doors with other people who are initially shocked...or fein being shocked. In reality I'd rather discuss this whole subject in private with you, Kitten or even my wife. I have nothing to hide, but a public forum IS risky. I'm a risk taker though! Dave ~ thanks for stepping up to the plate and sharing your true feelings. It is not an easy thing to do, although doing it on a computer does help. I guess that is why I put the question out there. NEXT QUESTION?????? Do you think it is inappropriate to do weekend routes with the opposite sex without your wife present? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 (edited) I can answer w/ what worx for us (well, me anyway, my wife doesn't really care)... I crag on a daily basis w/ women, but i don't go on weekend trips w/ just one woman (Unless Jdog counts as one )...i will go w/ several women with or without other guys...ie a group situation...but not w/ ONE woman alone (unless its my wife) FWIW...these are self imposed restrictions...my wife did not put them on me...I think RobBob hit this one on the head... Edited August 26, 2003 by RuMR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crackbolter Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 kitten said: I have met a lot of great people (men and women) on this board. I have also come across my fair share of liars. I don't think that all climbers are dirtbags or that all dirtbags can't commit. It just appears at a distance that commitment to climbing is a more serious act to climbers than a commitment to a relationship. The line between needing to climb to fill the desire/ego is connected so tightly to the destiny of a marriage. Can there be a balance? I want to believe this! I recall a thread about someone thinking they were cheating on thier families by taking big risks - when is the risk too much? Are these standards up to the individuals or to partners in a long term committed relationship? Look at the age bracket of climbers. I think you are pretty young for having a husband and kid. Look at your peers. How many share your same situation? Climbers in general are quite independant and many are anti socials. Granted, the best climbers are those who can be successful in ascents yet still hold down a stable family life with a lot of time devoted towards their children. I could name a few names but why do I need to do that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crackbolter Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 "NEXT QUESTION?????? Do you think it is inappropriate to do weekend routes with the opposite sex without your wife present? " Loaded question directed towards husband I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitten Posted August 26, 2003 Author Share Posted August 26, 2003 Mr._Natural said: exactly what michelle said. my SO does not need my permission to climb with guys and I dont need hers to climb with gurls. if you dont trust each other, maybe you shouldn't be in a relationship? This is an interesting point! I wonder if there is a catch??? Is it the trust in the person you question or the situation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Kitten...it is both... Putting your hand in cookie jar is dangerous...one might "fall" into your hand...best to just not even open the stupid thing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitten Posted August 26, 2003 Author Share Posted August 26, 2003 (edited) Crackbolter said: "NEXT QUESTION?????? Do you think it is inappropriate to do weekend routes with the opposite sex without your wife present? " Crack - you may think what you will... This is not a loaded question directed at my husband. I am wondering if others feel the same as I do. I don't see harm in cragging for the day even with only one other person of the opposite sex - in agreeance with rumr. But when it is only two people spending time on an alpine route, sweating, climbing, and hanging around a campfire for too long. That is a recipe for disaster. Humans form bonds with one another whether they mean to or not when given the right amount of time and space. PERIOD. So what is your take? Edited August 26, 2003 by kitten Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunglehead Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 I was married for 8 years, then one night my wife and I got in a fight and she told me that she hated me and never loved me and never wanted to see me again. Moved out that night, and I stopped climbing for 2+ years. She was my best friend. Still trying to figure out to this day if there was anything I could have done to prevent this. (I don't think so) Marriage can be a beautiful thing, but it can slip from your grasp at any time. It's a huge gamble, but everything everybody has said so far is true. Having a loving companion you can trust is Having kids, gettin a house, hashing out which color plastic lawn furniture you're gonna buy, it's a great thing. I'm really happy for people that have that. I think it's great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitten Posted August 26, 2003 Author Share Posted August 26, 2003 RuMR said: Kitten...it is both... Putting your hand in cookie jar is dangerous...one might "fall" into your hand...best to just not even open the stupid thing... So do you ever wonder what kind of cookie is in that jar? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Damn bunglehead...that sux... words that i have spoken in anger have always come back to kick me in the ass...and i'm a hothead so i eat a lot of crow... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 kitten said: RuMR said: Kitten...it is both... Putting your hand in cookie jar is dangerous...one might "fall" into your hand...best to just not even open the stupid thing... So do you ever wonder what kind of cookie is in that jar? all the freaking time...but i'm on a monk diet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 RuMR said: kitten said: RuMR said: Kitten...it is both... Putting your hand in cookie jar is dangerous...one might "fall" into your hand...best to just not even open the stupid thing... So do you ever wonder what kind of cookie is in that jar? all the freaking time...but i'm on a spunk diet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuMR Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 erik said: RuMR said: kitten said: RuMR said: Kitten...it is both... Putting your hand in cookie jar is dangerous...one might "fall" into your hand...best to just not even open the stupid thing... So do you ever wonder what kind of cookie is in that jar? all the freaking time...but i'm on a spunk diet... Ahhh...the sheep f'er has spoken!! So bitch, when you gonna get "hitched" to that fair little ewe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryland_moore Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 It is a very good question? Some days I believe that I am and others I am unsure. What about you? After reading this thread I think I am going to return the engagement ring! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 RuMR said: erik said: RuMR said: kitten said: RuMR said: Kitten...it is both... Putting your hand in cookie jar is dangerous...one might "fall" into your hand...best to just not even open the stupid thing... So do you ever wonder what kind of cookie is in that jar? all the freaking time...but i'm on a spunk diet... Ahhh...the sheep f'er has spoken!! So bitch, when you gonna get "hitched" to that fair little ewe? soon as the fda and usda approve her papers. she is still in quaratine. i shouldve known b4 getting a new(e) wife from briton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitten Posted August 26, 2003 Author Share Posted August 26, 2003 erik said: soon as the fda and usda approve her papers. she is still in quaratine. i shouldve known b4 getting a new(e) wife from briton. You don't fool me erik ~ happy smooth 'sailin' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitten Posted August 26, 2003 Author Share Posted August 26, 2003 ryland_moore said: It is a very good question? Some days I believe that I am and others I am unsure. What about you? After reading this thread I think I am going to return the engagement ring! Sorry you feel that way! I just wanted to get another perspective of what climbers considered commitment towards climbing and marriage. Best of luck - if you're serious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lummox Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 RobBob said: Lummox, if you head off into the alpine w/o leaving your wife info on your whereabouts, you're an ass. you think im married? thats the funniest thing i read in weeks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryland_moore Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 I am being sarcastic, but have had a GF on and off for 3 yrs. The main thing we fight about is me leaving every weekend to go climbing. Or it is hunting in the late Fall, and fishing in the Spring, and then climbing in between hunting and fishing weekends. I just do not enjoy going shopping, or picnicing, or taking walks, or having lazy days. She tells me that, " If you stay at home on a sunny day, you feel like you have wasted that day, when instead you should just be happy that you arer spending the day with me." Are all women like this? Am I being too selfish? Or are we just really different? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitten Posted August 26, 2003 Author Share Posted August 26, 2003 ryland_moore said: I am being sarcastic, but have had a GF on and off for 3 yrs. The main thing we fight about is me leaving every weekend to go climbing. Or it is hunting in the late Fall, and fishing in the Spring, and then climbing in between hunting and fishing weekends. I just do not enjoy going shopping, or picnicing, or taking walks, or having lazy days. She tells me that, " If you stay at home on a sunny day, you feel like you have wasted that day, when instead you should just be happy that you arer spending the day with me." Are all women like this? Am I being too selfish? Or are we just really different? I don't think you are dumb to ask these questions. I agree that we are VERY different and our needs are different as well. I enjoy lazy days and long walks. These are the things that I need to feel connected, appreciated, and closer to my partner. Men do need thier space and time to go climbing, hunting, and get dirty. What is the give & take? Finding the balance is the key issue to maintaining a marriage - along with trust, honesty, and great sex. You asked if you are being selfish - OF COURSE. When was the last time you stopped to think about "what could I say or do that would make my GF really happy?" I bet It doesn't take much. A litttle time and a lot of affection Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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