Mr._Natural Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Ratboy said: Ursa_Eagle said: There was one (H2) in front of me... I tried to see the driver to get an idea of what kind of moron buys one of those things I do this too, and 99% of the time it's yuppies -- usually the yuppie suburbanite yapping on the cell phone. I'd think there'd be more meles than females, consdering the macho/penis thing, but more often it's a middle-aged yuppie woman with perfect hair and expensive clothes. I just laugh because H2s are almost as hideous looking as the Honda Element. hmmm i always try to flash a smile at these ladies in an effort to get their attention. maybe ask them out to a drink or sumpin! i could always stand to be the play thing for some rich suburbanite bored house wife! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratboy Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Two words: high maintenance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleblebleb Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Erik was ratboy's plaything but not anymore because too high maintenance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratboy Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Er, no. Middle-aged yuppie women are high maintenance. And quite possibly the H2s some of them drive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Ratboy said: Two words: high maintenance. your silly, sure they are....but i would be there for only one reason....routine service!! not like i am gonna buy her dinner, she is gonna buy me dinner!!!! services rendered, payment required! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sk Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 erik said: Ratboy said: Two words: high maintenance. your silly, sure they are....but i would be there for only one reason....routine service!! not like i am gonna buy her dinner, she is gonna buy me dinner!!!! services rendered, payment required! can I make a sugestion?? CHARM SCHOOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 honda element is niiiice! low emissions, good mileage (30mpg+) looks like a toaster on wheels. just too low clearance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrible_ted Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 (edited) For all of those folks who thought, "I love my Yugo, but I wish it looked a little more like an armored car..." Edited August 20, 2003 by terrible_ted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbw1966 Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Supply Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 and Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Demand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Duh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 supply manipulation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 = Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 anti-trust Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 not a free market Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 so fweather are you saying you need the government to enforce the law to protect you from a corporation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 Absolutely. The role of govt is to make sure we all play by the established rules that ensure a free market thrives. Please don't conclude that I support new onerous government regs, just enforcement of existing law. But then, how does the USA (or The Crown) enforce their rules on a multi-national? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 Who is manipulating supply? If one oil/gas company is withholding supply in an attempt to drive up prices, any competitor with an ounce of business sense would increase their supply to maximize the number of gallons that they can unload at a higher price. Happens all the time within OPEC, and they are supposedly obliged to cooperate with one another in these matters, rather than compete. The only place that any credible sources have identified a bottlekneck in is refining capacity, especially in those refineries which sell the stuff formulated to meet regional composition regulations. It'd be interesting to see why there aren't additional refineries coming online if that's truly the case. Supposedly the single biggest factor that caused the major price spike in gasoline was a massive refinery in Venezuela going offline because of anti-Chavez strikes or some such thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 From OPEC "In this context, the price band mechanism has played a very important role in preventing oil prices from rising to unbearable levels for the market, by increasing the availability of crude oil supplies according to pre-established parameters. This way, it has also made a contribution to reducing uncertainty and it is being increasingly recognized as a reasonable mechanism by consumer countries. But looking at the present oil market situation, we must inevitably conclude that currently high oil prices are not only the result of the balance between crude oil demand and supply. Several other factors are also intervening and this conference must take them into account: One such factor has been the steep fall in refining capacity facing the world's main energy market, the United States. There, between 1981 and 1999, 170 refineries closed down. Meanwhile, US refining capacity fell by 2.74m b/d of products. Additionally, at the beginning of the year, only 85 per cent of present capacity was being used. This explains the fall in inventories of products and the corresponding rise in prices. Such a picture is a consequence of increasingly stringent environmental protection measures, which lead to higher costs and reduced profit margins. They are leading to a dangerous bottleneck, which has been responsible for significant gasoline price increases and has prevented a much-needed build-up of product inventories. Furthermore, high product prices are pushing up crude oil prices. Another important factor affecting market stability is taxes on final consumer prices. As a whole, between 1980 and 1999, such taxes in OECD countries, especially in the European Union, have increased by 355 per cent (the equivalent of an amazing $40 per barrel). Meanwhile, crude oil prices have gone down by 51 per cent (the equivalent of $15/b). Some consumer countries increased taxes even as crude prices fell. The distortion that such taxes produce is so huge that they generate higher revenues for the governments of consuming countries, as compared to the full export income of oil producers. Market stability is additionally being affected by an insufficient tanker fleet to satisfy the industry's present transportation needs. Lower profitability in the transportation business over the past 20 years has led to reduced investment in the construction of new tankers. This problem has been made more acute by environmental measures mandating the use of double-hulled tankers. For instance, this led to the demolition of 116 tankers in 1999 and 83 so far this year. At a time of increased demand for transportation services, this situation has brought a three-fold rise in fees. While the effect of insufficient refining capacity is more significant in the US and high taxation is a more important issue in the European Union, there is one final factor equally affecting all markets — speculation through futures trading. Futures markets — associated with the exchanges in New York (NYMEX), London (IPE) and Singapore (SE) — make daily transactions equivalent to the value of between 90m and 150m b/d. And futures traders act according to expectations. If they think that prices will rise, they buy large amounts of papers, thus bringing the price up and transforming that expectation into a reality. This introduces significant price distortions, which at times have been measured at between four and eight dollars per barrel. After looking at all these elements, we can only conclude that OPEC has more than fulfilled its role as a reliable oil supplier and that the true reasons for currently high prices lie behind a series of other factors not directly linked to crude oil supply." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 Thanks for the info JayB, My understanding of the supply manipulation is that it's indeed the "just in time" refining. The gasoline suppliers almost hope for a problem with capacity as this spikes profits dramatically. I never claimed OPEC was involved. (By the way, I'd like to see that communist, soon-to-be-dictator Chavez in Venezuela, rotting in jail where he belongs.) Supply and demand are clearly at work here. The question is manipulation of supply and tacit collusion between refiners who all know how this game is to be played. And it obviously has little to do with a free market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 Ursa_Eagle said: There was one (H2) in front of me getting onto 217 this morning... I tried to see the driver to get an idea of what kind of moron buys one of those things, but the thing was so freakin high that I couldn't see in. The funny part is, I think my Outback has more clearance. There are a bunch that drive around Hillsboro. Usually it's some middle age guy trying to look cool. I always point my finger at them and laugh. They REALLY don't like it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sphinx Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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