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Rodchester

Looking for opinions on belay devices...

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I recently dropped blush.gif my belay device on a route in the tetons . Yes I am am madgo_ron.gif!!! In many yeras I have never dropped anything of note.

 

Anyway, it (BD ATC) is gone. So the question is what belay device(s) do you recommend and why?

 

It will be used for most all types of climbing, alpine and crag rock. Rapelling (only as required), ice and mountaineering.

 

I was looking at the old BD ATC, new BD ATC, the Reverso, the BRD, and the Trango pyramid, the Trango B-52(?). Any others you would recommend?

 

Thanks in advance ... wave.gif

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i have the atc

jaws

reverso

and the pyramid

 

only one that has a different performance is the reverso, but it is essentially the same.

 

i use the atc for gernal cragging and the reverso for multipitch and alpine.

 

the jaws for ice

 

and the other once is in case i drop the rest!

 

 

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I like my Trango pyramid. It dissipates heat really well. The BD ATC is good too. Seems like EVERYBODY has got one of those. Of course for hangdogs a Grigri is good, but spendy.

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i have only used a reverso twice but does anyone find it hard to keep the second or seconds tight with the reverso when they are moving fast over easy terrian?

 

maybe its just a symbol that we should be simul climbing

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ATC XP looks interesting. I hate the Trango Pyramid. All the tubes work about the same. Haven't tried the reverso.

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Opinions? I got a few of those!

 

ATC = thumbs_down.gif

Pryamid = thumbs_up.gif

Revreso = thumbs_up.gifthumbs_down.gif

 

B-52 = thumbs_up.gifthumbs_up.gif

 

Having used a Pyramid for years, and a Reverso occasionaly, I recently tried out the B-52 and was so impressed I sold the Pyramid, and will get rid of the Reverso too.

 

It feeds smoother than any device I have tried. It locks up nicely when it is time. It works as an autolock plate on multi pitch. It is lighter than the Reverso.

 

I would even reccomend it to someone who will never use it in autolock mode, something I would never do with the Reverso. It is the all purpose unit!

 

 

 

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Thumbs up on the Reverso. It is great for alpine stuff with double/twin ropes, thin rope rappels, autolocking belay, etc.

 

One point about the reverso: if you are frequently rapping on it in "high friction" mode (basically using the device backwards), there is a concern about wear on the metal eventually causing a sharp edge to form, that can cut the rope. This particular issue is only with repeated use in the high-friction mode. I imagine this takes a while, but it is something to be aware of, if you choose to use the device in this fashion. The "high friction" mode is great if you choose to rap on thin cord (6 or 7 mm).

 

The BD ATC XP is also great for thin ropes, but a bit heavy.

 

Our system for alpine climbs (works for us, not saying it would make sense for anyone else) is the leader carries a Reverso, and the second carries a ATC XP. Leader then has the choice of belaying the second in "autolocking" fashion, or not, depending on the situation. The extra weight of the Reverso/XP devices is worth it for us, because we are usually climbing with thin ropes (e.g., 8.5 mm double rope system).

 

For the case of climbing on fat ropes exclusively, probably a normal ATC would be better, since it is lighter than the ATC XP.

 

Just my $0.02.

 

Edited by Stephen_Ramsey

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I very much like the reverso—a few years ago I almost never used the thing in autolocking mode; but this year I’ve found occasion to use it in this mode countless times; very convenient (that is, as long as you can be slightly below the device when belaying, and don’t have to give anyone slack in a hurry!).

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Stephen_Ramsey said:One point about the reverso: if you are frequently rapping on it in "high friction" mode (basically using the device backwards), there is a concern about wear on the metal eventually causing a sharp edge to form, that can cut the rope. This particular issue is only with repeated use in the high-friction mode. I imagine this takes a while, but it is something to be aware of, if you choose to use the device in this fashion. The "high friction" mode is great if you choose to rap on thin cord (6 or 7 mm).

 

From other people's experience, I would have to disagree slightly with you hear Stephen.

 

The Reverso has this wear problem that you mention, but it is not only when you use it in High Friction mode. It wears badly even in normal rappel mode, and none too slowly either. I had one friend wear his out in a month of regular use.

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the edges on the "high-friction" part of the reverso can get razor-sharp. I do not use the high-friction mode anymore for this reason, instead, double up carabiners if needed. or loose some weight.

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also worth knowing how to jigger the reverso to disengage autolock while weighted in case you need to lower your second.

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Iain,

 

also worth knowing how to jigger the reverso to disengage autolock while weighted in case you need to lower your second.

 

OK, I'm a dummy. I haven't been able to figure it out. What's the scoop on how to do this?

 

I even (uncharacteristically) read the instructions, but they are written in some insane cartoon language rather than plain English.

 

Thanks,

Steve

Edited by Stephen_Ramsey

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erik said:

www.amga.org

 

confused.gifconfused.gif American Medical Group Association confused.gifconfused.gif

 

I think you meant .com smile.gif But I can't find it there either, unless you mean he should take a course???

 

Stephen, it's not in the instructions.

 

Get someone to show you.

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Snoboy, thanks for you input. I also need a new device, as my trusty Pyramid is well worn. I was wondering about the B 52. I think I'll pick one up. thumbs_up.gif

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Another thumbs_up.gif for the B-52. Not as smooth as the Reverso in autoblock (and requires an extra locker), but still works and nice to have the option. Seems to wear no more/less than an ATC.

Edited by b-rock

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Stephen_Ramsey said:

 

One point about the reverso: if you are frequently rapping on it in "high friction" mode (basically using the device backwards), there is a concern about wear on the metal eventually causing a sharp edge to form, that can cut the rope. This particular issue is only with repeated use in the high-friction mode. I imagine this takes a while, but it is something to be aware of, if you choose to use the device in this fashion. The "high friction" mode is great if you choose to rap on thin cord (6 or 7 mm).

 

 

 

The Reverso SUCKS and in my opinion is dangerous. I used one heavily for about 9 months and had razor sharp edges worn on both sides. I tried another, same bullshit. I also found that it locks up when there is any wear on the HMS carabiner connecting it to your harness. I use an HB Sheriff as my main device with an ATC backup (free at the base of Total Soul wave.gif) The HB works the same as an ATC but has a solid retention loop instead of a cable that gets sucked into the device.

 

If your a Reverso user, I would inspect it often and replace it as soon as it turns into a knife!

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b-rock said:

Another thumbs_up.gif for the B-52. Not as smooth as the Reverso in autoblock (and requires an extra locker), but still works and nice to have the option. Seems to wear no more/less than an ATC.

 

Hmmm, I feel that my B-52 is smoother than the Reverso. confused.gif The Reverso also requires an extra locker...

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Stephen_Ramsey said:

What's the scoop on how to do this?

 

Thanks,

Steve

 

Here's the scoop, luckily found it online for you:

 

USMGA Reverso Transitions

 

Be sure to practice it first so you don't take someone off belay by accident.

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I have the

thumbs_up.gifthumbs_up.gifgrin.gifATC-XPPro: great feed, control, smooth rap, can rigged without taken off the biner Con: hard to belay 2 with it, OK control on single skinny rope rappel, (my preferred rock climbing belay device)

thumbs_down.gifmad.gifATC- Pro: great feed Con: OK rap, no control, hard to belay 2 with it, bad control on single skinny rope rappel

thumbs_down.gifmad.gifevils3d.gifReverso - Pro: can belay 2 with it Con: jerky feed, bad control, cant rigged without taken off the biner, fast rap, bad control on single skinny rope rappel

thumbs_down.gifevils3d.gifevils3d.gif TrangoB-52 Pro: can belay 2 with it, can rigged without taken off the biner Con: jerky feed, bad control, OK rap, bad control on single skinny rope rappel

thumbs_up.giflaugh.giflaugh.gifTrango Jaws - Pro: great feed, smooth rap, control, can rigged without taken off the biner Con: hard to belay 2 with it, OK control on single skinny rope rappel

thumbs_up.gifgrin.gifMetolius BRDPro: control, can rigged without taken off the biner, smooth rap Con: jerky feed, hard to belay 2 with it, OK control on single skinny rope rappel

thumbs_up.gifthumbs_up.gifgrin.gifcool.gifOP SBG-II - Pro: great feed, control, smooth rap, can belay 2 with it, great control for single skinny rope rappel, Con: cant rigged without taken off the biner (my preferred Ice/all around belay device)

 

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I've had the catch on ATC's get all twisted up and difficult after alot of use, so a few years ago I bought a Hugh Banner Sheriff.

 

http://www.gearshark.com/finder/details/Hugh-Banner-Sheriff-Belay-Device/details/Hugh-Banner-Sheriff-Belay-Device/7924.html?no_f

 

The catch is metal, and is shaped otherwise like an ATC. This I use primarily for rappelling, because I like a gri gri for all sorts of belaying.

 

I know, I know, a gri gri is heavy, and there's some debate about the potential for shock loading the system when leading with gear. However, after 8 years of climbing on and off, I've known personally of a number of accidents that would have been less tragic if a gri gri was used. It's also really nice to bring your second up with.

 

Just my personal preference. smile.gif

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How can you rig an ATC or a Reverso without taking it off the biner, but not a B-52? confused.gif

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