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Time-Saving Aid


JGowans

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I was reading the TR on Hood from a guy that took the cat up. Some folks pissed on him a bit for not walking up from Timberline.

 

This got me thinking though. I'm going to Elbrus in 2 weeks. There's a chair lift up to camp at 13K. Assuming I summit (18,500 ft) , would it be wrong of me to claim the summit if I take the lift up to 13,000? Time constraints would be the main reason for taking the lift.

 

I want the summit, but I guess I also want the respect of my peers. What do you reckon? Where do you draw the line on lifts, cats, and other time-saving aids?

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Just messin' w/ ya...it seemed like a troll when you asked about taking a lift...

 

If'n you were serious, my apologies...

 

Oh...i only got a 480 on the sat verbal...musta misspelled my nomen...

 

There...i went back and deleted my posts...feel better??

Edited by RuMR
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Figger_Eight said:

I dunno...who don't you just take a snowmobile all the way up? It's all good right? As long as you're having fun...that's all that matters, right? yellowsleep.gifmoon.gif

 

So, in your book, you gotta start from 0 no matter what? What about the plane, train, bike, or car that got you there or the paved roads that make these mountains accessible?

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JG,

I think it all depends on the ethics and style of the particular area and the climb in question. No one would say a summit of denali was illegit because a bush plane was used to get up on the glacier. So does denali bush plane = Elbrus chair lift? You'll have to answer that one for yourself.

 

btw, ever been to chamonix? see all the telegraphiques that take climbers from the valley up to 10K? nobody ever bitches about those.

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I want the summit, but I guess I also want the respect of my peers

 

If you can't summit with out it, due to time or inabilites, is it better to summit with it, or fail without it?

 

I wouldn't let your peers drive the answer to that question.

 

Further, isn't it standard on Elbrus to take the chair-lift? If so, then you've made the standard grade, and others shouldn't criticize you unless they've done better. And even then, they shouldn't criticize you.

 

Now, if time and abilities permit, and if the standard on the mountain was to NOT use the lift and you chose to anyway, then I might say something.

 

wave.gif

Edited by Rodchester
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In any event, it would seem to me that taking the lift up the south side of hood, which is a whopping 11k foot peak rolleyes.gif, is different than taking a lift to 13k on an 18.5k foot mountain. My guess is unless you are aclimated, climbing for 13k to 18.5k is going to be a lot more difficult than climbing hood from timberline several times in a row. So, I doubt that answers your question, but that's my opinion. wink.giffruit.gif

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jja said:

JG,

I think it all depends on the ethics and style of the particular area and the climb in question. No one would say a summit of denali was illegit because a bush plane was used to get up on the glacier. So does denali bush plane = Elbrus chair lift? You'll have to answer that one for yourself.

 

btw, ever been to chamonix? see all the telegraphiques that take climbers from the valley up to 10K? nobody ever bitches about those.

 

bigdrink.gif

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JGowans - The only person's opinion that matters is your own. If to you taking the life is the best style for the climb then do that, as long as doing that won't mess up your ability to aclimate and not have issues on the climb due to poor acclimatization. I assume you're climbing the thing for yourself, not because you'll get bragging rights that might be tarnished if you took the lift. Have fun on the climb.

 

p.s. a friend who skied it last year said that was the way to go. Makes the descent a lot easier.

Edited by ehmmic
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Whats the standard for the mountain,anyone? 5,500 feet of elevation gain is still quite of an accomplishment, but the chair is aid. to use it cause you've already conquered the mountain, and you want to climb one of your favorite harder routes is just fine in my book. but to use aid like this just so you can scratch that mountain off your list is kinda weak if ya ask me. But I'm no hardcore or anything, I haven't climbed Elburs. And the denali bush plain does not = the chair lift, ya cant realy drive to the base of denali...

 

Later

just some gaper yapin about aid

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Further, isn't it standard on Elbrus to take the chair-lift? If so, then you've made the standard grade, and others shouldn't criticize you unless they've done better. And even then, they shouldn't criticize you.

 

 

If you are going to criticize someone, you should first walk a mile in their shoes. That way, you are a mile away from them.......and you have their shoes.

 

yelrotflmao.gif

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Fejas said:

And the denali bush plain does not = the chair lift, ya cant realy drive to the base of denali...

ah, but as figger-eight could no doubt tell you, it is possible to get to the summit of denali without the aid of a bush plane. but I think in his heart, f8 wishes there was an escalator to the summit.

fruit.gif

and as for the whole sport vs. trad comparison, bolts may be aid, but nuts and cams affect the legitimacy of the ascent in the same way: you hope they remain permanent for the space of the climb, so you don't die, right? the question of whether you walk halfway or all the way up a mountain seems to be a little more relevant to the amount of chestbeating you're allowed.

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