sobo

Too late, it was already in Bill O'Reilly's talking points this evening. Was it really barbeque sauce? Or was it... s * t * e * a * k * s * a * u * c * e ...???

Ditto ericb's question: Which company? Help me narrow the search.

You tell them they're full of shit, then direct them to this webpage. It's the report from the AAC that someone mentioned over in the original Mt. Hood rescue thread several days ago. I don't have the time to go back through all 53-odd pages to find the guy's name and give him credit for originally pointing this report out to folks. Oh, and if 8 pages of reading will cause you armchair mountaineers out there to miss the next episode of Dancing with the Stars, then see if you can get through just the Executive Summary. This report came out in May of 2005, and I referenced it in the thread that is linked in the next paragraph (from July, 2005), but I don't think anyone outside of the climbing/mountain rescue community has ever read it. I keep a few copies printed off and stashed in my rig for distribution whenever I hear this kinda bullshit about "crazy, risk-taking, irresponsible, selfish, adrenaline-junkie climbers ought to be getting charged for the taxpayer's costs of rescuing their sorry asses." I pull out a copy, hand it to them, and kindly suggest that they read it, then ask them to consider making a tax-deductable donation to their local Mountain Rescue unit. It shuts up quite a few, but not all. Some people just don't want to become informed. And I write letters to the editor, like the one here from last year. Alisdair and Kellie got published, but I was apparently too verbose for the likes of the P-I editorial staff. It's the seventh post on Page 5, if you care to read it.

Even if you have an expired passport, I'd bring it with you, along with an UNexpired driver's license. You'll get into Canada (after a bit of thrashing around with the border guard) with the expired PP, but you'll probably have to go inside the office at the gate to iron it all out. But you'll get in. Trust me, my M-I-L fucked up like this on our vacation to Mayne Island this past summer. Bottom line is you should get a new PP anyway, if you plan to travel out of country on even a semi-regular basis.

Dead Or Alive says Raindawg's right, at least about the "alive" part...

Yeah, my dad always reminded me with that line...

Weekend Climberz second post is spot on. There is no "one size fits all" response. One has to consider several things: 1. Who went in, an end person or the middle one? Your response will be slightly different depending upon your answer to this question. For instance, with an uninjured middle person in, just have the two end guys reef on the rope simultaneously while the middle person employs ice axe/crampons to help climb out on his/her own. For an end person, tie a loop into the other end of the rope, lower the loop to him/her, have them clip it into their harness, and proceed as above. Remember to protect the edge of the crevasse lip BEFORE extraction of the fallen climber to prevent the rope burying itself into the snow. Out in a jiffy, without a lot of fuss and downtime. This is essentially a 2:1 mechanical advantage system. 2. Is he/she conscious and uninjured? See above, or have him/her prussik him/herself out, or have him/her walk out one end if it's shallow enough to be lowered to a traversable ledge/shelf. This is essentially a 0 mech. adv. system. 3. Unconscious and/or seriously injured? Last resort - employ WC's first post (see diagram). Pad crevasse lip with handy objects while belaying yourself with your own prussik tied onto one of the free strands of rope that an end person carries coiled on their shoulder (this can also be done with the "interior" strands of rope that are on either side of the middle person, but no matter). Set the other "end" of this free strand back from the lip somewhere as your belay anchor. This is the classic 3:1 MA system with which we are all familiar. You can find all of this kinda stuff in FOTH, and books like jon linked above.

seems to me that this should change in the future. I totally agree, Dave. It's my understanding that OR units can come to WA to help us, and they are covered, but not the other way around. Mystifying... Whats up with that? During a rescue recently on mount Baker BMRC got some help from accross the boarder. Seems if Canada can help us, then we should be able to help other states! I cannot know the answer to that. It's a bureaucratic thing peculiar to this state. As I said before, it's mystifying.

seems to me that this should change in the future. I totally agree, Dave. It's my understanding that OR units can come to WA to help us, and they are covered, but not the other way around. Mystifying...

We'll take ya. Age not a factor. Join up! :tup:

Several peeps have wondered if they could show up and help search. Those of us in SAR and Mountain Rescue have responded to you all that others in places of power will pretty much say, "We won't let you, it's an insurance thing." To that end, I provide this message for your general consumption: Due to the ongoing SAR incident on Mt. Hood I thought I'd remind everyone of the policy on resource requests from Oregon. There is no interstate mutual aid agreement in effect with Oregon. Therefore, we can not issue a Washington State mission number in support of such requests and any volunteers responding will not be covered under the Emergency Worker Program. If we do receive a request for resources from Oregon (usually from an Oregon based LE agency or state emergency management) we always make this clear to them and ask for a point of contact. We will then advise those Washington State jurisdictions with the appropriate type units of the request from Oregon and emphasize that no Washington State mission number will be issued and that any volunteers interested in responding may contact the Oregon jurisdiction conducting the operation to determine what coverage, if any, there is. Of course, the same policy is in effect if the request comes directly to the your agencies or volunteer units from Oregon counterparts. The above message is from the WA State SAR Coordinator at the Emergency Management Division in Olympia. It's as high as it gets. What does it mean? It means that if you are in SAR/MR in Washington, and you show up at Mt. Hood to help, you will not be covered by any insurance that WA State would normally provide if you repsonded to a mission in your home state. Essentially, you're on your own if you get hurt/killed/lose gear. If you're NOT in SAR/MR, they won't even entertain your joining in the search. To put it succinctly, "they don't know you." As mentioned before, join up with Mountain Rescue before an emergency arises, so that you are trained in mountain search and rescue techniques (which are rather different than self-rescue techniques you may already know) and prepared when another episode like this comes around again. As a Mountain Rescue member for over three years now, I would dearly love to go and help, but I cannot in good conscience put my family at risk without the coverage that WA State would provide if the scene were north of that big creek. Here's sending out massive quantums of positive energy to those that have, can, and will respond to the search call. And to the three they're looking for.

If that is true, then please provide a link to this oasis in the desert. Remember, though, that I do engage in what LI underwriters would consider "risky" recreational activities - check my bio. Of that, I cannot lie or hide, nor do I wish to. If I really can get another half-million in coverage for an additional Jackson per month, I'd be all over it. Unless, of course, they don't pay when I get killed doing something "risky", which my current insurance would cover. And your statement above makes no sense whatsoever in light of your statement below, which is cross-posted from your very own Life Insurance for Climbers thread: This is exactly what I ran into (although mine went from ~$50/month with no "risky" activities into the low $300's per month once I 'fessed up to climbing, sailing, and diving) with State Farm. They are my company of choice for all of my other insurances (auto, home, personal articles, etc.), except for life insurance and supplemental long-term disability. Those are New York Life and NW Mutual Life, respectively. As stated above, the NYL policy is though a group policy through ym profession. I don't think I'd get such a good deal if I went it alone.

[more shameless plugging] I can only echo cluck's, Jason's, and mtn mouse's comments. And responding to letsroll, it took me over four decades on this planet before I finally decided to "give something back". I was also worried that SAR/MR would cut into my personal climbing goals, but at about the same time as cluck, a few months after the Hood/helo thing, I decided I needed to do it for myself as well as others. You reach a certain point in your life when your maturity level takes over, and you decide it's not all about you anymore. [/end more shameless plugging]

...and www.cwmr.org in Yakima/Tri-Cities. volunteering every day, not just when it makes the news, is what it's all about.

How long ago was that? I have long-term supplemental disability coverage through NW Mututal Life that picks up the 1/3 of my salary that my employer's LT disability benefit doesn't cover. I purchased this policy 15 years ago or so, for a fixed monthly premium of just under $20. The pay-out keeps pace with my salary increases. The agent is a friend and she knows I was a climber then, as now. YMMV. JayB: My employer covers AD/D for up to twice my annual salary (for my death, less for eyes and limbs), and I have a term life policy thru New York Life that I get as a group policy with my professional society membership (ASCE) as a civil engineer that costs me about $37/month. When my annual society dues ($200+) are figured into the equation, I get a $250k term life policy through a reputable underwriter for less than $55 per month. The best part of this gig is that after two years of claim-free living with this LI policy, it pays 100% of the benefit in the event of my death, NO MATTER WHAT THE CAUSE. That's right, no exclusions, not even risky recreation, not even suicide! It's all right there, even in the fine print. Apparently, New York Life thinks that civil engineers aren't suicidal enough to not cover them. IIRC, you're in the legal biz (yes?). Perhaps you should check into benefits offered by your professional society(ies), if you haven't already done so. You might be pleasantly surprised. And good luck!

wow, that didn't take long. Perhaps I should get back into dry fly fishing.

http://www.cascadeclimbers.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Board=7&Number=309141&Searchpage=1&Main=21289&Words=yocum+ivan&topic=0&Search=true#Post309141 Ivan, texplorer, Crackman, and Terminal Gravity (perhaps others) were transfixed with this line a few years ago. Perhaps you may wish to PM one of them.

What a gorgeous family you got there, Luke! Congratulations on your marriage and the birth of your fine baby daughter! Oh, almost forgot... Welcome home!

Naaaaaaaah, less than 25% in S over P. But klenke's wearing just shorts.

oooooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhh, that would be baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad.

That's easier said than done, WC. It's a 450-mile round trip for me just to hang out with the likes of all you rapscallions. Wouldn't think of it. When I said "Curious East-sider", I really meant East -sider... Just where do you think The Oklahoma Dustbowl of WA is, anyway?

You mean he wasn't already gainfully employed? Huh, did not know that. Well, congratulations to him, I guess, on getting a job. At least he still gets out and about.

That was Kramer. Not me.

Anybody?? Haven't seen him on the board since the summer. Is he still out baggin' peaks? I simply can't imagine Paul getting banned... Curious East-sider

Since we're on the subject of Peshastin, how about the first pitch of Lightning Crack? I got thrashed by the bulge move for over 20 minutes the first time I tried it. I skulked away humbly, losing the onsight.