Winter

The lab is redundant. Pro Row is on the eastside, has outside seating and good beer (no booze). The Horsebrass is a great place to get super wasted and then you can throw darts at each other. The west side scares me.

quote: Originally posted by Terminal Gravity: Thanks, Will, for starting this. My vote would be Horse Brass, Produce Row or Beaulahland (if they don't have a band...too loud) And for a cheaper alternative; if someone wants to donate a house for the evening I will donate a keg ( or two). cheers - steve (TG) That's damn tempting. I may be willing to offer up a backyard only blocks from Dots, within stumbling distance of Doc's and complete with hand blown apparati in exchange for a keg.

[ 04-23-2002, 08:09 AM: Message edited by: Winter ]

Michael Sean White. Did I climb with this guy in the North Cascades a couple of summers ago before he left for Amsterdam or something like that? I think he was from North Caroline or Virginia ... used to teach a ropes course or something way back when. Just curious.

No kidding ... but if I remember correctly Jamie's single wall bibler ended up smelling better than a dutch coffee house. long-haried hippy.

Yep ... now I totally remember the stories of Mike bailing and headed to euro and leaving you with Jamie. Good guys ... but I think they got a little tired of all my Johnny Cash they had to listen to. Wish I could climb full time this summer. If and when you and Jamie pass back through, drop me a line and maybe we can hit Beacon or head north.

Yetis only eat dookie when they know you're looking for it. They've got ESP. Oh yeah, and they can make themselves invisible. Something about yetis discovering the forth dimension.

Yetis eat shit all the time.

frozen yeti.

This is definitely the work of the sasquatch. Trail people? Come on ... that's just rural legend. Its definitely big feet.

Walter - Interesting post, and I agree with a lot of it, especially the water rights issue. But I think you need to be real careful assuming that the state agencies enforcing the env. laws will ensure that Cogentrix will have to internalize costs that would otherwise be externalized. In fact, state agencies often bow to the political powers of companies with lots of cash and either bend or don't enforce the rules that are designed specifically to force internalization. That is why NIMBYism isn't as bad as everyone makes it out to be. You need the local folks with the knowledge of their local resources forcing the state and local agencies to enforce the laws in the right way. If that happens across the board, you should theoretically end up with the plant in the most "efficient" location. If people simply discredit local folks because they are trying to protect local resources, you end up with no effective watchdog of the state agencies on a project-by-project basis, and you generally end up with poor enforcement of our env. laws.

And can you believe I had a cooler of beer stolen from the Grasslands? Bullshit! Too bad my buddy's Rotweiler didn't do anything until he just about ripped my head off the next morning. Some guard dog.

100 m with the Arva 9000? No way. I've practiced a bit with my Arva and haven't got anywhere near that distance. I like it, but I also had a weird experience where the thing totally shut down because I got a little snow on it, and the inside got wet. Its ok, but I'm not thrilled with it. But when it does lock on, its super fast and easy to get to the victim.

I ain't vouching for the accuracy of this info. but thought it might help: If anyone else out there can't stomach paying ten dollars a night at 13milecampground there is an alternative. Go past Blue Diamond 'til you hit 160,turn right(NW). Go all the way to lovell canyon Rd, it's at least fifteenmiles or so, past a saloon I cant remember the name of. After you turn ontoLovell canyon road go Eight miles, past this point you are in the nationalforest where you can camp as long as you want. Pretty remote, and not themost convienient place to camp but it worked in a pinch, and it's almost asclose to the black velvet canyon road as 13mile. Note that if you dont go atleast eight miles your still in part of Red rocks and there are two reallybored cops in a ford expedition driving around there all the time. Rememberif you pack it in, pack it out. I found some sights with panty hose andsocks and all kinds of other crap strewn everywhere. Oh yeah, the campsitesare mostly on the right, you'll see a buch of pullouts. Good luck!

Someone posted some directions to a local spot on National Forest land on the rec.climbing usegroup about two weeks ago. Just got back from Red Rocks but didn't check it out.

Here's something I got from the woman leading the charge: If You Live in Central Oregon, Cogentrix Will Affect YouBy Mary Zemke, founder of STOP Cogentrix By now most of us know about the North Carolina company attempting to invade Central Oregon, rob our resources and pollute our air. Armed with pertinent facts, the residents of Central Oregon are coming together in the most diverse coalition of determined citizens ever seen in this area. Ideologies range from cowboy to contractor, environmentalist to business owner, with every community, culture, age, and financial bracket represented. What brings such a group together in harmony and agreement? A love for Central Oregon, this beautiful area that we are blessed to be a part of. We love the open spaces, the clear skies, the pure and precious water, and we are united in our commitment to protect these priceless treasures from greedy corporations and short-sighted elected officials. At this point in time, Cogentrix has submitted three applications for the permits they must obtain before they can build their facility. Not one permits was accepted in the first go-round. The Application to the Energy Facility Siting Council (ASC) was deemed incomplete, with many areas of deficiency listed in a six-page letter from Cathy Vanhorn to Cogentrix. The Siting Council process cannot move forward until Cogentrix submits the missing information. The DEQ permit was considered mostly complete, but Cogentrix violates air quality standards in the Mount Washington Class I area to such a degree that they need to either reduce plant size or reduce hours of operation to meet compliance standards. Although advised of these deficiencies by Thane Jennings of the Bend DEQ on January 31, 2002, Cogentrix has still not responded to these concerns. The water right permit is by far the most controversial aspect of the Cogentrix project. The Initial Review of their application for 8 million gallons of water per day was deemed “unfavorable” and “BAD” by Cory Engels of the Water Resources Department for three specific reasons: 3/10/02 If You Live in Central Oregon, Cogentrix Will Affect You Page 2 1) The Cogentrix well site is hydraulically connected to the Crooked River and has the potential for substantial interference with stream flow. 2) No water usage is allowed from April 15 to September 30 in this area of the Deschutes Basin.3) The amount of water requested, 5,555 gallons per minute is not available at any time due to prior, senior water rights downstream. Despite the seeming impossibility of granting a permit under these conditions, Cogentrix has been invited to participate in the mitigation process still under formulation. If they can mitigate their usage with other water rights or money, they may receive a water right for 12.38 cubic feet per second. At this point the permit has been placed on Administrative Hold until the mitigation rules are finalized. From September 25 through the 28, Cogentrix ran a 72-hour well test using only one of the six proposed wells, yet by October 6, eight days later, the aquifer had only recovered 93%. Remember, the test was of only one of the six wells, running at less than half the rate proposed. No mitigation rules can compensate for the damage this one permit is capable of causing to hundreds of well owners, especially in nearby Crooked River Ranch. Central Oregon could find itself very quickly in the same dilemma as the town of Malin on the Oregon/California border where California wells decreased the quantity of high quality water and lowered the water table in just four days. Desert aquifers are not made for heavy industrial use, and due to their proven connection to surface water (USGS Report 00-4162), there has been a moratorium on the issuance of new water rights in this area for years. Our streams are already over-appropriated and run below legal levels at times. Water mitigation rules so far proposed will do nothing to preserve the aquifer and nothing to preserve long-standing wells from going dry. Let’s discuss mitigation for a moment: Mitigation is basically what companies do when they want to exceed the established standards. It allows them to damage one area beyond a reasonable degree because they are doing something in another area to make up for it. 3/10/02 If You Live in Central Oregon, Cogentrix Will Affect You Page 3 In the case of the water mitigation rules being discussed currently, we all need to be aware that if canal piping and lining is approved for mitigation, then Central Oregon will be a double loser. Canals, which leak about 46% of the water that flows through them, are a significant source of recharge both to the aquifer and the stream flow, and this was determined by the US Geological study done in 2001, so to line or pipe the canals, and then call it mitigation is, well, it is just bogus. There is only one true form of mitigation: Putting water back into the aquifer or stream that would not have otherwise gone there. Period. I will end the water discussion with one more detail: Cogentrix is taking water from the Opal Springs formation, therefore they are trying to take some of the top 3% of the water in the world and destroy it for industrial use. With their zero-discharge system, not one bit gets recycled, and that which goes into the atmosphere in the plume is contaminated with the chemicals used to alter the Ph for their cooling towers. This is just plain immoral. Many of you have asked what to do. Here are 10 ways you can help STOP Cogentrix:1) Get on the STOP Cogentrix Contact List by phone or e-mail for updates. (541) 475-4446 and stopcogentrix@hotmail.com 2) Sign the STOP Cogentrix Petition on paper or at www.PetitionOnline.com/Grizzly3) Send a STOP Cogentrix letter packet or post cards to permitting agencies and elected officials or write your own.4) Attend important meetings and hearings.5) Donate some money to STOP Cogentrix at P.O. Box 976, Madras, OR 97741.6) Send letters to the editor to local papers.7) Display a bumper sticker.8) Put up a sign.9) VOTE in the upcoming elections.10) Spread the word to everyone that we must STOP Cogentrix! It is not right that one company can take so much, do so much damage, and provide so little benefit to the area.

must be serendipity ... i'm leaving for 4 days of climbing in RR this afternoon.

quote: Originally posted by imorris: I've been a member of PDX RG for some time now and I still don't know a soul there! I'm a relatively quiet person but it's kindof funny for all these people to recognize me there but I've never talked to a one of them! Not that I don't like them or anything. Probably 'cause I'm a V2 kindof guy and spend "valuable crag time" climbing volcanic choss/rime piles. imorris - I'll be at PRG tonight around 7 pm ... halfbread asian with glasses and blonde girlfriend. i'll spot you for those v2 pump fests if you're looking to hang with a couple of folks while suffering throught PRG's chalk-soaked climate.

In addition to double taxation and subsidizing industry, the fee demo program has the potential to lock the poor out of our public lands, which is complete crap and for the conspiracy theorists could be seen as a way of limiting public support for public land conservation over the long-term.

Wickwire's cover photo is pretty cool, but did anyone else find that the most interesting part of the book?

This a funny topic for Portlanders, because I don't how many timbes I've sat at the Horse Brass and ranted about the pricks you have to deal with in some of shops in town (mostly because I had nothing else to talk about). Climbax is clearly the place to go for climbing gear. The always have stuff marked a bit lower than the other stores, and they have the Euro gear you won't find anywhere else in town. I second the comment on the Mountain Shop having b-c skiing gear. After that, I think its really just a crap shoot as to whether you get a young arrogant punk who hasn't been outside in a year or someone cool who knows what their doing and can help. I've heard plenty of horror stories about US Outdoor, Mountain Shop and OMC. REI sux for gear.

quote: Originally posted by Wopper: I am headed down to Hood this week-end. Does anyone have updated beta on the requirements to use the chairlift? I have not been down there for a number of years but if I remember correctly it cost about $10 and you need to have an avalanche beacon. Is that still the case? Can climbers still use the lift? I'm pretty sure Timberline no longer offers single lift rides to climbers. Also, Palmer is shut down, so it would only get you to the top of the Miracle Mile. [ 03-01-2002: Message edited by: Winter ]

quote: Originally posted by imorris: If that was the most recent accident on Washington, Accidents in NA Mtning confirms the american triangle was used in that belay. Yep, that was the one.

JayB - I know of an accident on Mt. Washington in the Oregon Cascades where a spectra sling used in an anchor broke. The lead climber pulled three or four pieces of gear and popped the sling when it shock loaded. I found the sling still attached to a couple of manky pins ... but it looked as though it might have been shredded over a corner as opposed to a straight pull. It also looked like it had been set up in a death triangle. [ 02-28-2002: Message edited by: Winter ]

Yep. I just got a lifelink shovel. I forget which is which. I think the polycarbonate is the transparent blade, which is lighter and more flexible, making it worse in hard snow conditions. The composite is a stronger blade and just a bit heavier. I could have those reversed, but the see-through blade is weaker and lighter. I think the weight difference was 6-7 ounces.