Ducknut

b Ireno I just hit up Fitger's in Duluth. They are wondering when you'll be back in town. Well maybe a reunion will have to wait til a Lucky Lab field trip or Smiff this fall. What you got planned? Should I have a Grain Belt for you? I'll be here in MN til the 12th.

and you would knoe hoe hardcore I am because????? CHICKEN Oh, she's hardcore. You just need to break her out of her suburbanite shell. I don't know what shell you are talking about there buddy get a room you two

They are also known as tamaracks. I recommend reading Aldo Leopold's essay "Smoky Gold" from A Sand County Almanac.

Did that back in August, stunning views, fun climb, approach anything but fun when it is >90 degrees (>33 C for our Canadian friends). Elliot ice.

sounds like a street sweeper. sounds like a bad mofo

looked cool, but we saw some big stuff rolling down all over the face. climbing the n face couliors would very likely have resulted in a sudden facial reconstruction. figured those had to be classes...reminded me of the matanuska glacier in alaska I should have used a different term than wonderful. The face was inspiring, awesome, stark. I couldn't help but think of the stories of the ski descents of the couloirs.

That picture is a classic. To all of our climbing pioneers. To bravery and courage.

moderators please feel free to move this post to spray, my bad.

This will be a blistering series.

The face looked wonderful yesterday. Good job on the slurpee. There were about 4 different groups of kids and instructors practicing ice climbing on the Elliot. They looked like they were having fun learning to swing tools.

the new phonebooks are out! The new phonebooks are out!

Paul I am right there with you. Did you try typing 'steaksauce' into a message to see if it magically changed to steaksauce? Damn, its magic.

I was stoned back then... All the music has merged together in my scrambled brain.

they call me mellow yellow. Quite right.

Well I gotta throw in my 2.3 inflation adjusted cents. I grew up in Annapolis, MD. I travel back there 6 or 8 times per year. Still have family living there. I always wanted to rock climb when I was a kid, but didn't have the transportation or any local places to cclimb, so that is my excuse why I still suck at climbing. There wasn't much of a climbing culture and no one heard of pulling plastic then. There is a little more now. Carderrock and Great Falls are relatively close but limited in routes. Seneca, Gunks, New River, and other places are all a long road trip. Whitetail, Ski Roundtop, Canaan Valley are all East Coast ice or mad-made slop skiing. Vermont, New Hampshire or Maine are all a solid day drive for more skiing, but it is limited in comparison. You won't need to brush up on any crevasse rescue skills since there hasn't been a glacier within 750 miles for 10,000 years. The canoeing on the Shenadoah, Potomac, and other local streams can be fun. Sailing or boating on the Chesapeake is a blast. Fishing and crabbing can be hit or miss, although I hear the rockfish (striped bass) have recovered and provide some sport. Forget about hunting anything except urban deer and geese. The Appalachian Trail isn't too far away but its hardly a wilderness experience. You can drive 2 or 3 hours and go to the beach (Ocean City) and actually swim in the warm water. I moved back there again for grad school and my first couple of jobs. Been offered other jobs back there more recently, but turned them all down. The Baltimore/Washington Megacity has over 7 million people in it. Its very expensive and I have always found commuting there to be terrible. Its very common to spend 1-2 hours commuting each way for relatively short commutes. Culturally, DC has great opportunities. Museums, art, Smithsonian, government buildings, rich ethic neighborhoods and food. The METRO is an efficient clean way to get around downtown. There are a bunch of commuter trains that run from rural areas into the city. There are many things going for DC for those like that lifestyle and what it has to offer. But life is too short to trade off the NW lifestyle for me to ever consider living there again.

I am glad to see that there has always been great disagreement on this issue and cc.com hasn't solved it either. I find it interesting that someone asked David Brower his opinion before his death, and he gave obtuse, poltical answer. Thanks for posting that link Will. Its clear that there won't soon be a policy decision aside from the current uneasy truce policy. Just hope that we don't see endless bolt ladders up every >5.1 pitch on every wilderness crag.

I thought we were only talking about issue 1 here? Maybe I am wrong but hand-drilling bolts in the wilderness seems almost a non-issue, same as leaving a nut or a cam on a route. I mean, "it happens" but is hardly a threat to access? The FS choose not to take on the controversial "permanent structure" aspect of this and took on the climber for using a motorized piece of equipment. Some here are only arguing the motorized equipment side of this incident, while others are pointing out that BOTH issues threaten access to climbers. Disregarding the placement of bolts being against current regulations is short-sighted.

Ryland I am right there with you. This is an issue of abusing or the total disregard for the wilderness designation and regulations. There are two issues, 1. the prohibition of motorized equipment in wilderness; and 2. placing bolts or other permanent objects in the wilderness. The regulations and I believe a wilderness ethic prohibit use of motorized equipment (except for rescues from life-threatening injuries) or the permanent placement of bolts (or any other permanent alterations) in designated wilderness areas without permission of the land management agency. Sorry that is just my belief. This has nothing to do with marble counter tops or any of your other distracting arguments.

This is exactly where the debate should be. IMO the FS chickened out on the "fixed installation" issue by playing the motorized activity card. Now the followup question is Does FS have anyway to grant permission to authorize placing bolts or other permanent fixtures in a Wilderness Area? I have not read the regs so I have no idea.

No it is not, reread the article Dru. The Forest Service decided not to pursue the question of whether or not the bolts are illegal. They avoided that question/fight.

There you go with your Tom Robbins again. Get out your patcholi oil.

The closest data buoy is about 100 miles from the eye. RobBob do you want to go sailing in 36 foot seas with a 14 second period and continuous 55 knot wind? data buoy web page

I was thinking of using hot pink plastic surveyors tape to mark them. But hot pink and glow in the dark spray paint on the hanger and on the surrounding rock just might be better.