Obama and his Lying Issues

[AlpineK]

Nuclear

[Fairweather]

i'm not looking to rebuild the world or fix all the fuck-wit that humans have wrought - i'm quite certain that treating others as equals though, whether they be so in actuality or not, nation-states or random nabobs rambling along the way, is not going to lead me to supporting gulag archipelagos and the like...

 

I agree, you don't strike me as a gulag type of guy. Quite the opposite. But your friends--not so sure. (Let's let history be our guide here.)

[Fairweather]

And if you REALLY worry about national security, the first step would be moving production capacity back to this country. I would be far more concerned with N. Korea and China.

 

I agree about 90%. Still, if you can figure out how to do it, please tell. Abrogate GATT, NAFTA, etc? Relax environmental regulations here at home? Abolish unions? Retrain service sector employees to work in all the new factories that are selling products to who exactly? Nixon thought that opening up China to the west would make it less of a threat. I guess the jury is still out.

[ivan]

i'm not looking to rebuild the world or fix all the fuck-wit that humans have wrought - i'm quite certain that treating others as equals though, whether they be so in actuality or not, nation-states or random nabobs rambling along the way, is not going to lead me to supporting gulag archipelagos and the like...

 

I agree, you don't strike me as a gulag type of guy. Quite the opposite. But your friends--not so sure. (Let's let history be our guide here.)

i can count my friends on my fingers and i have faith in the lot of them

[glassgowkiss]

And if you REALLY worry about national security, the first step would be moving production capacity back to this country. I would be far more concerned with N. Korea and China.

 

I agree about 90%. Still, if you can figure out how to do it, please tell. Abrogate GATT, NAFTA, etc? Relax environmental regulations here at home? Abolish unions? Retrain service sector employees to work in all the new factories that are selling products to who exactly? Nixon thought that opening up China to the west would make it less of a threat. I guess the jury is still out.

Unions and environmental are not the cause of production exodus. As an outdoor person you should know 2 things essential to healthy living: clean air and clean water. Living in something less polluted then Love Canal and getting paid for work a living wage is so much to ask for? Stop promoting "race to the bottom" mentality.

I think the main issue is tax system and corporate lobbying. Tax system encourages job export and product import, and corporate lobbying is spending big $$$ to convince general and sub-edutated public this is the best and for our own good.

[Fairweather]

And if you REALLY worry about national security, the first step would be moving production capacity back to this country. I would be far more concerned with N. Korea and China.

 

I agree about 90%. Still, if you can figure out how to do it, please tell. Abrogate GATT, NAFTA, etc? Relax environmental regulations here at home? Abolish unions? Retrain service sector employees to work in all the new factories that are selling products to who exactly? Nixon thought that opening up China to the west would make it less of a threat. I guess the jury is still out.

Unions and environmental are not the cause of production exodus. As an outdoor person you should know 2 things essential to healthy living: clean air and clean water. Living in something less polluted then Love Canal and getting paid for work a living wage is so much to ask for? Stop promoting "race to the bottom" mentality.

I think the main issue is tax system and corporate lobbying. Tax system encourages job export and product import, and corporate lobbying is spending big $$$ to convince general and sub-edutated public this is the best and for our own good.

 

Well, I guess you're smarter than every president, premier, party chairman, chancellor, and prime minister that's held office since the Bretton Woods system was put in place. Tell me exactly what you would implement to replace the present neoliberal economic structure? I suspect it would not support the "living wages" you allude to, but I have no doubt it would supply good steady wages and benefits to the bureaucratic class. Still, I agree with you in principle--I just think any cure might end up being worse than the disease.

[glassgowkiss]

You still believe is principles of fair competition. That went out through the window with deregulation during the 90's and early 2000. How in the hell is a smaller company supposed to compete with such as GE, when GE gets more tax credits, then tax liabilities last year, and created no jobs? Corporations via media convinced gullible public about the nonsense of tax brakes creating jobs. There were nothing but tax brakes to these assholes- so where are these jobs? In China, Vietnam, or Indonesia. Small businesses are getting financial raping, while large corporations get all sorts of preferable tax treatment, which goes straight to the pockets of top executives, who by the way give themselves bonuses, while running the whole economy into the ground. I am all for tax brakes, but if they are across for everyone competing. Current system is nothing, but rigged by lobbying eliminating of competition of start ups.

[rob]

spurt spurt spurt lol

[Fairweather]

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their consciences."

 

--CS Lewis

[rob]

“If there's anyone who can appear before Aslan without their knees knocking, they're either braver than most, or else just silly.”

 

-- C.S. Lewis

[ivan]

yup, nothing more tyranical n' undemocratic than trying to get afforadable healthcare for everybody

[olyclimber]

I read on the internet the other day that CS Lewis was into S&M!

[glassgowkiss]

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their consciences."

 

--CS Lewis

Yes, since 1987 I keep hearing how trickle down economic is good for me, and how healthcare system we have is the best one on the planet.

[G-spotter]

I read on the internet the other day that CS Lewis was into S&M!

 

If those letters stand for Somebody's Mom, as he was also a MILFer

[olyclimber]

http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/12/01/the-c-s-lewis-you-never-knew/

 

HIT PIECE FROM LIB RAG

[Fairweather]

yup, nothing more tyranical n' undemocratic than trying to get afforadable healthcare for everybody

 

Mine was taken away by this president--and then offered back for more than double the price. Affordable? You're delusional.

[Fairweather]

spurt spurt spurt lol

 

in your case dribble dribble lol.

[rob]

yup, nothing more tyranical n' undemocratic than trying to get afforadable healthcare for everybody

 

Mine was taken away by this president--and then offered back for more than double the price. Affordable? You're delusional.

 

what was it like meeting the president, when he showed up at your house to personally take away your worthless junk health insurance? I hear he's not as tall as you'd expect.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

yup, nothing more tyranical n' undemocratic than trying to get afforadable healthcare for everybody

 

Mine was taken away by this president--and then offered back for more than double the price. Affordable? You're delusional.

 

"Affordable" indeed. LOL

[Fairweather]

Yep. Fact is, my wife and I have decided not to pay nearly $900/month for "affordable" Obamacare insurance--with a $5000 deductible. Doesn't seem right that we'd be subsidizing others who pay nothing for the exact same coverage. And it sounds too much like that whole "from each according to his needs, from each according to his means..." bullshit. Not gonna play. And that big IRS fine? Yea, we'll see how well that holds up come election season.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

Yep. Fact is, my wife and I have decided not to pay nearly $900/month for "affordable" Obamacare insurance--with a $5000 deductible. Doesn't seem right that we'd be subsidizing others who pay nothing for the exact same coverage. And it sounds too much like that whole "from each according to his needs, from each according to his means..." bullshit. Not gonna play. And that big IRS fine? Yea, we'll see how well that holds up come election season.

 

Surely you paid more before the "affordable" care act, FW? I mean, didn't you get more for less $ under Barry's new plan?

 

[rob]

I can't believe my property taxes subsidize people using the public roads who pay nothing for the exact same coverage. Not gonna play. Me and mine have what we need, and balls to everyone else. America!

[prole]

No worries, a lot of the issues will get sorted out under a single payer system instead of the one Obama was able to wrestle out of the insurance companies and their politicians. The current system was concerned at least as much as keeping insurance companies afloat as it was providing affordable care. Time to get those parasitic middlemen out of the equation entirely.

 

[rob]

I wonder why people are so scared of single payer? We've had a single payer military and police force for quite some time -- seems to have worked OK

[prole]

Lower the Medicare eligibility age to 0, buy insurance if you want/need it.

 

It's what Obama should've been selling to Americans all along, instead of engaging and compromising with a group of vested interests with no intention of bargaining in good faith. Hillary won't make those same mistakes.