JayB Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Soviet family in Siberia cut off from all contact with the outside world for 40 years... http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history-archaeology/For-40-Years-This-Russian-Family-Was-Cut-Off-From-Human-Contact-Unaware-of-World-War-II-188843001.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 40 years w/o vodka - utter madness - missing out on the joys of stalinism *might* have been worth the sacrifice though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted January 30, 2013 Author Share Posted January 30, 2013 40 years w/o vodka - utter madness - missing out on the joys of stalinism *might* have been worth the sacrifice though? Not according to Stone and Kuznick. Speaking of Stalinism, I read a book called "Red Plenty" not too long ago that you might enjoy. Historical fiction about the attempt to translate great-grand-daddy Karl's assorted musings into a way to coordinate the production of wheat, tires, engineers and vodka without using prices. Highly recommended. http://www.amazon.com/Red-Plenty-Francis-Spufford/dp/1555976042 Economist Review: http://www.economist.com/node/16843647 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 reading "a bridge too far at the moment" - not sure if a book on economics would be best for my bedside Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 oliver stone said stalinism was cool? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted January 31, 2013 Author Share Posted January 31, 2013 reading "a bridge too far at the moment" - not sure if a book on economics would be best for my bedside -There's a subtext of economics humming along faintly in the background but it's basically an attempt to capture the zeitgeist in the Kruschev era by following a semi-fictional cast of characters through that time. Scan through this chapter and you'll get a sense of what's in there. You may decide it's not your cup of tea but it certainly doesn't read like a treatise : http://books.google.com/books?id=PioE2EDcuMsC&pg=PT241&source=gbs_toc_r&cad=3#v=onepage&q&f=false -More "misunderstood/misrepresented" than "cool" if I understand them correctly. Not an interpretation I share but the existence of people with viewpoints like Stone/Kuznick's is fascinating. Some back and forth: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/11/21/oliver-stone-defends-his-the-untold-history-of-the-united-states.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 -More "misunderstood/misrepresented" than "cool" if I understand them correctly. Not an interpretation I share but the existence of people with viewpoints like Stone/Kuznick's is fascinating. seems logical that the same crowd that brought us the magical domino theory, long since swept into the dustbin of history, might have made the soviet boogey-man out to be a tad worse than he really was - that said, i met a chick once who'd grown up in the ukraine in the 30s and ended up in auschwitz in the 40s, and she hated stalin far more than hitler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted January 31, 2013 Author Share Posted January 31, 2013 -More "misunderstood/misrepresented" than "cool" if I understand them correctly. Not an interpretation I share but the existence of people with viewpoints like Stone/Kuznick's is fascinating. seems logical that the same crowd that brought us the magical domino theory, long since swept into the dustbin of history, might have made the soviet boogey-man out to be a tad worse than he really was - that said, i met a chick once who'd grown up in the ukraine in the 30s and ended up in auschwitz in the 40s, and she hated stalin far more than hitler Ironically enough the Soviet union was a far more brutal, ruthless, implaccable, and murderous enemy of the people inside its border than it ever could have been to those outside of its borders due to the "internal contradictions" of communism. The desire was there, the material capacity to do so wasn't, and never could have been. The technical subtext lurking underneath the stories in Spufford's book hints at the reasons why this was the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonG Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 Having known folks whose family lived under Stalin (in the Baltics), there is no way anyone has made him out to be worse than he was, esp. if you got on the state's bad side. Beyond imaginable suffering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 (edited) and yet stalin is still held in high regard by russians today? the soviet revolution seems a great example of how few revolutions change anything - repressive governmetn was already a hallmark of russian history, and it seems to be something russians, for whatever reason, have contented themselves with. stalin secularized the language and justifications, and used the modern tools at his disposal to carry it all out - i'm not certain peter the great would have been any different - jesus christ, didn't they just throw a couple of chicks in the clink for 20 years for saying mean things about putin and the fucking church? what's changed? Edited January 31, 2013 by ivan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 The average Ruskie, son, don't take a dump without a plan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 "One ping only" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 "One ping only" Kevbone, we finally connected on something! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 The average Ruskie, son, don't take a dump without a plan sheeeeit, that dude tried to run for president pretty much on that line only Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 "One ping only" amusingly, watching that movie that night before i signed up for classes my first year of college was the whole reason i ended up studying russian language and history for the next two years - I wanted to be sean connery (as a russian) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 was the whole reason i ended up studying russian language and history for the next two years - I wanted to be sean connery (as a russian) Where did it all go wrong, Vanya? LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 Incredible! Thanks for sharing that Jay. Todays news coincides with a book I was going to recommend. http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/E/EU_RUSSIA_STALINGRAD?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-01-31-06-54-20 MOSCOW (AP) -- The southern Russian city where the Red Army decisively turned back Nazi forces in a key World War II battle will once again be known as Stalingrad, at least on the days commemorating the victory, the regional legislature declared Thursday. The city was renamed Volgograd in 1961 as part of the Soviet Union's rejection of dictator Joseph Stalin's personality cult. But the name Stalingrad is inseparable with the historic battle, which was among the bloodiest in history with combined losses of nearly 2 million people. book - Stalingrad: The Fateful Siege: 1942-1943 http://www.amazon.com/Stalingrad-Fateful-1942-1943-Antony-Beevor/dp/0140284583/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1359662574&sr=1-1&keywords=Stalingrad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 was the whole reason i ended up studying russian language and history for the next two years - I wanted to be sean connery (as a russian) Where did it all go wrong, Vanya? LOL later i decided i just wanted to be sean connery from indiana jones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 was the whole reason i ended up studying russian language and history for the next two years - I wanted to be sean connery (as a russian) Where did it all go wrong, Vanya? LOL later i decided i just wanted to be sean connery from indiana jones I mean, I saw you smoking a cigarette and sipping vodka at the top of the Palmer, so you have gotten some of it down pat. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 one might argue that all people are born russian, and some just evolve past it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-spotter Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Soviet family in Siberia cut off from all contact with the outside world for 40 years... http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history-archaeology/For-40-Years-This-Russian-Family-Was-Cut-Off-From-Human-Contact-Unaware-of-World-War-II-188843001.html http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1683876/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olyclimber Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 this is a kewl story as well http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/india/1509987/Stone-Age-tribe-kills-fishermen-who-strayed-on-to-island.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 this is a kewl story as well http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/india/1509987/Stone-Age-tribe-kills-fishermen-who-strayed-on-to-island.html You see what happens when you take away everyone's guns? YOU SEE WHAT HAPPENS??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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