Colorado Springs - thanks Grover Norquist

[Off_White]

You should have heard what the POTUS said. That fucker's got nerve.

 

So, what did you hear him say? I can't tell if you're in favor or appalled. All I found in a casual research was this weekly address:

 

Obama said:

Hello, everybody. I'm here in Colorado Springs, visiting some of the devastating fires that have been taking place over the last several days. As many of you have been watching on television, entire communities are under threat. And we had a chance to tour some of the devastation that has been taking place in some of the subdivisions here.

 

Firefighters are working 18 hours a day, around the clock, trying to make sure that they get this blaze under control. We've got volunteers who are out here who are making sure that these firefighters have the food and the water and all the resources that they need. And we've been engaging in some unprecedented coordination between federal, state, and local communities to try to bring this fire under control.

 

And one of the things I've done here, in addition to saying thank you to these firefighters, is to let them know that all of America has their back. One of the things that happens, whether it's a fire here in Colorado, or a tornado in Alabama or Missouri, or a flood or a hurricane in Florida, one of the things that happens here in America is when we see our fellow citizens in trouble and having difficulty, we come together as one American family, as one community. And you see that spirit and you see that strength here in Colorado Springs, where people are working together, promising each other to rebuild. We've got to make sure that we are there with them every step of the way, even after this fire is put out.

 

So for those of you who can provide some help, you should get on the online site of the American Red Cross. They're very active in this community and you can make your contributions there. We're going to continue to make sure that the Federal Emergency Management Agency, the Forest Service, our military and National Guard and all the resources that we have available at the federal level are brought to bear in fighting this fire.

 

But this is a good reminder of what makes us Americans. We don't just look out for ourselves; we look out for each other. And one of the things that I told these firefighters is that we can provide them all the resources they need, but only they provide the courage and the discipline to be able to actually fight these fires. And it's important that we appreciate what they do not just when our own communities are struck by disaster. It's important that we remember what they do each and every single day, and that we continue to provide support to our first responders, our emergency management folks, our firefighters, our military -- everybody who helps secure our liberty and our security each and every day.

 

So, America, I hope you guys remember the folks during these times of need. I know this is a little bit unusual -- we don't usually do weekly addresses like this, but I thought it was a good opportunity for us to actually focus attention on a problem that's going on here in Colorado Springs. We never know when it might be our community that's threatened, and it's important that we're there for them.

 

Thank you very much.

 

It's nice and all, but I don't see the nerve you're referring to, so I'm guessing you have something else in mind.

 

As far as building in stupid areas, no one does it better than Southern California, where folks build out in the chaparral, an ecosystem that has evolved to burn every 15 to 20 years, lots of seeds don't even germinate until after the next fire. How short sighted do you have to be to live in a dense woody area evolved to burn?

[Jim]

Also, the sites that these houses were built on was like any subdivision in the PNW. You think that Mill Creekers are crazy for living where they do?

 

How about you blame the government for waiting for two days before they decided who was going to pay for it before deploying firefighters? If my house could go, it speaks not to my negligence as a homeowner but the ferociousness of the fire and the ineptitude of the government both local and national.

 

I'm no expert, but have worked on a couple wildland/urban interface fire projects, and here's what I gleaned from that expereince. For the homeowner the two items of importance are a defensible space and non-combustabile features of your structure. This inculdes decks - as you point out, but also roofs and walls. So yes, metal roofs can make a difference. At the frontal assault of the fire - likely no, on the fringes, yes.

 

Are folks stupid for living up in the hills? - I don't know. What I do know is that fire cycles have changed dramatically in the west over the past 50 years because of supression management and now climate change and the corresponding cumulative effects. And it's going to get worse. I certainly would not live up in those hills now.

 

Mill Creek in WA? Very differnt fire cycle and not so much a threat and likely to remain so even with climate change. Take a look at the UW Climate Impact Group webpage for some good summaries.

 

Government ineptitude? I'd say we've gotten the government we've asked for. Could 40 more firefighters made a difference? If you lived in that neighborhood what would you have preferred - more or less boots on the ground?

[rob]

dude Scott, when bush was pres you were all "I'm not gonna say bad things about him because he is commander in chief" and i was really impressed. but now that Obama is pres you don't seem to have problems saying bad things about him. I even thought you had left the service because it was such a sudden change.

 

You almost had me.

[akhalteke]

dude Scott, when bush was pres you were all "I'm not gonna say bad things about him because he is commander in chief" and i was really impressed. but now that Obama is pres you don't seem to have problems saying bad things about him. I even thought you had left the service because it was such a sudden change.

 

You almost had me.

 

You are right Rob, what he said pissed me off but I won't post here what he said because it will only get me madder.

 

[akhalteke]

Also, the sites that these houses were built on was like any subdivision in the PNW. You think that Mill Creekers are crazy for living where they do?

 

How about you blame the government for waiting for two days before they decided who was going to pay for it before deploying firefighters? If my house could go, it speaks not to my negligence as a homeowner but the ferociousness of the fire and the ineptitude of the government both local and national.

 

I'm no expert, but have worked on a couple wildland/urban interface fire projects, and here's what I gleaned from that expereince. For the homeowner the two items of importance are a defensible space and non-combustabile features of your structure. This inculdes decks - as you point out, but also roofs and walls. So yes, metal roofs can make a difference. At the frontal assault of the fire - likely no, on the fringes, yes.

 

Are folks stupid for living up in the hills? - I don't know. What I do know is that fire cycles have changed dramatically in the west over the past 50 years because of supression management and now climate change and the corresponding cumulative effects. And it's going to get worse. I certainly would not live up in those hills now.

 

Mill Creek in WA? Very differnt fire cycle and not so much a threat and likely to remain so even with climate change. Take a look at the UW Climate Impact Group webpage for some good summaries.

 

Government ineptitude? I'd say we've gotten the government we've asked for. Could 40 more firefighters made a difference? If you lived in that neighborhood what would you have preferred - more or less boots on the ground?

 

The government, decided not to deploy firemen for 2 days until they could hash out who would pay for it. THAT is ineptitude. Also, I live in an URBAN environment and almost lost my house. This is not "mountain living," its urban/suburban living less than a mile from downtown, and right next to 3 major military installations; one of which almost burned to the ground.

[AlpineK]

 

Also, I live in an URBAN environment and almost lost my house. This is not "mountain living," its urban/suburban living less than a mile from downtown, and right next to 3 major military installations; one of which almost burned to the ground.

 

While within city limits houses close to Joint Base Lewis McChord are in an area I would classify as urban-rural interface. It's not mountain living

 

The boundaries of Colorado Springs include lots of neighborhoods that would fall into the same classification.

 

Housing growth in the United States has been strong

in recent decades. During the 1990s, 13.6 million new

housing units were built in the United States (13%

growth). Americans’ affinity for rural settings (Sullivan

1994, Brown et al. 1997) has increased development

in exurban and rural areas (Theobald 2001, Hansen et

al. 2002, Radeloff et al. 2005). A significant portion

of new development occurs at low and medium density

and tends to be more dispersed, thus affecting a larger

area per housing unit when assuming a disturbance

zone with a fixed radius around each house (Theobald

et al. 1997, Hammer et al. 2004). Furthermore, housing

growth is particularly high in areas that are rich in

natural amenities (Johnson and Beale 1994), such as

forests (Radeloff et al. 2005), lakes (Radeloff et al.

2001, Schnaiberg et al. 2002), and seashores (Bartlett

et al. 2000), or are adjacent to protected areas (Rasker

and Hansen 2000). As development pressure mounts

in the WUI, environmental problems associated with

it may increase.

 

http://silvis.forest.wisc.edu/old/radeloff_etal_ea2005.pdf

 

I'm not trying to argue about responses, government or otherwise, but there are lots of places within city limit that have a lot of rural characteristics.

[Jim]

The government, decided not to deploy firemen for 2 days until they could hash out who would pay for it. THAT is ineptitude. Also, I live in an URBAN environment and almost lost my house. This is not "mountain living," its urban/suburban living less than a mile from downtown, and right next to 3 major military installations; one of which almost burned to the ground.

 

Well they argured about money because your community voted to slash and burn the municipal budget - get what you paid for. Sheet. Folks in Colorado Springs had to ban together to pay for neighborhood street lights to get turned on. I guess you could ban together with your neighbors and hire a fire truck.

 

As money has gotten tighter over the past two years, the city has cut some 550 employees from its work force by eliminating positions or through outright layoffs. Of the 1,600 municipal employees left, 1,200 are police officers or firefighters. Municipal bus service has been reduced by 100,000 hours, meaning buses no longer run in the evenings or on weekends -- a problem in a place where the vast majority of transit riders have no alternative way to get to work. The police department auctioned its three helicopters on the Internet. Spending on infrastructure projects has essentially ceased, and the city faces a $700 million backlog in capital needs.

 

It's a crisis, to be sure. But in this politically conservative, tax-averse town, it's also something of an experiment. After the impending cuts were announced in fall 2009, the city put a property tax increase on the November ballot. The measure was soundly defeated. Thanks to Colorado Springs' Taxpayer Bill of Rights (TABOR), which actually predates the state of Colorado's TABOR by a year, any proposed tax increase must be voted on by the citizens. With their vote, residents made it clear they'd rather suffer service cuts than see their taxes raised.

 

City Councilmember Sean Paige is one person who thinks scaling back government's role in the Springs is a good thing. "People in this city want government sticking to the fundamentals," he says. "There's a crybaby contention in town that says, 'We need to raise taxes and we need to get rid of TABOR.

 

Yea, crybabies!

[akhalteke]

Hey Jim,

I hope your house burns down. Deuces!

[glassgowkiss]

Also, the sites that these houses were built on was like any subdivision in the PNW. You think that Mill Creekers are crazy for living where they do?

 

How about you blame the government for waiting for two days before they decided who was going to pay for it before deploying firefighters? If my house could go, it speaks not to my negligence as a homeowner but the ferociousness of the fire and the ineptitude of the government both local and national.

 

I'm no expert, but have worked on a couple wildland/urban interface fire projects, and here's what I gleaned from that expereince. For the homeowner the two items of importance are a defensible space and non-combustabile features of your structure. This inculdes decks - as you point out, but also roofs and walls. So yes, metal roofs can make a difference. At the frontal assault of the fire - likely no, on the fringes, yes.

 

Are folks stupid for living up in the hills? - I don't know. What I do know is that fire cycles have changed dramatically in the west over the past 50 years because of supression management and now climate change and the corresponding cumulative effects. And it's going to get worse. I certainly would not live up in those hills now.

 

Mill Creek in WA? Very differnt fire cycle and not so much a threat and likely to remain so even with climate change. Take a look at the UW Climate Impact Group webpage for some good summaries.

 

Government ineptitude? I'd say we've gotten the government we've asked for. Could 40 more firefighters made a difference? If you lived in that neighborhood what would you have preferred - more or less boots on the ground?

 

The government, decided not to deploy firemen for 2 days until they could hash out who would pay for it. THAT is ineptitude. Also, I live in an URBAN environment and almost lost my house. This is not "mountain living," its urban/suburban living less than a mile from downtown, and right next to 3 major military installations; one of which almost burned to the ground.

THIS IS WHAT YOU WANTED- SMALLER GOVERNMENT. this what is what it looks like street level. your house burns, no fire fighters to fight it. you voted for it, you've got it!. So don't complain now you republican puke, because this is the end result of the policies you support and enforce.

[glassgowkiss]

Hey Jim,

I hope your house burns down. Deuces!

too bad yours didn't. At least you wouldn't have internet access to post venomous shit asshole.

[Crux]

No reason to be blaming the government or Grover Norquist here. If people in Colorado had been sensible, they'd have simply drowned the fires in a bathtub, during the first couple days. If they'd done that, then maybe that black guy would have never had the fukin' nerve, you know, to show up and suggest people might put together more effective plans.

 

 

[akhalteke]

Hey Jim,

I hope your house burns down. Deuces!

too bad yours didn't. At least you wouldn't have internet access to post venomous shit asshole.

 

WOoooooooo! Look at the balls on Brad! Lick my choad. If Jim wants to play the sharp words game, we can go that route. He chose to escalate and I will oblige him. YOU on the other hand appear to have one volume and one mode: Surly Scot.

[akhalteke]

You pussies are all big mouthed blow hards. One of your boys steps over the line and gets bitch slapped and you all want to jump in and help. Jim wants to be an asshole, let him deal with the consequences.

 

Plus, it would be another thing if I weren't forced to move here, you know, by the government, the one that told me to put it out by myself (BHO) while I am on a deployment. Kinda puts a different spin dontchya think?

 

 

[AlpineK]

Plus, it would be another thing if I weren't forced to move here, you know, by the government, the one that told me to put it out by myself (BHO) while I am on a deployment. Kinda puts a different spin dontchya think?

 

 

 

Ummm you chose to enlist. You're surprised your boss is telling you what to do, like it or not?

 

[akhalteke]

Plus, it would be another thing if I weren't forced to move here, you know, by the government, the one that told me to put it out by myself (BHO) while I am on a deployment. Kinda puts a different spin dontchya think?

 

 

 

Ummm you chose to enlist. You're surprised your boss is telling you what to do, like it or not?

 

Thank's for letting me know what it is like in the Army. I really appreciate it. I knew there was something I was missing.

 

 

[rob]

Thank's for letting me know what it is like in the Army. I really appreciate it. I knew there was something I was missing.

 

 

 

The difference between the Army and the Navy is that woman in the middle.

[glassgowkiss]

You pussies are all big mouthed blow hards. One of your boys steps over the line and gets bitch slapped and you all want to jump in and help. Jim wants to be an asshole, let him deal with the consequences.

 

Plus, it would be another thing if I weren't forced to move here, you know, by the government, the one that told me to put it out by myself (BHO) while I am on a deployment. Kinda puts a different spin dontchya think?

 

What I think is that you're so full of shit your eyes turn brown from a turd overload.

[akhalteke]

You pussies are all big mouthed blow hards. One of your boys steps over the line and gets bitch slapped and you all want to jump in and help. Jim wants to be an asshole, let him deal with the consequences.

 

Plus, it would be another thing if I weren't forced to move here, you know, by the government, the one that told me to put it out by myself (BHO) while I am on a deployment. Kinda puts a different spin dontchya think?

 

What I think is that you're so full of shit your eyes turn brown from a turd overload.

 

Well I think that you and all your countrymen would have turned Scotland into: Deliverance, European Vacation if it weren't for the English.

 

Apart from that, you are a typical former European who loves to yank the tail of the dog and bitches when he is bit.

[glassgowkiss]

The only yanking I see is your hand on your 3 inch dick publicly jerking off; you seem to like so much and practice it frequently here. on the top of that you seem to have mentality of a 12 year old, who is unhappy that he has to brush his teeth. Sorry you IQ is low enough, you have hard time putting two and two together. If you cut budgets and let firefighters go, don't complain your house might burn down. happy clownpunching asseyes.

[pink]

The only yanking I see is your hand on your 3 inch dick publicly jerking off; you seem to like so much and practice it frequently here. on the top of that you seem to have mentality of a 12 year old, who is unhappy that he has to brush his teeth. Sorry you IQ is low enough, you have hard time putting two and two together. If you cut budgets and let firefighters go, don't complain your house might burn down. happy clownpunching asseyes.

 

no offense mister..... butt

 

[video:youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWVaTX_OzBs

Edited July 10, 2012 by pink

[akhalteke]

The only yanking I see is your hand on your 3 inch dick publicly jerking off; you seem to like so much and practice it frequently here. on the top of that you seem to have mentality of a 12 year old, who is unhappy that he has to brush his teeth.

 

Lets talk about maturity. Huh, talking about penis size and masturbation. I suppose it is better than your usual vitriolic and potty mouthed diatribes we usually see here, but at least I don't chastise others for it you hypocritical ass.

 

Shut your Scot-Cum-Catcher.

[billcoe]

Glad you and yours made it though Scott. My thought's and prayers go out for those who did go the fire shaft. If 39 more firefighters would have made a difference will be looked at I don't doubt. No one made the charge when Oakland, ca burned down 3500 homes that they were not paying enough taxes and that they could have saved even a single home by spending more. You all forget about that one so soon? And as Bob says in his earlier post, fire and building codes DO make a difference. They changed the codes in Oakland area after that fire. http://oaklandnorth.net/2011/10/19/twenty-years-after-the-oakland-hills-fire-what-has-changed/

 

Disasters have always been part of life although we have it pretty damned good around here generally, and I'm not looking forward to the one where my house shakes off the foundations in the next massive earthquake. When it does, if some of you guys could not start personally attacking each other for no apparent reason: it will be better for all. That we all still have roofs over our heads (and internet access to bag on others:-) is a damned good thing, and not to be ignored and forgotten. It's trying times for some of our bros in Colo.

 

Warm regards to all.

[E-rock]

I just read this whole thread.....

[Jim]

Disasters have always been part of life although we have it pretty damned good around here generally, and I'm not looking forward to the one where my house shakes off the foundations in the next massive earthquake.

Warm regards to all.

 

If you live in Seattle and haven't earthquake retrofitted your house - at least securing the pony wall to the foundation - it will be your fault when is slides off. Your insurance will not cover this.

[denalidave]

I just read this whole thread.....

That bored eh?