rob Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 Good article, questioning why everybody seems to think he's automatically ready to lead us Like Bush, he got his first career breaks from the connections and money of his family * The son of an Admiral, he went the the Naval Academy and did poorly * Still managed to become an aviator, and managed to crash 3 planes before getting shot down and becoming a prisoner for 5 years. * After the war, his poor military record limited his growth in the Navy, so he gets a new wife and uses powerful connections to become a lobbyist for the Navy, and eventually nabbing a congress seat in a district he never lived in until the seat opened. What has he really accomplished in the Senate? * His campaign finance reform failed to reduce the role of money in politics * His big tobacco bill failed * His bill to give the prez a line-item veta was decalred unconstitutional, pork-barrel politics continued unabated * His immigration reform failed * in 2005-2007, no senator missed more roll-calls except Tim Johnson, who was recovering from a near-fatal brain aneurysm. Interesting article. I'm glad somebody is finally asking, "what is so great about this guy?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 Look Rob, this article did not come from Fox News. How in the world can any of us be expected to believe this unfair and unbalanced piece of journalistic speculation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mal_Con Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 They talk about his war record a lot even though he was far more dangerous to the U.S. Navy than the Viet Cong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pink Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericb Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 Good article, questioning why everybody seems to think he's automatically ready to lead us Like Bush, he got his first career breaks from the connections and money of his family * The son of an Admiral, he went the the Naval Academy and did poorly * Still managed to become an aviator, and managed to crash 3 planes before getting shot down and becoming a prisoner for 5 years. * After the war, his poor military record limited his growth in the Navy, so he gets a new wife and uses powerful connections to become a lobbyist for the Navy, and eventually nabbing a congress seat in a district he never lived in until the seat opened. What has he really accomplished in the Senate? * His campaign finance reform failed to reduce the role of money in politics * His big tobacco bill failed * His bill to give the prez a line-item veta was decalred unconstitutional, pork-barrel politics continued unabated * His immigration reform failed * in 2005-2007, no senator missed more roll-calls except Tim Johnson, who was recovering from a near-fatal brain aneurysm. Interesting article. I'm glad somebody is finally asking, "what is so great about this guy?" Written in true conversational style with little if any substantiation...interesting. I thought your points above were paraphrasing the article, but, alas, they are the article. BTW, not making admiral does not necessarily constitute a "weak military record" if that what the author is alluding to - but then again, he doesn't give any meat to back up his allegations, so pretty baseless article IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 Perhaps, ericb, but most of what was set forth above is verifiable. Run some fact checks: what can you find out about his grades at the Naval Academy? Did he crash 3 planes? What was his navy career? Did campaign finance reform succeed? What happened to his big tobacco bill? etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superB Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 Why are you talking? Beat it, nerd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob Posted August 10, 2008 Author Share Posted August 10, 2008 Why are you talking? Beat it, nerd. I'm not talking. It's called writing. It's a non-verbal form of communication. Similar, yet different. Don't worry, you'll figure it out one day. Hang in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericb Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 Perhaps, ericb, but most of what was set forth above is verifiable. Run some fact checks: what can you find out about his grades at the Naval Academy? Did he crash 3 planes? What was his navy career? Did campaign finance reform succeed? What happened to his big tobacco bill? etc. No time for all this work you suggest Matt. Why the hell are we talking politics on a Sunday anyways? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 And Obama accomplished exactly what during his time in congress? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob Posted August 10, 2008 Author Share Posted August 10, 2008 And Obama accomplished exactly what during his time in congress? This thread isn't about obama, it's about McCain "My candidate is just as bad as yours," is that what you're saying? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 (edited) We're being asked to choose one over the other in November. Any thread about one's "qualifications" must be about both. Again; what makes Obama more qualified than McCain? Edited August 10, 2008 by Fairweather Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 Democrats callously discarded their most qualified candidate early on: Bill Richardson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericb Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 And Obama accomplished exactly what during his time in congress? "The Audacity of Hope" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob Posted August 10, 2008 Author Share Posted August 10, 2008 We're being asked to choose one over the other in November. Any thread about one's "qualifications" must be about both. Again; what makes Obama more qualified than McCain? Hmm. That's not how american politics works. We don't compare qualifications and merits to see who is the better choice. That would be WAY too optimistic. Instead, we analyze who has the most dirt, and the most disqialifications, and vote for the other guy. "Your guy sucks more than my guy!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob Posted August 10, 2008 Author Share Posted August 10, 2008 That's how Bush got his second term. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superB Posted August 10, 2008 Share Posted August 10, 2008 And Obama accomplished exactly what during his time in congress? "The Audacity of Hope" beat it nerd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olyclimber Posted August 11, 2008 Share Posted August 11, 2008 Uqxo1SKB0z8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Conway Posted August 11, 2008 Share Posted August 11, 2008 Again; what makes Obama more qualified than McCain? He can use Google Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted August 11, 2008 Share Posted August 11, 2008 No time for all this work you suggest Matt. Why the hell are we talking politics on a Sunday anyways? My point is, Eric, you've called the article reported above "baseless" but have apparently failed to undertake any effort to determine whether it was baseless or not. It may have lacked depth, detail or citations, but it would only be "baseless" if it was not grounded in fact. Your post and follow up reminds me of Fairwaeather and KK spewing hogwash about "socialized medicine" in the healthcare thread, and then calling names/checking out of the discussion when I assert that they've misused the term. Is the article noted above "baseless" or not? (It may be; I didn't make the claim.) ... By the way: any presidential candidate who wants to focus on how to get out of Iraq is better than one who wants to stay there for 100 years. Properly inflating your tires is a lot better idea than drilling the coastline. Working toward universal healthcare coverage is a pretty good idea too. Trickle down economics has been proven a failure. Whether either of them can actually deliver on their promises, at least Obama is talking about how to make Americans other than the super rich better off and more secure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted August 11, 2008 Share Posted August 11, 2008 No, I think what they are thinking is that, if you were to take the lense of what qualities McCain (or rather lack of qualifications) has (or doesn't have), McCain still looks better than Obama in the qualification dept. Significantly so. Obamas LACK of qualifications doesn't mean he will be better, he has merely done less to complain about. Significantly so. This is why you may think he'd be better, but it is not necessarily so. Sadly, you will get one of them for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted August 11, 2008 Share Posted August 11, 2008 I don't 100% follow that, Bill, but it seems to boil down to the fact that you feel a guy who has been a senator forever is better qualified than one who is relatively new. Do I have that right? If so, I think this qualification cuts both ways. McCain may be better connected and may know better how the game is played, but that is not necessarily a good thing. If elected, Obama could end up relatively powerless kind of like Jimmy Carter was but on the other hand McCain is way more likely to just continue running the same machine and I don't like how things have been going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pink Posted August 11, 2008 Share Posted August 11, 2008 kinda like an airplane pilot, he has to fly so many hours and obama has not flown enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted August 11, 2008 Share Posted August 11, 2008 This is a given: If Obama loses, Matt will be one hundred percent certain that the election was rigged. He is not able to comprehend, much less consider, the well reasoned opinions of others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Conway Posted August 11, 2008 Share Posted August 11, 2008 This is a given: If Obama loses, Matt will be one hundred percent certain that the election was rigged. He is not able to comprehend, much less consider, the well reasoned opinions of others. Still bitter that Gregoire won? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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