[TR] Smith Rock - Moscow, very slowly. Plus, critique my anchors! 4/5/2008

[nkane]

Trip: Smith Rock - Moscow, very slowly. Plus, critique my anchors!

 

Date: 4/5/2008

 

Trip Report:

EdsPans and I arrived to an inexplicably empty parking lot at 740am on Saturday.

 

Early morning sun at Smith:

After spending a good amount of time racking and turning the top of my pack into a mini-backpack, I started up the first pitch. This was my first climb building natural anchors without the supervision of a crusty mentor, so I'm posting pictures of them so they can be ripped apart by the ravening hounds of CC.com.

 

First anchor:

 

Second anchor:

 

Third anchor. I was the least pleased with this one, since the two top cams are too close together, but this one was the only anchor that actually held bodyweight, as EdsPans discovered that her foot was smaller than the crack and slipped in the offwidth section on this pitch, and it did fine:

 

 

We ended up topping out after several hours of effort, in which I learned that I need to get faster at rigging anchors. Since we needed to be back in Portland that night, and it was starting to rain, we called it a day.

 

Overall, I found this route a little harder and chossier than what I was expecting. Super Slab and Cinnamon Slab are both Smith 5.6s, and Moscow is definitely a step up in difficulty from them. In particular, the smooth wide fist/forearm crack at the top of the third pitch gave me some trouble. It was still a great route and a fun time, as always.

 

 

Gear Notes:

2 #4 c-4s would no go unused on the third pitch if you don't like wide stuff.

 

Approach Notes:

Walk across the bridge

[Winter]

I'll offer just a couple of pointers, but you should really get John Long's books and practice building these a lot in a safe environment.

 

In the first photo, it looks like you have used clove hitches on each of the pieces, and you have lots of slack built into the cordellette. The weight is therefore on only one strand of the cordellette and the system is not redundant. So by setting it up this way you're dramatically reducing the strength of the anchor. Its also real messy, which mages it tough to analyze quickly and is likely to get snagged on gear, etc.

 

In the second photo, you repeat the mistake of entrusting the entire system to a single strand of a cordellette. Also, the way you've tied the knot under the top two pieces also weakens the anchor, because it increases the angle between the top two pieces. When the anchor is heavily weighted or shock loaded, I doubt its going to stay equalized - looks like because the angles are messed up the top piece won't be bearing a lot of weight.

 

In this situation, you'ld be way better off and far faster to just clip the cordellete through each piece, pull it tight in the direction of pull, and tie an overhand knot.

 

Before you start moving up to harder routes, you need to get some of these skills nailed down better so that you can build safer anchors more quickly. Keep working at it. Its good that you're looking for feedback.

[godskid5]

great anchors. you should do a book!

[mike1]

I'll offer just a couple of pointers, but you should really get John Long's books and practice building these a lot in a safe environment.

I second that. You should spend some time setting up multi-point anchors in the safety of your home before hitting the rock. I recommend reading Climbing-Self-Rescue-Improvising-Mountaineers and working through some of the scenarios in it. Good luck man!

[nkane]

Thanks for the feedback! Winter, in the first picture, I think that picture might make it look like there is more slack in the system than there is, but I will take your advice into account in the future.

[Crillz]

Plus, critique my anchors!

 

Sketchy!

Take the advise of previous posters.

[ivan]

screw the cordelletes - just use the climbing rope - much simpler and faster

[hemp22]

First, I'll say good on ya for getting out and doing your first multipitch gear anchors (sans crusty mentor).

Don't worry about how long it took you - I'd say probably everyone spends a really long time setting up their anchors on their first time out. Don't worry - that will improve with practice. You'll get a lot more efficient with both the placements and the rigging of the anchor.

 

It looks like you're using the equalette, so I'm guessing you've either read the latest version of John Long's book, or you've at least read all about it online. If so, then you probably also know that the gear placements are the most important part of the anchor, and from pictures we're not really going to be able to assess each one of your placements for you. But once you have bomber gear, then how you rig your anchor - with an equalette or a power-point cordalette tie-off - is not as critical.

 

But I'll offer some thoughts on your equalettes too.

In the first two pictures, it looks like your belay & tie-in are slid all the way to one side of the equalette. This will remove some of the equalizing properties, so it's best to set it up so that the limiter knots are at approximately equal height. Ideally, you don't want the weight on your equalette to actually hit those limiter knots unless one side fails.

So, like in the 2nd anchor - adjust the cloves on the left 2 pieces so that the left limiter knot hangs down to the same level as the right one.

 

In the third pic, I remember that tiny crack at the top of the 3rd pitch. If I remember right, the gear there is tiny (not necessarily bomber) but there are some decent ledges around there. Remember that if you have a good ledge, you can save a little bit of time by only plugging in a couple pieces for a quick anchor, and then planting your butt firmly on the ledge and belaying off your harness so that you take most of the weight before the anchor does.

 

Also, if you want to have a single-biner powerpoint to belay your second directly off the anchor, you might try this variation that's sort of an equallette with a quad powerpoint:

See third picture down

 

[TrogdortheBurninator]

way too many knots in the first two. Just wondering, but where did you learn to use a cordalette (honest question, no offense intended)?

 

In #1, middle nut on left might be positioned a bit low. Third anchor looks ok, but it looks like there are some bomber midsize stopper placements there that are likely stronger than the microcams, and would save the micros for another pitch (if this is top of climb, disregard last half of statement).

[nkane]

Thanks, everyone.

 

Ivan, the reason I didn't rig the anchors with the rope was that we weren't swinging leads, so I would have had dismantle it and leave my second without an anchor when I headed up the next pitch.

 

Hemp, you're exactly right, I did read the Long book. Thanks for the critique. I think I need to spend more time setting up anchors on my kitchen table legs before I head out again.

 

Trogdor, I learned from the Long book, a NOLS course I took many years ago, and climbing with various people over the past few years.

[pink]

those anchors do not look multi-directional. what's up w/ all the knots, aren't they alittle hard to untie?

[jport]

Ditto on the multi-directional note made by Pink.

I use a single piece of gear below the equalized point to counteract any upward pull generated by a leader fall.

[hafilax]

I think you had the right idea with the anchors. The key to anchors is to have a large bag of tricks since each one is unique (unless they're all bolted). I do everything from sliding X's, to conventional cordelette and equalette depending on what's presented. The most important points really are good gear and not taking a factor 2 fall.

 

1st anchor: It looks like almost all of the force would hit the piece on the right so it had better be the best one! Make sure that block it's sitting behind isn't detached. The forces on the other two down pieces would be somewhat outward until the right one blows. If you lengthen the arms to the pieces on the left it would lower the tie in point and share the load a little better.

 

2nd anchor: Again most of the force would hit the piece on the right and the angle of the tie in of the higher pieces could be made more acute. You'd have to shorten the arm to the right piece and lengthen the ones on the left. I'm assuming the limiting knots are pre-tied. You may have better success if you tie them a little closer together. It's easy to get them centered and it's more important to keep the angles small.

 

With the equalette remember that with 3 pieces, the side with 1 piece will take about half the load so it had better be good. The other 2 share the other half of the load.

 

An upward pull piece isn't needed every time so build it in when necessary. You can always add an up piece before the leader takes off if it looks like you'll need it. It's low on the priority list for bringing up a second.

 

I think the equalette works better with 2 biners clipped to the loops instead of sliding X's. The X has high friction under load defeating the equalization advantage.

[ScaredSilly]

A bit knotty for me as well. Rarely do I clip all three piece together. I would equalize two anchors and clip my daisy chain to it. The third anchor I would clip the rope into. When the second comes they can do the same. By not having everything tied together this allows the second the the ability to start dismantling the anchors once the leader has the next set of anchors built. Depending on the belay I might undo the two piece anchor or the single before I am on belay. This reduction in clutter can help speed up the climbing.

[Winter]

So I read these posts and thought equalette, what the hell is that? And then plugged it into google and realized Long re-wrote his book and criticizes the cordalette and is now promoting the equalette. News to me. Guess I'm out of the loop.

 

Without having tried it, it looks like a huge pain in the ass that is likely to slow you down without a needed safety advantage unless you've got sketchy pieces. Tie in with the rope or use a cordalette if you're not swining leads. My .02.

[geoff]

On P1 the best anchor seems to be a few slings around the massive boulders. However, you end up having to belay from your harness.

[hafilax]

The equalette can be just as quick or quicker than the cordelette method with a fixed tie in point. You leave the limiting knots tied and clove hitch to each piece. It's not much different from clove hitching with the rope. Instead of messing with getting the center knot in the right place you adjust a few clove hitches. The advantage is that it actually achieves some equalization unlike the fixed point anchor which has been shown in pull tests to not equalize at all (unless every arm is the exact same length).

 

Try it out, you might like it. It's one more trick and may save your life with a dicey anchor where equalization is important. Long's pull tests showed it to be far superior in strength to the traditional cordelette and rope anchors which essentially load one piece at a time. Tie two limiting knots in your cordelette et voila, une equalette!

 

As for upward pull pieces, it seems to me that it would be a good idea to provide quite a bit of slack so that you can give the leader a soft catch therefore lowering the force on his pro? Just enough so you don't pull the anchor up.

[billcoe]

screw the cordelletes - just use the climbing rope - much simpler and faster

 

Yup. I was gonna say something about using your body positioning and stance as part of the belay chain then I saw your belay device and figured why bother.

 

f*ck I feel old.

[eldiente]

Taking advice on safe anchors from people on CC.com? Have you seen the anchors some of these people build. Scary.

 

Jokes aside, I don't normally place a directional piece at the belay unless at a hanging stance and/or there is really hard climbing right above the belay. On lower angle terrain ( Moscow) the chances of the leader taking a huge whip and pulling you way up ought to be low. Also, as the leader I'd rather have a few extra pieces with me that I can place right away to protect the belay than have those pieces tied up at the anchor being used in opposition. It really sucks when your run-out and realize the piece you need is being used at the belay.

[JosephH]

hemp22 and halifax are giving you good advice on tuning your use of an equalette - particularly about not being all slid up against one side or the other. I'd agree also I'd rather see you employing the two middle strands individually rather than in a sliding-X, but that's pretty hard to do if you're going to belay off the anchor. I personally never belay of the anchor and particularly never off trad anchors, but hey, I'm a really old guy.

[ivan]

 

Yup. I was gonna say something about using your body positioning and stance as part of the belay chain then I saw your belay device and figured why bother.

 

can't remember bill - have i treated you to the all hip-belay ascent of the se corner that i like so much? it really wigs out the younger crowd i've found i don't even think jim notices!

[powderhound]

 

Yup. I was gonna say something about using your body positioning and stance as part of the belay chain then I saw your belay device and figured why bother.

 

can't remember bill - have i treated you to the all hip-belay ascent of the se corner that i like so much? it really wigs out the younger crowd i've found i don't even think jim notices!

 

A buddy and I have gotten in the habit of just sitting down and placing our feet behind chicken heads and hip belaying at the city of rocks, goes real quick. Done it on wheat thin a couple of times, just plop down in that little alcove.

[111]

advice specific to Moscow: do it in 2 pitches, belaying from the comfy ledge below the broken crack at the bottom of the OW. A 60m will get you to the top comfortably.

[ken4ord]

 

First the piece with the tourquoise sling not really needed. If you intended it for stopping an upward pull on the other three pieces, then it might be better and easier to have it at the load point. If you are weighted on the anchor, then it would have to be a pretty severe fall inorder to generate enough force to lift your belayer from there stance and dislodge the other pieces.

 

Simplify your your anchor, use only one cordlette (looks like two were used, hard to tell). If a piece or two is far from the rest, then use a sling clipped to that piece to bring them closer together.

 

It would be best to use an equalette or what I like is the Alpine Cock Ring (ACR) system. Since you are new get familar with easier systems like sliding X and cordlette. In this case using the sliding X system, clip your cord to all the pieces, pull a loop down in between each piece, do a half twist in each loop you pull down except for the outer pieces loop, and clip the loops. Not using the tourquoise piece you should have three loops that you clip with a locker and then your rope clipped to the locker with an 8 or girth hitch (I prefer girth hitch because it is easily adjustable. To use the cordlette system is the same except guess the direction of pull with the three loops, tie preferably a figure 8 (or an overhand will do) to create a clip in point for your locker. Basically get used to using different systems and use a system that you are comfortable with and that is appropiate for the situation.

 

If you are belaying off the anchor you got it somewhat right. Clip your rope into your locker with a girth hitch or figure 8 and use a seperate locker for your belay device. With a well equalized anchor you do not have to clip any of the other pieces. Being new I might reccomend belaying off your harness. It will be easier to lock off a falling partner. Also stay tight on your anchor inorder not to shock load the anchor.

 

 

 

Again symplify your anchor use one cordlette. I would have extended the upper piece with a 2ft runner in order to bring that piece closer to the others.

 

It appears that you could have maybe used a smaller nut on the second piece down so that it was not so close to the edge of the crack, but to have it placed deeper in the crack, tuft is not so tough. If the crack was not that deep it might have been better to place all your pieces in the the crack on the right since it appears that those pieces are well inside the crack. With the second piece down too I might have tried placing a small nut in the thin crack to the right. When placing pieces in a crack that is a block in the crack I like pieces on either side of that block (this does not seem to be one of those cases, just food for thought).

 

 

Again sliding X or cordlette system until you familarize self more with other systems. Again I would reccomend belaying off your harness. Also stay tight on the anchor.

 

 

 

On the top piece I would have used a biner instead of a draw. If you were trying to extend it to make equalization easier you should have used longer runner than a draw and from the looks of it you could have to extend both of the upper pieces to make equalization easier.

 

In that section of rock I would have not been to worried about having those two pieces too close to each other. It appears to be somewhat solid rock with no factures around the crack.

 

It appears the second piece down does not have a girth hitch in it, if the upper was to blow out, then the second piece would be shock loaded. The lowest pieces does not seem to be loaded, that means if your upper pieces ripped it would create a pretty good shock load for your lowest piece.

 

Again simplify things by using a sliding X or cordlette system until you familarize yourself with better more complicated methods.

 

 

 

 

Summary:

* Practice more and study the book (not just read it)

* Equalize your anchor and keep it loaded to prevent shock loading

* Keep things simple it is easier make mistakes when you can't see what is going on

[hafilax]

'Shock loading' (I hate that term) is not an issue if there is a dynamic element in the system which is why I usually attach myself to the anchor with the rope. The biggest reason to limit extension IMO is so that if one piece fails the belayer won't fall off the ledge or get pulled off balance.