Tieton - Royal Columns Ratings

[AR_Guy]

OK, to start, I KNOW that everything at Royal Columns is sandbagged a grade or two compared to Vantage. But, what I'm writing about is an inconsistency in the ratings of some of the lower grade routes, specifically Western Front as compared to The Apprentice.

 

In the Yoder / Ford guide book, Tieton River Rocks, both are listed as 5.3. Well, having just climbed both on Saturday, I can say, that unless I royally screwed up on the Apprentice (which, as a newb leader, I must admit the possibility), that there is NO WAY that the two routes should have the same rating.

 

I'll also apologize to the folks who were there when I got back down - the string of curses I let loose was inexcusable, but reflected my frustration with what I perceive to be a bad mis-rating of The Apprentice.

 

WF is a fair Tieton 5.3 (which is probably 5.4 to 5.5 at Vantage). The Apprentice however is no where near a Tieton 5.3. I'd give it a Vantage 5.8 rating (which I suppose would be a Tieton 5.6 or 5.7). The group in front of us on Saturday also thought it went at about 5.8. The gal following that group couldn't climb through the upper off width part and lowered off. In addition, the book says gear to 2". Without the #4 Camalot I placed, I would have been screwed on the upper part (I aided on it). I also used a #3 lower on the route. This route was a far more difficult lead for me compared to 7 Virgins and a Mule (5.7 at Vantage).

 

I also led Slacker and Good Timer, both fairly rated Tieton 5.4's (5.5 to 5.6 at Vantage), and both VERY fun routes to climb - I'd give 'em 3 stars. Nimble Novice at a Tieton 5.5 (probably a Vantage 5.6) was also entertaining (fair at 1 star), but not as fun as Good Timer and Slacker.

 

I guess what I'm trying to say is: New leaders be warned. The Apprentice at Royal Column's is not a 5.3 beginner friendly route in this newb trad leaders opinion. Try Western Front, Slacker and Good Timer instead (all are comparable in difficulty to Chapstick, 5.6, on Sunshine Wall at Vantage).

 

[catbirdseat]

Are you absolutely certain you were on the right route?

[sprocket]

I remember my first trip to Tieton. Climbs included Nimble Novice and the Apprentice plus another "easy" climb on the far end of Royal Columns. I can't remember which was which but I remember them as 5.5 with offwidth finish, 5.5 with roof and 5.3 broken column that if you finished to the walk-off actually went 5.6 finger crack, I think this was the Apprentice and I thought it was close to 5.6. Without my book in front of me can't comment to much other thant to say two of the people I was with had to be "rescued" with ropes lowered from above to finish the two 5.5 climbs. One thing of note, I've read that some of the current ratings are inflated from the original. Experience has shown me that at Tieton andything rated below 5.9 is a crap shoot.

[catbirdseat]

I have a theory about why Tieton seems so difficult for new leaders. In most other climbing areas of similar rating there are lots and lots of faceholds one can use, even though you are protecting in a crack. Because of this, you are not forced to jam. Now at Tieton there are far fewer face holds and you have no choice but to jam. If you are familiar with jamming, you will be very comfortable leading because you can rest on a jam. If you can't jam, you will find even easy routes very difficult.

[Peter_Puget]

Perhaps another reason is that Vantage and X38 are extremely over rated.

[catbirdseat]

I don't think that's true to the extent that a lot of people say it is. There are a handful of really popular routes at those places that have super soft ratings and people assume the entire area is the same way. Having said that, Exit 38 and Vantage are soft, those areas are indeed soft. Tieton is sandbagged even compared to Index, at least in the easier grades.

[fenderfour]

I think this happens when a 5.12 climber establishes a 5.4 climb. How the hell do they know what a 5.4 is?

 

I'm not a good climber and I don't think I would know the difference between 5.0 and 5.4. It's all "low fifth" to me.

[MCash]

Tieton is sandbagged even compared to Index, at least in the easier grades.

 

No way! Compare a Tieton 5.8 like Ed's Jamb to Aires. Ed's Jamb is much much easier. How about a 5.9. Compare Sagitarious to Jamb Exam. Not even close, Sag is WAY harder.

[Peter_Puget]

Where is Sagg rated 5.9?

[MCash]

I thought the Cummins Guide said 5.9+. I'll check tonight.

[catbirdseat]

Sagg is the mother of all sandbags.

[AR_Guy]

CBS - With respect to the question of being on the correct route, yes, I was, without a doubt. I had the guide book in front of me when looking up at the route. The picture was pretty clear. Route 59, the Sorcerer, starts on The Apprentice, then at the broken top goes up the double cracks to the right. This was a very easy feature to spot, so I knew I was on the correct route.

 

Saber on Castle Rock is what, 5.4 or 5.5? I followed that one only a month, month and a half ago. The Apprentice is WAY more difficult than Saber - easily several grades harder. Is Saber a fair reference for its grade?

 

Up high on the route, the crack is off width - no chance to jam it without stacking. The other routes I did had some very nice jams - with my hand jammies on, I jammed where I could (I had some killer hand and fist jams) and used face holds, edges in the cracks, fissures and the like where there where I couldn't jam.

 

As I mentioned, I thought Good Timer and Slacker, both 5.4 in the book, were about the same difficulty as each other (eg - consistent rating), and given the reputation for Tieton being sandbagged, fairly rated (and pretty good newb leads at that).

 

What I take issue with, is that Western Front and The Apprentice are both rated at 5.3. In my opinion, these two routes are not the same difficulty - not even close. Someone who doesn't know this could get themselves into trouble high up on the route, without the gear to protect the upper parts of the climb (the book says gear to 2", up high, I needed the #4 Camalot I had).

[sobo]

AR-

You're not alone in your thinking. Every year or two, a few n00b leaders fall out of those climbs down on the far left end and break an ankle or something worse. It's not uncommon to hear your rant.

 

But what I wanna know is, why do you even own a set of hand jammies? WTF?

[AR_Guy]

Yeah, I know there's whining in my statement, but..... I don't think I would have tried to lead that climb if its grade was consistent for the area.

 

Re the jammies: Easier than taping the backs of the hands...... One thing at a time for me. I'm not hard core enough (yet....)

[catbirdseat]

What is needed is a "Noobs Guide to Royal Columns" with all the ratings based on a consensus from new leaders.

[sobo]

Yeah, I know there's whining in my statement, but..... I don't think I would have tried to lead that climb if its grade was consistent for the area.

 

Re the jammies: Easier than taping the backs of the hands...... One thing at a time for me. I'm not hard core enough (yet....)

 

I'm not trying to tell how you should progress, but I can say that if you ditch the jammies now, you'll get hard core a lot faster. Things like jammies lead to a false sense of security (kinda like too much TR-ing before you jump on the sharp end) and it will become more and more difficult to chuck those crutches as time goes on. My $0.02

[roboboy]

the string of curses I let loose was inexcusable

 

It may have been inexcusable but it was definitely worthwhile and entertaining

[Peter_Puget]

I thought the Cummins Guide said 5.9+. I'll check tonight.

 

He shows 5.9+ getting to the first anchor. First meaning about 40' off the deck. Seems right to me. I don't think I would call that a pitch.

[dkemp]

Boy, all this talk makes me wanna go climb a crack. I love crack climbing.

[catbirdseat]

I thought the Cummins Guide said 5.9+. I'll check tonight.

 

He shows 5.9+ getting to the first anchor. First meaning about 40' off the deck. Seems right to me. I don't think I would call that a pitch.

Call it what you will, I wouldn't think that rope drag would let you continue above that hanging belay.

[Peter_Puget]

I thought the Cummins Guide said 5.9+. I'll check tonight.

 

He shows 5.9+ getting to the first anchor. First meaning about 40' off the deck. Seems right to me. I don't think I would call that a pitch.

Call it what you will, I wouldn't think that rope drag would let you continue above that hanging belay.

 

HUH? I can say I have never stopped there (or pulled the rope thru) despite climbing the route at least 100 times.

[glassgowkiss]

ratings- who cares- it's just numbers. talking about numbers- there is a vast numbers of numb nut morons dropping ropes on your head without any warning. the number of rattle snakes and helmet wearing mountie types is almost equal. one group of crawlers belongs there, the other doesn't.

and what's up with endless topropes? like a party of 10 hangs 3 ropes and blocks cliff entire day. sneaking from above and dropping a rope on someone's head is LAME!

[Alpinfox]

Boy, all this talk makes me wanna go climb a crack. I love crack climbing.

 

Doxey is one of my heros.

 

Best attitude on this whole website.

 

[Kat_Roslyn]

glassgowkiss,

Who sneaked above and dropped a rope on your head? That is funny!!!

[canadug]

Climbed at Tieton the last couple of weekends and the ratings are a little bit stiff. The area is full of rattlesnakes and ticks. Stay away!!!!