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Potter Climbs Delicate Arch

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Do you think when Ed Abbey was living in a trailer there in the early 60's before they paved the road, that anyone cared if you climbed Delicate Arch?

 

I wonder how many cameras Abbey would have had there to film the climb? My guess is that if he were to climb it (and it was illegal then) he would have made it more of a challenge....like climbing it chalkless, sit start, by the moonlight. tongue.gif

 

Really, beyond the repercussions this may have on climbing access in Arches, doing an illegal climb, filming it, and publicizing it is just stupid...unless you're above the law.

 

Reminds me of a TR on this board wink.gif

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He may have had some witnesses and video cameras but I doubt he had a GPS log so his speed record is still "disputed".

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doing an illegal climb, filming it, and publicizing it is just stupid...unless you're above the law.

 

It says he didnt beleive it was illegal..

 

Potter believed that as long as he used no fixed anchors and did not damage the rock, he was free to climb Delicate Arch.

 

Then doesnt joss go one to say if there is a misunderstanig in the way the law is written they will change it..

 

The intent of our [regulations] is that all named arches are closed to climbing," Joss said. "If the compendium is found not to be sufficient, we will work with our solicitor

 

sounds like it was all a big misunderstanding.. confused.gif

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How many irresponsible tourists want to climb a building because they see Alain Robert do it?

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doing an illegal climb, filming it, and publicizing it is just stupid...unless you're above the law.

 

It says he didnt beleive it was illegal..

 

Potter believed that as long as he used no fixed anchors and did not damage the rock, he was free to climb Delicate Arch.

 

Then doesnt joss go one to say if there is a misunderstanig in the way the law is written they will change it..

 

The intent of our [regulations] is that all named arches are closed to climbing," Joss said. "If the compendium is found not to be sufficient, we will work with our solicitor

 

sounds like it was all a big misunderstanding.. confused.gif

 

true, probably not "prosecutable" illegal... but it will be shortly. was potter blissfully unaware that his actions might have repercussions that might screw us all in relation to climbing access?

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That was my first impression. If the reg's aren't clear, then its the Park's fault, not Dean's.

I'm guessing it may come down to the defition of 'climbing' and that the park service definition of climbing requires rope protection and anchors none of which potter had.

 

This will only 'screw us for access' if we let it.

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i bet dean has been browsing the different online climbing forums and thought that we all needed something new to spray about. what a giver.

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Maybe Dean was confused in selecting what he climbed... Delicate Arch is hardly "delicate" and in no risk of falling down in the next millenium. On the other hand "Landscape Arch" does appear to be delicate. I always thought they got the names mixed up, especially how Delicate Arch frames the white capped La Sal mountains in the background while Landscape Arch frames nothing significan or spectacular.

 

http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:a_...pe-arch_big.jpg

 

Just thread drift......

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It could be that, the compendium listing arches off limits to climbing was "voluntary" like climbing during certain periods sacred to Natives at Devil's Tower. Or maybe it didn't have an enforceability provision or something.

 

If so, its just as irresponsible of Dean to climb the Arch, maybe even more so than if it were enforceably illegal. The onus is on him to understand the regs before climbing and filming it for the digi.

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Shit man maybe he did it DELIBERATELY as a protest against the Tool. Ever think of that? FREE CHONGO!

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The onus is on him to understand the regs before climbing and filming it for the digi.

 

To me it sounds as if the climbing ranger himself doesnt know the regs..

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If there was a question about access, he would have asked. He did this knowing in full that it was against the rules.

 

What a rebel thumbs_down.gif

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and he didnt so... maybe he didnt have a question about access, which is what he said in the article..

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Thinking about it

 

Use to highly respect DP on many levels and for many reasons. Just from things I've read and heard from others I respect who bumped into him here or there, I had high regard for the dude. If the facts as presented are accurate, not any longer.

 

It tears my 2 sides some, and this is the same debate we are having @ Beacon Rock right now on another forum on CC.com regarding "The Rules" (See Oregon Cascades thread).

 

I don't have an answer. Don't have 1/2 the answer or a start of the first part of the answer either.

 

If true, had DP not intentionally trying to make money on this climb (as indicated by the film crew and the Patagonia press release -later retracted), I'd have a different opinion.

 

So to recap a worst case guess, it appears that Potter was intentionally breaking the rules to make money. If they decide to close that area to all future rock climbing now, then that is indeed a very poor choice that will F* over many many people.

 

It doesn't fit in with what I know about Dean Potter though, so I have some confusion and would want to give him the benefit of the doubt.

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It seems to me that this was not some sort of protest climb by Potter. He's not saying we should open Delicate Arch as a climbing crag. (If he is trying to say that, he's a fool. He does not understand how the public thinks of this feature.)

 

Instead, Potter appears to be making a personal statement. He's saying it's okay for him to climb it. He's special. He's "conscientious about natures rules." He "respected the arch to the fullest." Whether the regulations were unclear is irrelevant, because he made no apologies for what he did.

 

For this, Potter is employed by Patagonia as an "ambassador." Does Patagonia care what sort of impression their ambassadors make? If they do, they should sack him.

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I can't think of one park or scenic area managed by the NPS that doesn't have a mega monster visitor center pedaling trinkets and a double wide asphalt hiking trails that runs a 1/4 mile from the Walmart sized parking lot to the attraction so every overweight mouth breathing red blooded 'merican can waddle up and gape at some national treasure that they are ignorantly killing with their CO2 emissions from their 40' RV w/ matching trailer that is back in the parking lot idling so the AC can run.

Is this true for the North Cascades National Park as well? It seems to me they do a pretty good job of keeping the area rugged and remote, and are pretty supportive of climbing (unless you sacrafice a piece of devil's club to the climbing gods hahaha.gif), and on many occasions have saved our asses when things go wrong. The visitor center is pretty low impact as well. Perhaps the Cascade Pass parking lot or the Ross Lake Recreation area may fit your description? If so, considering the other 98% of the park is designated wilderness I don't think they try to attract too many of the people you describe. Then again, it is one of the least visited national parks in the country (thankfully).

 

bigdrink.gif

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It seems to me that this was not some sort of protest climb by Potter. He's not saying we should open Delicate Arch as a climbing crag. (If he is trying to say that, he's a fool. He does not understand how the public thinks of this feature.)

 

Instead, Potter appears to be making a personal statement. He's saying it's okay for him to climb it. He's special. He's "conscientious about natures rules." He "respected the arch to the fullest." Whether the regulations were unclear is irrelevant, because he made no apologies for what he did.

 

For this, Potter is employed by Patagonia as an "ambassador." Does Patagonia care what sort of impression their ambassadors make? If they do, they should sack him.

 

Lowell apparently you missed the part where Patagonia called the newspapers to report their ambassador's rad new send. They'd be hypocrites to suddenly drop him and pretend they didn't know what was going on. They are probably the ones that asked him to do it in the first place. wave.gif

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There is nothing unclear about the regs: If it has a name on the 7.5 USGS, don't climb it.

 

I'd wager that the literally hundreds of thousands, if not millions of pro and amatuer photogs and tourons who photograph the feature each year would have their experience seriously compromised by some climber clowns on the arch. This feature is an icon for millions who couldn't care less if you're climbing on the 3 gossips or the penguins, but DO care if you're on this Arch.

 

If you felt the need in your soul to climb the fucker, why not do it at night, when nobody was there and shut the fuck up about it instead of spraying it all over the media where it will surely negatively impact climbers in the perception of land managers...the very people who can screw us the hardest.

 

Is there a shortage of rock in the greater Moab area? Not when I lived down there. WTF is Patagonia thinking?

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Damn, you're right will...there it is. Seems pretty unambigious to me:

 

http://www.nps.gov/arch/climb.htm

 

Climbing

 

The rock at Arches offers excellent climbing opportunities, despite its sandy nature. Most climbing routes in the park require advanced techniques. Permits are not required, unless the trip involves an overnight stay in the backcountry.

 

It the responsibility of all climbers to know and obey park regulations and route closures.

 

Rock climbing guides to Arches and the surrounding area are available at the visitor center and through the bookstore.

 

Regulations

 

1. Use of motorized drills is prohibited.

2. Climbing is prohibited on any arch identified on current USGS 7.5 minute topographical maps; on Balanced Rock year-round; on Bubo from January 1st to June 30th; on Industrial Disease on the Devil Dog Spire from January 1st to June 30th.

3. The use of chalk for climbing must be of a color which blends with the native rock.

4. Climbers are encouraged to employ clean-climbing ethics, leave dull-colored webbing when recovery is impossible, and access climbing routes via established trails, slickrock or sandy washes.

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Of course by "climbing" they must mean climbing upward with a rope , they certainly can't mean highball bouldering and then decending with a rope whilst being filmed in hi-def for IMMEDIATE RELEASE.

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I still wonder what the Park Superintendant was talking about when she said if climbers don't cooperate she will have her solicitor close Delicate Arch to climbing permanently. Wasn't it already closed permanently?

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