Missing Discussion of Outer Space Slowpokery

[Dru]

It's too bad this got eaten by the glitches.

 

Summary for those who missed it.

 

Party 1: got on O.S. for first ever multipitch gear route. 12 hours for 7 pitches+ descent. pOsted complaining about the ppl who told them they shouldn't have been there.

 

Party 2: one of the 5 parties tapped behind party #1. Reported Party #1 was pulling on gear, splitting pitches in half with gear belays, refusing to allow parties to pass, and epicing. Posted on here whining about slow parties, namely party #1.

 

Discuss

[archenemy]

Let's do the time warp again.

[Ireneo_Funes]

It didn't sound like there was any refusing to let parties get past on the part of Party #1. I thought the chief complaint voiced by Party #2 was just the overall slowpokitude of the other party.

 

Jason had the most thoughtful post on this discussion. If this is going to get rehashed I hope he puts his 2 cents in again.

[sk]

all i said was that when people want to pass me i totaly let them as long as they are not jerks... climbing and driving alike.

[catbirdseat]

You can't forget mattp's post about how the slow party has every bit as much right to be on the climb, etc., etc.

 

Dru, were they really on their first ever multipitch climb? Jeeze, what a choice!

[sk]

You can't forget mattp's post about how the slow party has every bit as much right to be on the climb, etc., etc.

 

Dru, were they really on their first ever multipitch climb? Jeeze, what a choice!

i have to agree. I think I would have chosen something else to hone my skills on.

[olyclimber]

Dru, are you revising history? I don't remember the 1st party (the slow ones) actually posting?

[Dru]

The first party posted in the Rock forum, the second party posted in the Climbers' Board.

[sk]

The first party posted in the Rock forum, the second party posted in the Climbers' Board.

he is right you know

[olyclimber]

Well, I missed that bit then. What avatar did they post under?

[sk]

Well, I missed that bit then. What avatar did they post under?

i am pretty sure it was one of yours

[tomtom]

Ouch.

[sk]

Ouch.

they don't call me the Wanker Sprayer for nuthin'

[olyclimber]

Well, I missed that bit then. What avatar did they post under?

i am pretty sure it was one of yours

I may be slow, but I'm not slow! Or at least I would let them by, you pass if you want to...just don't fart on me!

 

Anyway, I'm still not convinced that it wasn't dru posting to rile things up.

[sk]

i never said there was anything wrong with being slow.... I am SOOO SLOW but i am also FUN

[Phil K]

I authored the original whiney post complaining about the slowpokery. Hopefully not too whiney. I know that OS is a popular choice for people who feel compelled to climb something over their heads, but I was impressed with the choice of route as a first multi-pitch outing.

I don't know if the communications between the slowpokers and their neighbors was friendly or if there was any discussion of passing or not. I think they could have figgered it out for themselves, but that didn't happen. In self defense- I knew we were in for some waiting around time, and maintained a mellow attitude throughout, based on our calculation that at least we were not going to get suckered into doing the descent in the dark. Hey, and I got a kewl new nickname in the discussion that followed.

Edited May 11, 2005 by PHILONIUS

[RuMR]

i never said there was anything wrong with being slow.... I am SOOO SLOW but i am also FUN

 

in which way are you "SLOW"??

[fheimerd]

I was one of the people in the party originally complained about. I did post more to ask what to do in such a situation, not to complain about the other party. They seemed like nice enough guys and I know that waiting is never fun. To clear up some misconceptions... Was not our first ever multipitch climb. The only part that I feel we were excesivley slow on was in the 5.9 traverse, other than that we moved fairly quickly. We did split up one pitch into two on the suggestion of the climbers following us to limit rope drag and facilitate communication. There was also a party in front of us that we had to wait on for one of the last belay ledges. No-one ever asked us to pass if they would have we would definately let them pass. My thoughts on the subject are that we had no control over who started climbing behind us. Two groups were in front of us and when we started climbing there was one other behind us. I know I got up damn early to get an early start on the route because I knew it might be crowded. I wonder is their a limit to how many people should get on a route. Last I heard climbing is supposed to be about challenging yourself. That is what we did and feel we had every right to be on the route. The crags are to be shared by all climbers that come prepared and are safe. We were both prepared and safe. IE. in terms of the night walk out...some advice..I always bring a light just in case. My questions...is there a limit to how many people should get on a route? Who has the right of way? Is climbing about challenging yourself or about finding esay routes to breeze up?

[Mark_Husbands]

case closed in favor of fleimherd.

[olyclimber]

case closed in favor of fleimherd.

seconded.

[mec]

Thirded.

the rocks are getting more crowded every year. There is no use whining about it. Just deal with it, or pick up another sport and reduce the crowds for the rest of us. If you pick a popular route, such as Outer Space, you might get lucky and only see 2 or 3 other parties on the route, or you might get stuck behind someone who moves slower than you. Fact of life.

[Jason_Martin]

I was one of the people in the party originally complained about. I did post more to ask what to do in such a situation, not to complain about the other party. They seemed like nice enough guys and I know that waiting is never fun. To clear up some misconceptions... Was not our first ever multipitch climb. The only part that I feel we were excesivley slow on was in the 5.9 traverse, other than that we moved fairly quickly. We did split up one pitch into two on the suggestion of the climbers following us to limit rope drag and facilitate communication. There was also a party in front of us that we had to wait on for one of the last belay ledges. No-one ever asked us to pass if they would have we would definately let them pass. My thoughts on the subject are that we had no control over who started climbing behind us. Two groups were in front of us and when we started climbing there was one other behind us. I know I got up damn early to get an early start on the route because I knew it might be crowded. I wonder is their a limit to how many people should get on a route. Last I heard climbing is supposed to be about challenging yourself. That is what we did and feel we had every right to be on the route. The crags are to be shared by all climbers that come prepared and are safe. We were both prepared and safe. IE. in terms of the night walk out...some advice..I always bring a light just in case. My questions...is there a limit to how many people should get on a route? Who has the right of way? Is climbing about challenging yourself or about finding esay routes to breeze up?

 

Don't feel bad about it. You guys did fine.

 

And you're right. Walking out or doing a descent in the dark is all part of the game.

 

Jason

[scoe]

I was in the 2nd party behind fheimerd (not right behind) and I have to say that it was pretty ridiculous. While you guys may have had people in front of you, you never had to wait over an hour (it may have been close to two before the crux pitch) at multiple belays nor share it with four other parties (the fourth party bailed before the crux pitch). I just think you guys were in over your heads and the fact that you did not realize/nor acknowledge this was what upset me off the most. For me your pace would have been tolerable had I not known that you only started placing gear a month ago and that this was your second ever multi-pitch climb (you may want to keep that information to yourself the next time you have impatient climbers behind you). While I agree climbing is about challenging yourself I don’t think french freeing a route like outerspace, which occurred multiple times, is all that challenging. Also, don’t spend 30 minutes working on a piece when three parties have been nipping at your heals all day long. In your defense, I respect the fact that you did not get defensive when my partner had some “advice” for you and you seemed receptive to his opinion. Anyhow, no hard feelings.

[olyclimber]

I was in the 2nd party behind fheimerd (not right behind) and I have to say that it was pretty ridiculous. While you guys may have had people in front of you, you never had to wait over an hour (it may have been close to two before the crux pitch) at multiple belays nor share it with four other parties (the fourth party bailed before the crux pitch). I just think you guys were in over your heads and the fact that you did not realize/nor acknowledge this was what upset me off the most. For me your pace would have been tolerable had I not known that you only started placing gear a month ago and that this was your second ever multi-pitch climb (you may want to keep that information to yourself the next time you have impatient climbers behind you). While I agree climbing is about challenging yourself I don’t think french freeing a route like outerspace, which occurred multiple times, is all that challenging. Also, don’t spend 30 minutes working on a piece when three parties have been nipping at your heals all day long. In your defense, I respect the fact that you did not get defensive when my partner had some “advice” for you and you seemed receptive to his opinion. Anyhow, no hard feelings.

 

French freeing aside, you could just as well be blaming the party immediately in front of you for not passing them (and then allowing you to move up an pass them as well).

 

Anyway, this is good stuff!

[Peter_Puget]

Climb popular routes and sometimes you’ll get caught in a line up. Complaining about it is like saying: “I love being a doctor, I just hate working with people.”