I've been humbled

[Norman_Clyde]

I'm way late to post on this, because the thread exploded in length last week and I didn't have time at work to keep up with it. No recent posts from Anna, who I imagine is sick and tired of taking a beating.

This subject is hugely important. However, it is just not possible to do it justice in a web discussion. Hats off to Tim and Jon-- there is almost always a kernel of wheat in this pile of chaff--but this thread, with people getting mistaken impressions, taking offense, etc. just points out how much of our important communication takes place nonverbally. When threads get too hot there should be some kind of steam valve that shuts it down, forcing people to communicate the old way.

 

Anna, most of all you should forgive yourself for making an error. You have every right to be shaken up. I know for myself that it's more upsetting to feel like I took risks with others who trusted me, and clearly you feel bad about this also. But you did not act in bad faith toward anyone. It's up to all members of a climbing party to scope each other out beforehand. It's not like you tried to deceive anybody, or told any lies about yourself.

 

You should also forgive yourself for asking the members of this forum for advice. This was the emotional equivalent of rapelling off of someone else's ratty old sling tied to a shallow-rooted bush. Very risky, and in this case you did not luck out. Words of criticism on this board come out sounding very harsh, even if they're not meant to. In my opinion, even if you give up climbing, you should first give yourself the chance to attain mastery of the systems involved. Take a course from a patient, nonabusive guide, or hang out with a few patient, tolerant non-professionals. If you walk away at that point, you'll feel a whole lot better than if you quit now, after getting beaten down by the voices of criticism that, however well intended, were unnecessarily harsh on you in this forum.

[Dru]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tyrone Shoes:

With regards to Trask's statement:

 

quote:

Pick ONE frickin' name and stick with it through thick and thin. I figure if you have to hide to post some negitive or argumentative shit, you're not worth spit.

 

Thats a horseshit notion from the getgo. If you believe that then post your real name. I'd have more respect for ya.

 

In the mean time embrace your cloak of darkness like the rest of us, except DRU but you know what I think of that.

---

Turn that around Tyrone we will respect you more ifn you post your real name too.

[Anna]

God, I hope this is the last time I have to defend myself.

 

I am not reckless...really stupid when it comes to climbing, but not reckless by any means. I have fought wildland fire for eight seasons and have been a sawyer and a squadboss on a shot crew, even incident commander of several smaller fires....safety has always been first and foremost. I was trained and trained and trained again, I was asked to practice in the field and was tested constantly of what I should do in this situation or that. I rappelled out of helicopters for crying out loud..if that isn't risky and has a need for extreme vigilence!

 

In my climbing world, it was a sport not a passion, something I didn't do very often and took lightly (obviously the wrong approach, and for the 100th time, I have learned my lesson)

 

I am beginning to fly planes, yes just a beginner (for you trask), again a very risky endeavor...but I am going through the proper training to learn how to fly properly and safely and how to handle it correctly in case of even the slightest of irregularities.

 

I wasn't asking for sympathy, just to get it off my chest, i absorbed everyone's feedback...good and bad. I lost a friend out this whole thing but I think I am a better person now cuz I realize what an idiot I really was.

 

Oh and selbracher, I'm not a quitter, this feeling of giving climbing a rest has been coming on for a while now...maybe that explains the complacency?

 

Thanks Norman for your input. I just saw it as I was ready to post this one. I am glad I put this topic up though cuz then SK/JK never would have told me how they felt to my face.

 

Everyone quit posting now eh?

[Dru]

never this thread is just warming up. uit was dying off then tyrone and chippy did the "Dan Larson" (ref Muir on Saturday) which is like pouring gas on a campfire.Now if only someone will compare your experience to Al Gore or something then MtnGoat will start posting and the thread will reach 200 pages by next week

[Anna]

Well Dru, I guess I will ignore this thread from here on out...I've said all I need to say so if ya'll wanna fan the flames by making assumptions go right on ahead....

[iain]

ever put a can of kippered herring on a campfire after eating the herring? the results are spectacular

[RobBob]

I think the thing that makes this thread so interesting (besides trask playing nice-guy)is it shows how different personalities see the situation differently, communicate differently, and even take offense at others' communications because they perceive them as off-the-wall.

 

Norman, I think the criticisms were harshly communicated, and I think it's unfortunate if Anna has taken it personally. But on the other hand, I understand the point that if you believe you know a lot about flying, for instance, and you've just soloed for the first time, maybe your self-confidence and drive is notched up a tad too high for technically demanding pastimes where life hangs in the balance. When I board an airplane, I look into the cockpit and hope that the person in the left seat scores middle-of-the-road on emotional intensity, and mid- to high-range on intuition...but not too extreme. And I pray to God that it's not Kerouac's Dean Moriority at the helm!

[Fence_Sitter]

$50 for the lot... and a bottle o' jack!

[Dr_Flash_Amazing]

Dear Fence Sitter,

 

The Doctor will meet you on November 9th at 11 a.m. at the Jantzen Beach shopping center in front of the Home Depot to hand over the goods. Please bring cash, as DFA does not know you well enough to accept a check.

 

Thank you,

Dr. Flash Amazing

[chucK]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Fence Sitter:

if you cant runout 5.5, you shouldn't be on that climb...

My point exactly.

[Tyrone_Shoes]

Wow, some really good thoughts, Normal Clyd, RobBob, Chuck to name a few. Heaven forbit we get back on topic here.

 

to detour for a sec:

 

Dru, what?

--------------------------------------------------

Tyrone we will respect you more ifn you post your real name too.

--------------------------------------------------

 

I made it clear from the start, I repeat,

"I enjoy my anonymity" It's the only way the truth can be truly spoken freely. This is one of the cornerstones of a free society, we vote this way for crying out loud.

 

and Trask,

 

Who cares if you have been "known as Trask for over 40 years" to most of us you still have no identity, we don't know who you are? and that fine. Do try to keep up.

 

Glacier says to Anna,

 

"So think of this as a very rough debrief"

 

well said, and it's that simple. Use the info or not. This whole discussion is indeed a very intersting social experiment on how we process different forms of communication. Like I said, if you've met me. I bet you would think I'm an alright, polite and easygoing guy. (not to sound arrogant)

[allthumbs]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Dr Flash Amazing:

Dear Fence Sitter,

 

The Doctor will meet you on November 9th at 11 a.m. at the Jantzen Beach shopping center in front of the Home Depot to hand over the goods. Please bring cash, as DFA does not know you well enough to accept a check.

 

Thank you,

Dr. Flash Amazing

---

I shall be there also to dook in your Subaru and laugh in your face.

[RobBob]

Who in hell is doing to meet DFA in a parking lot at 11pm on Saturday night? What are they paying him for? I really must start reading these threads.

[Dr_Flash_Amazing]

quote:

---

Originally posted by trask:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Dr Flash Amazing:

Dear Fence Sitter,

 

The Doctor will meet you on November 9th at 11 a.m. at the Jantzen Beach shopping center in front of the Home Depot to hand over the goods. Please bring cash, as DFA does not know you well enough to accept a check.

 

Thank you,

Dr. Flash Amazing

---

I shall be there also to dook in your Subaru and laugh in your face.

---

Knock yourself out, it's Fence Sitter's Subie. Being one of the gun-toting set, he'll probably bust a cap in your ass, but whatever.

 

And RobBob, don't get too hot under the collar, bro; the rendezvous is at 11 ante meridian. The Doctor takes care of his evening business over on West Burnside St.

[Dru]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tyrone Shoes:

Wow, some really good thoughts, Normal Clyd, RobBob, Chuck to name a few. Heaven forbit we get back on topic here.

 

to detour for a sec:

 

Dru, what?

--------------------------------------------------

Tyrone we will respect you more ifn you post your real name too.

--------------------------------------------------

 

I made it clear from the start, I repeat,

"I enjoy my anonymity" It's the only way the truth can be truly spoken freely. This is one of the cornerstones of a free society, we vote this way for crying out loud.

 

---

I thought it funny you told trask you would respect him more if he wasnt anonymous

quote:

---

If you believe that then post your real name. I'd have more respect for ya.

---

but didnt feel the same about yourself. Shouldnt you have said trask's anonymity didnt affect your view of him at all, mr. consistency?

 

You can also speak the truth and not give a shit about what anyone thinks using your real name. Usually its when people have pointed, nasty comments they dont want to make straight to someone that they use an avatar. I dont care if anyone think that about me so i say it all from Dru. I just use avatars to promote spray by arguing with myself and sendin people weird PMs now and again

 

[ 11-04-2002, 02:20 PM: Message edited by: Dru ]

[jkrueger]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anna:

Thanks JK for breaking my heart...I will remember it always.

What Jason said in his posts about my "character" is what broke my heart

---

I would rather everybody hate me for telling the truth than anybody die because I didn't. It was not my intention to break your heart, just to be honest and point out that this incident seemed to be part of a bigger pattern. Simply put, it is my opinion that you have been unable to walk your talk, and do not wish to hear or act upon constructive criticism.

 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Norman Clyde:

It's not like you tried to deceive anybody, or told any lies about yourself.

---

She told ME she could set an anchor with the gear provided, when in fact, she could not! In my book, that's a deception and a lie.

 

quote:

---

Originally posted by trask:

I post as trask. It's my nickname and has been for over 40 years. I use it for everything; when I'm nice, and when I'm mean.

---

Liar. Hypocrite.

 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anna:

I am glad I put this topic up though cuz then SK/JK never would have told me how they felt to my face.

---

You should not concern yourself with what other people think of you. Only YOU know your own truth, who you are, and what you are capable of.

 

I told you, to your face, that you built a bad anchor, that you could have killed me, and that you needed more instruction. I cannot make someone listen to what they do not want to hear.

[Greg_W]

quote:

---

Originally posted by jkrueger:

I told you, to your face...

---

Now who's the liar? I've met both of you and I'd guess that you told it to her chin Just kidding, dude. Trask is no liar/hypocrite; he's Trask.

 

Greg W

[Tyrone_Shoes]

Dru....hmmmmm.....did I slip up? ah geeez...

 

Read it again, if you dont get it... read it again, if you still don't get, PM me and I'll give my cell number, I'll explain it to ya. Hows that for consistency?

[allison]

Perhaps he IS Trask, but he's other people too. Don't be deceived, he is not being honest.

 

Is anyone else getting assaulted by pop-up advertising while logged on to cc.com? This just started maybe in the last 24 hours.

 

Ms. Thread Drift has spoken.

[Tyrone_Shoes]

Jkrueger, good for you. You're bang on.

[Dru]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tyrone Shoes:

Dru....hmmmmm.....did I slip up? ah geeez...

 

Read it again, if you dont get it... read it again, if you still don't get, PM me and I'll give my cell number, I'll explain it to ya. Hows that for consistency?

---

I got it the first time. Youre saying you practice what you preach, he practices what he preaches, but youd respect him more if he preached what you practice or the other way around...

 

He Allison I never got no popup and I still don't but I used someone else's computer on the weekend, and they keep getting requests from Nrahq.com to add cookies to the computer while viewing this site???? You getting popups about guns?

[allthumbs]

quote:

---

Originally posted by allison:

Perhaps he IS Trask, but he's other people too. Don't be deceived, he is not being honest.

---

Show me some proof Matlock.

[allison]

No, not guns, just this and that, adverts.

 

And for some reson my 'pop-up-stopper' program doesn't want to launch either!

[allthumbs]

quote:

---

Originally posted by allison:

No, not guns, just this and that, adverts.

And for some reson my 'pop-up-stopper' program doesn't want to launch either!

---

Like everyone else, your computer doesn't like you.

[Dru]

Sounds like you picked up a Virus.

 

And your 'page topper' program must not have been working either.

 

[ 11-04-2002, 02:52 PM: Message edited by: Dru ]