Terminal_Gravity Posted August 18, 2003 Posted August 18, 2003 Anybody know of a small, simple, atc like, rapple device made out of steel? or any metal that wont turn my rope and hands black and wear out fast on a bunch of long rappels. (Steel 'biners are easy to find) Thanks in advance Quote
Bronco Posted August 18, 2003 Posted August 18, 2003 How about a biner brake outa all steel biners? I'm sure you already thought of this, but, watchout for the steel heating up and possibly melting stuff. It doesn't dissapate heat near as well as Aluminum. Quote
lummox Posted August 18, 2003 Posted August 18, 2003 clean your ropes if your rap device keeps getting worn. or are you climbing on sandstone a lot? the only steel rap device i ever seen is one of them bars that cavers use. it looks like a giant safety pin with bars that the rope is woven through. heavy. Quote
iain Posted August 18, 2003 Posted August 18, 2003 rappel racks are great for long raps! better than ANY climbing-oriented rap device. it is certainly not small and simple though... Quote
Terminal_Gravity Posted August 18, 2003 Author Posted August 18, 2003 I hate rappel racks for their bulk, but thanks for the tip. Great point, Bronco, about heat dissipation. The heat generated on even a full relativly slow single rope rap is enough to make me nervous. If it gets hot enough I feel like I can't stop for fear of starting to melt the rope. Any comments on that. It is my understanding that the bulk of the potental enegy is acctually absorbed by the friction between the fibers of the kern. Scary thought. I'm sure an all steel biner brake would work, and I did think of it, but maybe the brake rack is the way to go, for heat reasons. Saturday I rappeled (and climbed) 3200 feet and by the end of the day I was covered in aluminum dust, and my main locker was worn enough to be retired to leaver biner status, even though I took it very easy on the raps. I started with a very clean, almost new 60m 9.4 and used a BD atc. The ATC was worn but not too badly. I want to do a vertical mile in a couple of weeks but I have to find a better rap altenative. cheers - steve Quote
Sphinx Posted August 18, 2003 Posted August 18, 2003 For no approach, high rappell wear situations, one of those steel rescue figure-8s might be good. You wore out a biner with 30 raps? Sounds strange. I've been using my ATC and munter biner for two or three years, must be at least ten times the wear. What model and brand is your biner? Quote
Terminal_Gravity Posted August 18, 2003 Author Posted August 18, 2003 BD mini pear biner; And it was only 17 full 190' raps. It did have a small amount of wear before hand. It was a hot day and the heat to the devices seemed pretty extreme. Maybe that increased the wear rate. The vast majority of my rap experience has been with the typical two ropes. I suspect that a single rope rap puts a lot more than twice the wear on the biner. Quote
Sphinx Posted August 18, 2003 Posted August 18, 2003 Hmmm. Still sounds weird. I'd email BD. Seems like the AL used in the biner is kinda soft for this purpose. You self-belayed for your El Cap day? Quote
rbw1966 Posted August 18, 2003 Posted August 18, 2003 Steve-- I worked on a lawsuit involving a fellow who used steel biners to do speed rappells as he had learned in the Army (I might have mentioned this to you before). I highly recommend you NOT use steel. The heat factor will case your harness to fail before the ropes fail. I can go over the details in person if you want. Quote
Terminal_Gravity Posted August 18, 2003 Author Posted August 18, 2003 Sphinx said: Hmmm. Still sounds weird. I'd email BD. Seems like the AL used in the biner is kinda soft for this purpose. You self-belayed for your El Cap day? Yeah, the ushba basic ascender was butter smooth. I never fell though, the hardest shit I was on was only .10c...nothing like the real El Cap. Thanks for the tip RBW Quote
snoboy Posted August 18, 2003 Posted August 18, 2003 3 points 1) All the rappell racks I have looked at (Petzl and ???) have aluminum bars... 2) I thnk that steel is harder than Aluminum (duh! ) which might make for less friction than aluminum devices. 3) How about a Gri Gri? It has a larger surface area that the rope runs on, possibly decreasing the rate of wear. It might not help with the dirt problem on your ropes and hands, but you wouldn't be burning up your biner. A friend of mine uses his for cleaning routes quite extensively, and his has lasted years of use on gritty wet tropes. Quote
IceIceBaby Posted August 19, 2003 Posted August 19, 2003 If you hate the rack get the Petzl STOP or any other bobbins devices although I still like the rack alot better Quote
Dru Posted August 19, 2003 Posted August 19, 2003 re the steel vs aluminum thing lets get the gear geeks now debating properties of other brake bars. brake bars would be easy to cnc machine from a rod of just about any substance titanium? solid sterling silver? depleted uranium? some exotic hardwood? ivory? basalt? camembert? lets hear the pros and cons!!! Quote
Phil K Posted August 22, 2003 Posted August 22, 2003 Chouinard used to sell an item called the Seilbremse ("rope brake" in German. ) It's a small steel device similar to a figure eight, originally made for evacuations from stuck ski lifts. It is used like an eight for belaying or rappelling. You might be able to pick one up at some used gear places, or even find 'em on the web. In fact, I've got one in my basement, lightly used. You want? Quote
Terminal_Gravity Posted August 22, 2003 Author Posted August 22, 2003 I'm looking into Camembert brakes, but as a back-up plan, I'd like to get your device, if you don't mind selling it to me. PM me if you would. Thanks, Philonius. Quote
Ursa_Eagle Posted August 22, 2003 Posted August 22, 2003 what about brake bars? they're already round! Quote
Dru Posted August 22, 2003 Posted August 22, 2003 and the friction heat from the rappel would give you bbq Quote
Terminal_Gravity Posted August 22, 2003 Author Posted August 22, 2003 Barbequed Horsecock with melted Camembert...mmmmmmm. Quote
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