CascadeClimber

Dane, for what it's worth, I got my solo app turned around in two days in January. Emailed it in, got an email reply from Stefan. I have no issue with the ranger staff being cut. There is functionally no staff in the winter, and in the summer they rely on guide service staff for SAR anyway. I'm not sure what their stated or actual role on the upper mountain is, and I know I've never missed NPS staff when there weren't around on my Rainier trips. But my idea of a great Rainier trip is seeing no other people outside my partner(s). I certainly don't want the NPS or anyone else CLOSING the mountain due to conditions, which is where I think we'll end up if this silly talk about "where were the rangers?" and "why isn't there a helicopter on standby at Paradise?" talk continues every time there is a serious incident on the upper mountain. People sometimes choose not to register because registration is closed when they start their climb. I've done several one-day solos and the stations are closed when that sort of a climb begins. Stefan brought back self-registration in the winter, which helps in these situations without causing overcrowding in the camps. Maybe there is a way to do something similar in the summer for single-push ascents, or those on uncrowded routes. And again, this thread should be split in two.

All the chest-beating in this thread should be moved to another thread or deleted. I don't think it has any place in a thread about a missing and now presumed dead climber.

Sending thoughts and energy to those missing and those searching. I've been saying for weeks that this spring's weather pattern has set us up for unusually high spring avy danger (for around here). Be careful out there, folks.

Exactly. First you screw up the signage, then you make a big public/media deal blaming people for not paying attention to the signage that didn't actually exist, then you find out what really happened. Ready, fire, aim. All I'm saying is make the same effort to get the word out that WADOT made an error that contibuted to the situation as they did to blame climbers before they had all the info. And yeah, they do a lot of work to open the road. But that's pretty much their freaking job. Just because their job is to plow a road that gets us early access to that area doesn't make them immune from criticism. And personally, I think it's a big-ass waste of money to clear that particular road so early. I know that won't be popular here, but my daughter got detention yesterday for bringing her mathbook home. Apparently there aren't enough books for each student to use one. And if I could choose between effing math books and plowing and then shelling the hell out of Highway 20, well, that's an easy choice.

Heads up: If last Saturday is any indication, good luck trying to find a parking spot at that TH at Noon on a nice weekend days.

Anyone want to clip some bolts at 38 this afternoon (5/12)? 5.8-10a or so. I'm in shitty rock shape, but can lead in that range. I can probably escape around 2-3 PM. Newbies welcome, as long as you can belay safely and clean an anchor.

Ready fire aim on the part of WSDOT for blaming the climbers before they had all the info. How about issuing a public retraction?

Good, humble TR. Had an adventure, stayed within your limits, and came home safe, if a little frost-nipped in unfortunate places. Thanks!

Light to moderate wear, still have plenty of summits in them. $75. Cash only, you pick up. Email loren@casadeclimber.com

I climbed Castle and Pinnacle last Sunday (along with what seemed to be the entirety of the BoeAlps). The road has been cleared past Reflection Lakes and was mostly dry, but still gated. Skiing was mostly wind-packed powder with some heavier stuff near the lake. The couloirs on Lane looked to be in fine shape, in fact we considered heading over to Lane after Pinnacle. There were snowshoe tracks at the bend in the road that appeared to be headed to Lane- my guess is that it got climbed last weekend.

Stupid humans. We yearn for wilderness and adventure, but when we find it we immediately begin destroying it. "What a beautiful, remote place. If only it had a hut, gondola, cell service..." Adventure and guaranteed safety are antithetical.

They plow the Cascade Lakes Highway, but they do so from the other end, so the section from Bachelor to the South Sis TH is the last to open.

It was almost seven years ago; I remember a small basin area just below the top and bleeding all over the place, and not a lot else. Sorry.

I've never added it up, but I bet more people have died between Paradise and Muir than everywhere else on the mountain combined. Nav is straightforward when vis is good, but it turns into the Bermuda Triangle in a whiteout- so very easy to get lost and/or into a very bad place.

Cell phones calls to 911 are handled differently than calls to order pizza, in terms of routing through towers on which your provider has no roaming privileges. There is a big glide crack that has formed below Muir at the end of the last few summers. In August it's been big enough to fall into, but it would be disconcerting if it was open now. I talked to a ranger last weekend who was involved in the incident but didn't think to ask him exactly where they fell.

Yes. Not enough coffee yet. Thanks for the correction. Gash caused by sharp talus and operator error 200 yards from the start of the route.

Jens and I climbed that route on July 20, 2003. I don't remember thinking any of it was remotely classic, but I was distracted by this little gift that the approach gave me: Our first aid kit was one band-aid and a bottle of ibuprofen, so we employed the the socks. Had blood gurgling out of my left rock shoe every step up the route. A couple more: Old 1/4" bolt with ring piton and tat Jens on the route.

That's the correct one. The gully at the top of the NF is WRONG. You have to go up and over one hump (toward the NEB route) to get to the correct descent. Simply walk down the gully in this picture and you will end up at the top of the second (steeper and corniced) gully that has the two-pin rap anchor. There is no reason to leave the first gully; it ends at the next one.

You're comparing one smallish mountain with a road to the top to the entirety of the Cascades? It's an different scene out here: Trails without railings, roads with unguarded cliffs, huge wilderness areas with few rangers, and entire mountains without gully by gully forecasts. If you want more of an amusement park experience (i.e. highly managed risk), this is the wrong coast. If you want opportunity to be self-sufficient in big, wild areas, then welcome to and enjoy the Cascades. NWAC gives us a general idea of what's up, but the truth is that you can be entirely safe on one slope, then go around a corner and get whacked. That's the nature of avalanches and that's why experienced people get caught- it's just not an exact science.

To finish this route without roped climbing: 1. Approx 100 vertical feet below the headwall/highpoint of the snowfield, leave the snow and gain the ridge crest via a short (30ish feet) class 3/4 scramble on climber's left. 2. Follow the ridge crest (class 2/3) until you can exit climber's left onto slabs. 3. Scramble the slabs (class 2) to the summit. In a normal winter the brush below the couloir is completely snow-covered and you can ski the couloir all the way to the trail.

Just a reminder about these two popular routes: The descent route is very prone to sliding, especially after you exit the second gully into the broad basin. Indeed, the tallest avy crown I've ever seen was in the basin, well over 15 feet in places. That day there were truck-sized blocks of snow not far from the Thumb Tack. I've also heard, but not seen first-hand, of the lower part of the north face fracturing and sliding to the rock below. Lastly, though the new approach route that goes right into the trees above Source Lake before the bottleneck in the gully is safer (used to go directly up the gully), that gully slides into the flats just above the lake with some frequency, across the approach. Have fun out there...and be safe.

To quote Don Serl, "The worst possible style is to fall". Better to rap that be the subject of a SAR. Period.

http://www.oregonlive.com/news/index.ssf/2009/12/couple_stranded_3_days_in_east.html First of all, I'm glad the people were found and are safe. I suggest everyone contact the Oregonian/OregonLive and ask them to treat this incident as they did the Mt. Hood incident. This is an opportunity to shed some light on the fact that climbers are not the only ones who get lost and need SAR and that these services are provided without charge to motorists, hunters, boaters, etc. In this specific incident, they turned onto a forest service road at the behest of their car-GPS and proceeded to drive 35 miles up the snow-covered road until they got stuck.

What I should have said is that things like cell phones and MLUs take away from *my* experience, or rather, the experience I desire, which is wild, untrammeled wilderness. And the difference between cell phones and MLUs, and an avy transceiver and GPS is that the latter two make backcountry travelers more self-sufficient and the former two tend to make us less self-sufficient. I don't want to carry an MLU, even if it weighs an ounce, which they don't. Just like I don't go near the south sides of Hood or Rainier in the summer. I detest crowds as they take away from the wilderness experience *I* desire, as does some technology. These are my choices and preferences and I'm not saying they do or should apply to everyone. And *that* is my overall point: What is a good choice for one person is a poor choice for another. "Safely" equipped parties have died on Slipstream while "unsafe" parties (Twight) have soloed it in a few hours. There is no one 'right' rule here and trying to force one won't result in anything postitive. So those of you who want MLUs go get them. I for one understand and do not begrudge you that choice, but please also try to find some respect for people who make other choices. For what it's worth I feel the same way about seat belts and motorcycle/bike helmets. I choose to use them, but also believe it should be a choice, not a mandate. Lastly, if we are forced to use MLUs then the damn hunters and ORV people ought to be included in the requirement, too.

I don't see how 'body recovery' is salient to the MLU mandate discussion. I'm not aware of any public money being spent to search for bodies once the initial search has been 'suspended' (at least missing bodies of climbers). It might sound macabre, but if I'm dead, I'm done with my body and if it remains on a mountain I'll have no argument. Personally, I don't want to use a locator. I don't want to carry one, buy one, or deal with yet more red tape by being forced to rent one. Nor do I want any sort of expansion of the in-person registration systems used at Mts. Rainier and St. Helens. I already carry a cell phone and often a GPS and avy transceiver and those things take enough away from the experience. Requiring heavy equipment in an activity where speed often increases safety and weight always decreases speed is a mistake. Yes, we expect some form of rescue effort if we have incidents in the mountains. Just like tourists expect a rescue if they drive off a narrow mountain road. Fire, police, and paramedic services are provided free (funded by taxes) for the public, even when the public makes a mistake...in a car, a boat, an airplane, skiing, snowmobiling, paragliding and yes, climbing. And just like those things, medical services are for-pay. I have several friends who've had climbing incidents turn into medical bill approaching $100,000. The incidents in our sport tend to be sensationalized and therefore act as a lightning rod for the criticisms of the La-Z-Boy nation. We're not going to change that because they don't understand our behavior, just like we don't understand theirs. Also, we tend to be poorly organized and so we don't do a good job on lobbying and PR like the snowmobilers do, so our public image just flaps around in the wind. But to the folks here advocating for mandatory equipment, I am telling you this is a very, very slippery slope that, if implemented, will not end with MLUs. Before long it will include shelter, sleeping bags, stoves, ropes, etc, even for one-day ascents. We'll be required to adhere to someone's idea of 'safest', and I cringe at what that will do to climbing. Lastly, there is simply no way to mandate or legislate safe behavior into climbing. Trying to do so just creates a significant burden without tangible benefit.