tvashtarkatena

This is an amazing re-run of the 'yes they do/no they don't' Iraq fiasco. I couldn't believe Bush could be stupid enough to invade Iraq in late '02, but, after seven years of constant train wreck, I've come to realize that the man's faculties are so dull that there's no fuck up too great for him. Even more heartening: my countrymen voted him in...twice. This singular and painful fact leads me to believe that America will continue to face tougher times ahead, because we are apparently no longer capable of recognizing impending disaster and acting constructively to avoid it. Time and time again, we choose salve over substance, and postponement over proactiveness, and, most particularly, myth over reality. But we are a nation of myth junkies. We're one of, if not the, most fundamentalist of first world nations. In a grotesque extension of Manifest Destiny, we overwhelmingly believe that we are entitled to 'lead' the rest of the world. We still believe in our own nearly absolute power, based on our singular decisive victory against Japan 60 years ago (let's face it; we played a sideline role in Europe; Russia really defeated the Axis), despite the abject failure of that power in two wars against primitive foes, the rise of China, and the fall of our own economy. In short, we're a nation of addicts: always dissatisfied, always paranoid, always needing to be in control, and never actually in control. Frankly, this fucking national neurosis is growing a bit tiresome.

Well, aren't you special. I'm not sure what exactly you're agreeing with, unless that it's cool to pontificate how other folks 'should' be making gear choices. There's no shortage of that kind of arrogance in this biz. I just don't happen to subscribe to it. The market, as indicated by the popularity of Montbell/WM, etc ultra lite offerings indicates that FF and the BLAKE METHOD are wide of the mark on this one. I just happen to agree with the market and explained why. If I were FF, I'd be taking notes. This is the kind of 'honest' feedback that companies almost never get and always need, whether they know it or not. Add to that that I happen to be a long time FF customer: I've purchased 5 of their sleeping bags and still have 4 of them. In any case, if you don't like some of the opinions on this thread, there are plenty of others you can grace with your omniscience.

I'm guessing that Halifax's aesthetic dissapproval of the technology has killed the market.

Same old shit from the same asshole What's incredible to me is that there are still morons in this country who actually still believe this fucker.

It's a good one, but it's already been posted.

I wouldn't know. I don't own any. Don't you have a pagetop you need to get back to?

skiboards.com offers Summit (w/o binding) and Hagan (binding incl.) brand backcountry skiboards.

Fawk no. The CIA hates Cheney, and vice versa. Cheney built his own ad hoc intelligence arm to trump up the evidence for the Iraq invasion. He also parasitized the military's intelligence capabilities when his buddy Rummy was in. Now, it seems that he just strains against his tire chain, a lone junk yard dog who want's a piece of something...anything.

Why listen to the CIA when you've got Cheney?

The fact that they sold out of all the ones in stock shows just how much trouble they are having competing for customers. Right... Down Sweaters, for those times when you want to pay $200 to be "almost warm"! Down/insulating jackets are primarily worn when you are at rest, and in need of some quick (usually temporary) insulation. I can never remember a single instance where I was too hot standing around in a down jacket (unzipped?), and too cold without it on. I'd love to be one of these people who (apparently) stand around at cold winter belays or frosty alpine mornings and suddenly get overheated due to a few minutes of sedentary down jacket wearing. However, in lieu of such a superhuman metabolism I'll take an insulating coat that weighs 3 ounces more and can keep someone much warmer or warm them much faster. Better a warm 'michelin-man' than a cold fashionisto. Um, FF doesn't understand the sweater market because of a) the 'dumb customer' arrogance they've revealed on this thread and b) they don't make one. They make jackets, and fine jackets at that. I've got one. Love it. Too heavy for mid summer use. Patagucci, Montbell, and Western Mountaineering all make sweaters, light jackets, jackets, and heavier jackets - the full line of customer choices, and, after all, that's what it's all about. FF doesn't. Oh, and BTW, FF is also ignoring the 1 lb down sleeping bag market segment. I've got several of their bags, but for a midsummer offering, I'll shop elsewhere. If it's cold enough to need a full jacket, I bring one. By your logic, Blake, I should bring a 2 pounder on every trip, because, hey, why not be warmer? But I'll choose a 7 ouncer, thank you, because it fits in my pack pocket when I'm climbing, and I don't need to bivvy in the damn thing. Nothing FF makes is that level of portable and compact. And I'll leave my 9 oz softshell I don't need in midsummer home, save 2 oz, and actually be warmer. Pretty illogical, I know. Of course, this isn't the BLAKE METHOD. We don't have the BLAKE METABOLISM. Frankly, my metabolism must be the opposite of yours. I've had a need for a a down sweater weight garment because my down jacket IS too warm, and bulky, and heavy, for years. No, not the BLAKE METHOD. More the Jim Nelson method, really. Carry only what you need. You're also way off base about pricing. FF stuff is significantly more expensive than, say, Montbell. I got my sweater for $112, no tax, free shipping, not $200. Only 80% cheaper, not very significant. It retails for $140 - still way cheaper. And finally, do you think city folks might want something that looks good, is really warm for the weight (but not necessarily warm enough to bivvy in), and easily fits in a purse or computer bag? Gee, ya think? Hey, FF: you're in the CLOTHING business, and, as REI figured out about a century ago, that's primarily the URBAN CLOTHING business. What your customers use the product for is their choice. I recall reading a story about how the Ben Davis pants factory down in rural Texas couldn't figure out why they were selling so many XXXL sizes. Can you say gangsta? Hello. And finally, the fact that FF or any store 'sells out' of something could say more about their poor inventory planning or pricing than anything else. Is there market expanding? Are they not addressing whole market segments when competitors have a full product line that is (as in this case?). I realize that you're not a business dude, but your argument? Come on. When a business says "We can't figure out why...", they're losing market share to someone who can. In this case, it's painfully obvious why. And Marylou's customer service comment has been echoed by friends; just this weekend, in fact. Heads up FF...if you even care, that is.

Any of hugh homos touch my scarf I'll killya.

I wear a scarf, bitches. Microfleece. Fuckin love that thing.

R HU TLKN 2 HURSLF?

I snagged a Lowe Alpine softshell for about $65 down at that discount outdoor place in PTown and it is the shiz for colder conditions. Wicks like a mofo; repels wet snow, dries quick, breaths, cuts the wind, not too hot when the sun comes out. Amazing stuff. Put that sucker on with some schoeller pants and life is good. I'm completely sold on softshell fabrics. Fuck wearing plastic bags. Maybe you just got the wrong stuff. As for Feathered Friends; sounds like they just don't understand the sweater segment of the down garment market. When shopping for one, I found that they didn't have a competitive offering, price or weight wise. Maybe someday the customers they compete for will 'smarten up', but somehow I don't think that's where the problem lies.

Must be my sense of hughmor. After all, I didn't mean to hughmiliate him.

What's your problem? Firngliders (skiboards) have been used by alpinists in Europe for many decades. They're nothing new. We just plowed up the McClellan Butte trail. Two of us had snowshoes, one had skiboards. Who do you think got down the trail faster and had more fun? You gonna drag full sized skis for a bunch of switchbacks with a questionable base? I don't think so. The skiblades also broke trail much easier in the knee deep powder. And what about winter climbing approaches? No lighter, faster way to go than skiboards. Particularly because I'm a tely skier. Ski approaches for me involve carrying my ice climbing boots. Obviously, that sucks. If the terrain calls for skis with moderate climbing, telys are fine. When it gets a bit more technical, telys are not so great. I'm looking for an alternative to snowshoes when the terrain and conditions favor a 'skiboardable' descent. These seem like the perfect solution. They'd be easy to carry on a technical climb and then use for the descent. And I'm just not going to blow shitloads of $$$ for AT gear when I prefer to tely anyway.

I don't see what the big mystery is here. I just bought a Montbell U.L. inner jacket. Why? At only 7 oz, it's lighter and warmer than even my lightest softshell, which it replaces during stable, warmer weather. It's awful nice to be able to go out with basically a couple of silk weight Ts, biking arms, and the Montbell during a nice summer high pressure. Yes, there is an 'overhead' with the fabric, but Montbell uses 800 fill down; pretty much the best you can get. It also makes a nice wind layer during the morning/eve for the conditions just mentioned. It's also a great belay jacket; so compact you can hang it on your harness. The FF garments are just a bit too bulky for that. During slightly cooler or more changeable weather, I can throw the Montbell in with my softshell, which I'm more likely to use while moving. If it gets colder still, I go with my FF down jacket, which is much warmer but weighs about a pound. Another advantage to the Montbell: if we get a REAL COLD snap, it can supplement my FF down jacket. As for why people wear these down sweaters around town, I can only guess that they, particularly women, prefer not to look like the Michelin man (as with puffier garments). In addition, these minimalist down garments are so light you can't even feel you've got it on. I suspect people find that warmth without bulk feeling appealing. The Montbell I just purchased fits like a grocery bag. Slightly too baggy in the waist and too tight in the chest. It's for utility, not fashion IMO, so I don't care that much (plus it was damn cheap on sale). It's also delicate; there are other, less pricey jackets I can beat on around town. Perhaps the Patagucci offering is stylish enough to be appealing for urban use. But frankly, who the hell can afford Patagucci?

I wouldn't give you a license to tell that joke.

Bro plow?

Why would you want to fuck yourself over like that? When the rupture comes, you can have my climbing gear.

that must be about nipple deep for ya. Damn near. I almost had to break out the Goretex manziere.

If I ever DO show up at Tiger it'll be to administer the bitch-slappin' you so deserve. You might just tie me to the top...if your riding on my back, weakling. If you're nice enough to me, though, I might just pass you on my way down without butt fucking you, but it's gonna be hard, because you and I both know you're my sweet little monkey bitch.

That's a lot more poignant than you know, my son.

Lord, I know you work in mysterious ways, but WTF?

My God is a self eating watermelon